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OT - Vaccination Benefits Who?

You'd have a point if people lived to be 150 years old.

The vast majority, over 95%, of (reported) covid deaths consists of older people (over 50, but closer to 60+).
well to be more accurate the life expectancy in the U.S. according to the U.S. Census Bureau actually ROSE 0.4 of a year IN 2020. Why? Because you are not counted in the stats until you actually die. A HUGE number of people over the age of 75 and thousands of people over the age of 85 died from COVID last year. One has to be careful how you interpret statistics.

What we're seeing now is that average age of people dying from COVID is dipping because over 98% of our population over the age of 70 is now vaccinated.
 
The vaccination industry is another casualty of this global power-grab :(
I've gotten plenty of vaccinations. Never had a problem with them.
"But you're an anti-vaxxer"
Nah, I just choose to get vaccinations that have followed the protocols put into place after the Thalidomide fiasco.



I find it interesting that none of the fear-merchants have ever asked themself how they came up with the "cure" so quickly? Actual science requires skepticism.
Skepticism and caution are great. Spreading blatantly false information is not. Some concerns are legitimate but damn I see lots of tweets posted on this board that are blatantly false exaggerations by anti-vaxxers. I just got my 3rd dose due to my health status but I returned to no mask and living life months ago. I would not have done that without a vaccination.

Your risk from having COVID is probably at least 5000X greater than any risk to you from the vaccine. My risk from having COVID is probably 100,000X greater than any risk I have from the vaccine. I wish the vaccine was better. I wish it conferred better protection against every new mutation. It isn't and it doesn't but it's the best we have right now and we need to use it as much as possible. Don't get vaccinated if you don't want to. Just make sure the stuff you repeat is truthful and not some manipulative exaggeration.
 
We are losing sight of this again. This is full on a ****in Chinese weapon, but they are never going to be held accountable. I'll never eat Chinese food agaiN!
Mmm...Chinese food good. Most Chinese people probably good. Chinese government very bad. Only blame Chinese government. Ahhhhsoooo.
 
i think you got that from university of colorado website and you mixed info. Delta positives are much higher viral load than the non mutated covid positives. ("Individuals infected with Delta also had viral loads up to 1,260 times higher than those in people infected with the original strain") .NPR shows that vaxed and unvaxed have a similar viral load. "The findings reveal that vaccinated and unvaccinated individuals exhibit similar viral loads following delta infection and that vaccine breakthrough cases have the potential to transmit infection to others."

simple google search "doctor"
I don't trust NPR but I think you are correct. VCU has a similar statement that is actually just repeating CDC sourced information. That said, the number of people who become clinically ill and shed virus is still reduced by vaccination. If we believe the widely held number that vaccine protection to Delta is between 60-70% then you're going to have that many fewer people shedding virus after exposure to Delta.

When I see statistics I am always mindful of the motives of people posting summary information. All of the people offering the shedding information are promoting mask mandates. I've yet to see the published scientific study that proves viral loads of Delta in vaccinated versus unvaccinated controls. The theory that viral loads are the same is counterintuitive.
 
well to be more accurate the life expectancy in the U.S. according to the U.S. Census Bureau actually ROSE 0.4 of a year IN 2020. Why? Because you are not counted in the stats until you actually die. A HUGE number of people over the age of 75 and thousands of people over the age of 85 died from COVID last year. One has to be careful how you interpret statistics.

What we're seeing now is that average age of people dying from COVID is dipping because over 98% of our population over the age of 70 is now vaccinated.
Curious, I could not find where it rose by 0.4...I only found articles stating it fell by 1.5 years in 2020.

Where did you find this statistic., I would love to see it and read where they got that information.

Here is what I found.

Article
 
Skepticism and caution are great. Spreading blatantly false information is not. Some concerns are legitimate but damn I see lots of tweets posted on this board that are blatantly false exaggerations by anti-vaxxers. I just got my 3rd dose due to my health status but I returned to no mask and living life months ago. I would not have done that without a vaccination.

