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This is unbelievable...

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Dobson should be ashamed of himself. Not allowing players to get stronger? Are you kidding me? At Nebraska of all places, the birthplace of strength and conditioning in college football. Thank God The Pelini Bros. Flying Circus has left town.
 
Hoosker Du said:
I don't think it's complete lunacy. Concerns over injuries is a valid concern, and bumping up the weight substantially over what they were normally lifting probably wouldn't be a great idea either.
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Who said anything about bumping up the weight substantially? If they wanted to more than the card said they weren't allowed. But now they are able to listen to their bodies. If they're feeling good lift more. Simple as that.

I think the issue is there was a cap put on what they could lift. How are you gonna get stronger if there's a ceiling to what you can lift?
 
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I don't really see the old method as necessarily wrong either.. their was probably a tested formula that they put guy's numbers into and it could have churned out the weight, reps, sets, etc.

I do however think the new Phillip guy has brought a great attitude to the team and that sort of thing is contagious, so overall, we should be better in this department.
 
The previous way is a good plan for guys over 50 not too get injured and still look good. New way is a good way to " shock and awe "; an opponent
 
I can understand the old method if the player is trying to lose weight and is in a caloric deficit. You get weaker when cutting calories and injuries from over lifting or lifting too heavy can be more likely to happen. However, if the player is trying to get stronger and build muscle, he needs to be lifting heavier and consuming more calories. I'm not sure what their routine was during the season, but in the off season, that's when you should be working on putting on muscle mass and preparing for the rigors of both practice and games and thus trying to lift more.
 
Hoosker Du said:
I don't think it's complete lunacy. Concerns over injuries is a valid concern, and bumping up the weight substantially over what they were normally lifting probably wouldn't be a great idea either.
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The bad part about that is they can then get trucked on the field.
 
It was a long time ago, at least to me. Boyd Epley came to our high school and spoke to all the athletes/coaches about S&C. We adopted Epley's program at our school.

From what I remember, we would only lift for max a couple times per year. The rest of the time, it was all percentage based, more or less from a "card" following Epley's method. It was a very rigid system (x pounds, x reps, x rest), you didn't stray from the "card". Was Dobson's method bad, well if the players don't believe in it and don't give their best, then I would say yes.

"Explosive Power" was the lingo. It's not about getting big, it's about getting stronger. I personally like the new approach to S&C from what I've read.
 
timnsun said:
Who said anything about bumping up the weight substantially? If they wanted to more than the card said they weren't allowed. But now they are able to listen to their bodies. If they're feeling good lift more. Simple as that.

I think the issue is there was a cap put on what they could lift. How are you gonna get stronger if there's a ceiling to what you can lift?
Click to expand...

We're talking 18-22 year old kids. We know they would max every other day if they could. I can't imagine that Dobson didn't have a plan for players to progress, as in increasing those numbers on the card each week. If the new program benefits us on the field, that's great, but just like anything else, I have to see before I believe.

Wasn't the bigger issue in the last regime accountability, in that players were skipping workouts? And if I recall correctly, a fair number were skipping.
 
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Hoosker Du said:
We're talking 18-22 year old kids. We know they would max every other day if they could. If the new program benefits us on the field, that's great, but just like anything else, I have to see before I believe.
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I'm not a weightlifter and never followed a weight training program, so I don't know much.

All I am going on is the article quoted, which showed surprise from team members about the amount of weight they were limited to when it came to lifting. I understand that these are kids and will do the most they can... That's why Phillips is there, to make sure they don't overdo it.

It makes me wonder what other programs are doing, how they approach weight training. Are we doing something other programs don't do? Or was that the case under Pelini? Would be interesting to hear what others are doing...
 
timnsun said:
I'm not a weightlifter and never followed a weight training program, so I don't know much.

All I am going on is the article quoted, which showed surprise from team members about the amount of weight they were limited to when it came to lifting. I understand that these are kids and will do the most they can... That's why Phillips is there, to make sure they don't overdo it.

It makes me wonder what other programs are doing, how they approach weight training. Are we doing something other programs don't do? Or was that the case under Pelini? Would be interesting to hear what others are doing...
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I edited my post up above. I just can't imagine any college training staff in 2014 not having a progression chart on each player, meaning they would increase those numbers on the cards each week, etc. I would think that would be called into question pretty quickly if not. But I suppose stranger things have happened.

Weren't there a fair number of reports of players skipping workouts under the last regime? It seems to me that was the bigger issue. Regardless, I'm hopeful to see an increase in size and speed this year. Riley's teams had to have played 'fast' to beat some of the teams that they've beaten while at OSU.
 
The cards are probably reasonable if the S&C coach is on top of the numbers and making sure individual guys progress. I suspect it more a target by position approach - which leaves improvements on the table. So yes - a flawed process.
 
"In our former defense I had to spend a lot of time on focusing on slowing down and holding myself back and kind of pulling back,” Gangwish said. “Partially, some of my technique was as close to perfect as possible and partially so that I didn’t make a mistake in the decision making process that was involved. Whereas now, that really isn’t a factor, you have one job and you just have to go do it really hard.”

I almost don't have any words for this.

Regardless, it's clear that the new S&C coach is affecting the psyche of our players in a very positive manner, and the benefit of that should translate to the field on Saturdays.
 
NikkiSixx said:
I don't really see the old method as necessarily wrong either.. their was probably a tested formula that they put guy's numbers into and it could have churned out the weight, reps, sets, etc.

I do however think the new Phillip guy has brought a great attitude to the team and that sort of thing is