Your risk from having COVID is probably at least 5000X greater than any risk to you from the vaccine. My risk from having COVID is probably 100,000X greater than any risk I have from the vaccine. I wish the vaccine was better. I wish it conferred better protection against every new mutation. It isn't and it doesn't but it's the best we have right now and we need to use it as much as possible. Don't get vaccinated if you don't want to. Just make sure the stuff you repeat is truthful and not some manipulative exaggeration.
if you dont want the vaccine fine. in terms of risk assessment its a bad choice but its your choice. I agree with dinglefritz about using disinformation as a way to come to terms with your decision. Searching for information from non-medical people on the internet is not a good way to justify your decision. 99% of it is inaccurate.
Just accept the fact that your are willing to take the risk yourself and risk those around you.
we know blood pressure medicine and cholesterol medicine reduce the risk of stroke and heart attacks but slightly just over 50% of the patients actually take their medicine routinely. Those aren't infectious diseases but people choose not to do what their doctor suggests every day.
they have never really figured it out. but those patients dont go around trying to confirm their decision by promoting falsehoods invented for political purposes. they just say i didn't want to.
then they live with the consequences.
 
The statement that "they sold you that the vaccine was 100% effective is a blatant lie". I did not see a single person in the media or government agencies say that the vaccine was 100% effective. The other blatant lie was the Dr. who says he had somebody end up in the hospital who said he had "20 vaccinations". I just got my booster shot this morning. It took me 2 hours, my vaccination card, my insurance card and an hour wait before they would give me my 3rd shot. I had to sign an affidavit stating that I was immunocompromised and the reason why. Nobody has gotten 20 shots.
There you go guys. @dinglefritz 's experience is universal. It never happened any other way. There's no place where they're desperately giving out shots. There's no low income places where people can say they don't have ID. (But damned if the Dems don't want you to be able to vote without an id) Whatever he says is the only way it ever happens. Even when he tells a story about a "high ranking former CIA guy" who is now coming clean to the American public.

Shoot, on March 30th the CDC director was telling us vaccinated don't carry the virus. Now you're damn near 1st in line for a booster shot. https://www.businessinsider.com/cdc-director-data-vaccinated-people-do-not-carry-covid-19-2021-3

You know, its really weird how you can claim we weren't sold anything with the vaccines or no govt or media person claimed anything, but all the following links mention the vaccines being 100% effective against death and severe illness/hospitalization.



Nat Geo wrote it in a tweet! With a link to the article above with comments from CDC people.



Then the independent wrote a tweet attributing the same thing to Fauci




Here's the University of Maryland Medical system saying it.

 
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No. This doesn’t tell me anything and it’s not interesting.
what other virus have you had where you had no symptoms. Also unvaccinated people, for whatever,reason are only harming themselves. I know as many vaccinated vs unvaccinated who have contracted the vid.
 
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Also unvaccinated people, for whatever,reason are only harming themselves.
I want to clear up this misconception.
Most unvaccinated people have already been exposed to the disease and now have natural immunity. And the rest of the unvaccinated will eventually catch the disease and develop the anti-bodies so they won't NEED to be vaccinated. The concept of herd immunity is still a foreign concept to gov't scientists for some reason. Another foreign concept to gov't scientists: personal medical decisions ... are personal. This philosophy was widely accepted when AIDs was going to kill half the planet. If C-1984 only affected gays, I can promise you this debate would be completely different. The TDS pandemic is a greater threat to your health than the C-1984 plandemic. Honest.

 
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He died, but it would have been worse if he didn't have the vaccine. So of this crap is written by 1st graders apparently.

why do you continue to post stuff from twitter and other social media accounts then act like its real medical information or experts opinions? its garbage
do you spend all day looking for anything that might make you feel better about your opinions and the only place you can find it is twitter?
 
I want to clear up this misconception.
Most unvaccinated people have already been exposed to the disease and now have natural immunity. And the rest of the unvaccinated will eventually catch the disease and develop the anti-bodies so they won't NEED to be vaccinated. The concept of herd immunity is still a foreign concept to gov't scientists for some reason. Another foreign concept to gov't scientists: personal medical decisions ... are personal. This philosophy was widely accepted when AIDs was going to kill half the planet. If C-1984 only affected gays, I can promise you this debate would be completely different. The TDS pandemic is a greater threat to your health than the C-1984 plandemic. Honest.

what do you mean by natural immunity? they can and will obviously catch it again
 
There you go guys. @dinglefritz 's experience is universal. It never happened any other way. There's no place where they're desperately giving out shots. There's no low income places where people can say they don't have ID. (But damned if the Dems don't want you to be able to vote without an id) Whatever he says is the only way it ever happens. Even when he tells a story about a "high ranking former CIA guy" who is now coming clean to the American public.

Shoot, on March 30th the CDC director was telling us vaccinated don't carry the virus. Now you're damn near 1st in line for a booster shot. https://www.businessinsider.com/cdc-director-data-vaccinated-people-do-not-carry-covid-19-2021-3

You know, its really weird how you can claim we weren't sold anything with the vaccines or no govt or media person claimed anything, but all the following links mention the vaccines being 100% effective against death and severe illness/hospitalization.



Nat Geo wrote it in a tweet! With a link to the article above with comments from CDC people.



Then the independent wrote a tweet attributing the same thing to Fauci




Here's the University of Maryland Medical system saying it.

dude you are one scared dude. i've never heard of anyone outside the movies who spends the time you must spend looking up information on the internet to try to convince people that there is a conspiracy. we're all getting the vaccine and we're going to be OK. nobody cares if the doctors have changed their story. this virus this vaccine are all a new experience and they are learning a lot as they go. thats to be expected. no one else is freaking out when fauci changes his story. we learn more as we go. a lot of medical decisions are based off expert opinions. and those opinions are subject to change. they make medicine that can help you
 
Getting the Vaccine is a choice. I never got the flu vaccine before last year because I always thought getting the flu wasn't that big of a deal for myself.

I got the flu vaccine last year and the covid vaccine this year not for myself but for the good of the community.

That's how I made my decision. After listening to members of the medical community in the media and in person (with people i know and respect), I came to realize that vaccination efforts aren't just for the individual but are for the good of the community.

I was never an anti-Vaxxer in that I wasn't gonna take a vaccine, but I never felt it was necessary to protect myself....but once someone explained that vaccines can also protect others, i was driven to get them.

But again, to each their own...but I do hope people keep an open mind to the vaccine and listen to those that they respect....because my personal opinion that the best way to help small businesses and the economy is to get the vast majority of us vaccinated so we can operate as normal....

I believe official lockdowns are essentially over, but unofficial self imposed lockdowns by individuals will hurt businesses just as much as official ones and in some cases they will hurt more because a prolonged shortage of business is probably more painful than a 100% shut off of business for a short term.
 
This is poorly thought out.

In like Jan or Feb roughly 10% of the US population had tested positive, with the vast majority surviving.

This undoubtedly included a very high amount of false positives due to how tests are conducted.

It's estimated 50-70% of the population has been infected. The vast majority with minor issues, many who didn't even know and allowed them to build bodily defenses. Antibodies, t-cells, etc.

A significant portion of the population are at effectively zero risk from the virus.

But it has been shown that there is some risk from the vaccine.

We don't have any long term data to support the safety of the vaccine and efficacy seems to be questionable and limited. It's still EUA. A few weeks ago the govt said you wouldn't need booster shots, now everyone will need booster shots.

But you think it's a good idea to force that risk on everyone. That is nonsensical.
Personally IF I would have had COVID over 6 months ago I would strongly consider getting vaccinated now. IF I had COVID recently I would not. To each his own but we're seeing younger patients hospitalized now in our area. Some of it might be because we just didn't pay attention to them when we had so many people over 50 dying before.

We've now given over 100s of millions of vaccinations worldwide. I would say that we're widely tested and there is no way in hell that getting the "wild" virus is safer than getting vaccinated. It's illogical to think that having exponentially more live virus circulating in your body with millions more viral proteins is somehow safer than a inactive protein vaccine. Yet you continue to advocate that approach. Why in God's name would there be more long term problems from this vaccine than an actual infection bearing all of the same antigens present in a natural infection that subjects you to a huge amount more of the same material PLUS the rest of the virus?
 
Personally IF I would have had COVID over 6 months ago I would strongly consider getting vaccinated now. IF I had COVID recently I would not. To each his own but we're seeing younger patients hospitalized now in our area. Some of it might be because we just didn't pay attention to them when we had so many people over 50 dying before.

We've now given over 100s of millions of vaccinations worldwide. I would say that we're widely tested and there is no way in hell that getting the "wild" virus is safer than getting vaccinated. It's illogical to think that having exponentially more live virus circulating in your body with millions more viral proteins is somehow safer than a inactive protein vaccine. Yet you continue to advocate that approach. Why in God's name would there be more long term problems from this vaccine than an actual infection bearing all of the same antigens present in a natural infection that subjects you to a huge amount more of the same material PLUS the rest of the virus?
Why do you act like everyone's risk is the same?
 
Why do you act like everyone's risk is the same?
You know full well that I have never implied or said that. What IS true though is that even if you are young, the risk from getting vaccinated is still thousands of times less than the risk from getting infected with the wild virus. Not once have I insisted that kids need to be vaccinated nor have I insisted that college athletes get vaccinated. We did encourage our 22 year old daughter to get vaccinated in part because of a family history of asthma.
 
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You know full well that I have never implied or said that. What IS true though is that even if you are young, the risk from getting vaccinated is still thousands of times less than the risk from getting infected with the wild virus. Not once have I insisted that kids need to be vaccinated nor have I insisted that college athletes get vaccinated. We did encourage our 22 year old daughter to get vaccinated in part because of a family history of asthma.
We do not and cannot possibly know that right now. We can hypothesize, but that is nowhere near proven. That will take years. I know you’re not for forced vaccinations, but you are feeding those hungry liberal bellies that are calling for it by making these false assertions.
 
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What IS true though is that even if you are young, the risk from getting vaccinated is still thousands of times less than the risk from getting infected with the wild virus.
The risk of what? You know nothing of the long term risks of this experimental gene therapy. I'm sure you have anecdotal information brother, sister neighbor, friend, coworker or whichever of your stories you use to to corroborate your opinion. going back, you always claim to have a relative or neighbor/friend tied to every topic brought up on here.
 
Friday go to chiro for a back adjustment - feels out of place.

Today back still aches, so go back. Told him last adjustment did no good. Asks me a few other questions and asks if I have gotten a Covid test. Told him I’m vaccinated - he says it doesn’t matter - might be the reason I have an ache that can’t be relieved with an adjustment.

Guess what - got the Rona. Literally no symptoms likely due to my vaccination. Good for me - but what about all the folks I have possibly infected because I didn’t feel sick? Working on a call list right now.

So the vaccination benefitted me by making my symptoms barely noticeable while I went about normal life. But how is this helping stop the spread of Covid?
You can't stop asymptomatic spread. That's why 75% of the country is either vaccinated or has had it. Maybe though, you might have had a false positive.
 
The risk of what? You know nothing of the long term risks of this experimental gene therapy. I'm sure you have anecdotal information brother, sister neighbor, friend, coworker or whichever of your stories you use to to corroborate your opinion. going back, you always claim to have a relative or neighbor/friend tied to every topic brought up on here.
you dont know the long term risks of anything in this world. how do you even leave your house in the morning?
there are almost no long term studies about anything in this world. But that has never stopped you from getting up and doing and eating things all day that you have no idea what will do to your body over the long term. why do you require long term data for this one thing?
have you ever taken an aspirin or ibuprofen? Most physicians think it could never be approved by the FDA in todays world.
do you hesitate to take it?
 
It’s great that president biden is already squashing this surge by allowing a booster.
We need to be triple-masked and locked into our homes until a vaccination for the
epsilon
beta
lambda
delta
gamma
bida
obama
kamala
fauca
and omega versions of the virus have a cure. If it takes until 2050, we'll just have to adapt. 900 quadrillion billion stimulus dollars should keep everything hunky dory. Oh, and elections will have to be suspended until we have the cure for every variant.
 
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We need to be triple-masked and locked into our homes until a vaccination for the
epsilon
beta
lambda
delta
gamma
bida
obama
fauca
and omega versions of the virus have a cure. If it takes until 2050, we'll just have to adapt. 900 quadrillion billion stimulus dollars should keep everything hunky dory. Oh, and elections will have to be suspended until we have the cure for every variant.
But keep up the 10 servings of carbs everyday while you get no physical activity.
 
But keep up the 10 servings of carbs everyday while you get no physical activity.


It'll be a new paradise. Remember that Universal income for non-working Americans? Now we all get to live like kings with 12,000/yr from China's, err, uhh, I mean, our government. I will be voting democrat for the rest of my life as a thank you for delivering on their promise where no one will ever have to work again.

 
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Friday go to chiro for a back adjustment - feels out of place.

Today back still aches, so go back. Told him last adjustment did no good. Asks me a few other questions and asks if I have gotten a Covid test. Told him I’m vaccinated - he says it doesn’t matter - might be the reason I have an ache that can’t be relieved with an adjustment.

Guess what - got the Rona. Literally no symptoms likely due to my vaccination. Good for me - but what about all the folks I have possibly infected because I didn’t feel sick? Working on a call list right now.

So the vaccination benefitted me by making my symptoms barely noticeable while I went about normal life. But how is this helping stop the spread of Covid?
It doesn’t unless you get enough people vaccinated to reach heard immunity based on the infection rate of the said virus.

All vaccines work this way. Reason you never hear these stories about things like mumps and polio is because 99.999 percent of the population is vaccinated. The few people that could get it in that senario don’t because the virus never gets any legs.
 



I remember how we masked up, locked people in their homes, destroyed the economy and created vaccine passports during these flu pandemics. Thank goodness we're smarter than our parents. Smart enough to not use the 25th amendment on a tyrant clearly in the grip of dementia, smart enough to balkanize society, pay our enemies to create a gain-of-function virus and release it on us and destroy the self-governing mechanisms needed for liberty.
 
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Curious, I could not find where it rose by 0.4...I only found articles stating it fell by 1.5 years in 2020.

Where did you find this statistic., I would love to see it and read where they got that information.

Here is what I found.

Article
U.S. Census bureau statistics page. EDIT: Upon further digging, the CDC does in fact show a dramatic drop in life expectancy in 2020. Now I can't find the U.S. Census Bureau page that I saw a rise on. Apparently all of the COVID, suicide and overdose deaths of young people in 2020 lowered our life expectancy even given how many 80 year old plus people died from COVID. :oops:
 
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The risk of what? You know nothing of the long term risks of this experimental gene therapy. I'm sure you have anecdotal information brother, sister neighbor, friend, coworker or whichever of your stories you use to to corroborate your opinion. going back, you always claim to have a relative or neighbor/friend tied to every topic brought up on here.
it isn't any gene therapy any more than taking a tetanus vaccination. I'm old. I have had lots of opportunities to make friends in many professional circles from coast to coast. I've had a friend head up a large public health agency and my spouse is on the front line caring for critically ill COVID patients. I have friends and family who teach at medical schools. I had 7 siblings and my wife's family has 6 and most of them are married and are healthcare professionals. You can choose to ignore my experience and professional judgement if you choose. I just share what we're seeing "on the ground" in northeast Nebraska.
 
Fauci

"We just need you to shelter in place for 2 weeks to flatten the curve. After that everything is back to normal."
ok

"Okay we need you at home for a while longer and could you socially distance as well."
ok

"For safety sake we need you to mask-up, socially distance and stay at home a couple more months, then everything is back to normal ... promise."
ok

"It is your patriotic duty to stay at home a while longer, quit working, socially distance, wear 3 masks, and inject yourself with a DNA-altering chemical. But you can trust us because we have never lied to you. As long as you understand that repeatedly breaking promises isn't a lie."
ok

"The planet is dying from these variants. We don't have vaccines for all of them. The lockdowns will stay in place to prove our love for you. You'll need to keep doing the other things as well until we say it is safe to return to the life you had."

Can you tell us when that might be?

"You know perfectly well questions like that are illegal."


 
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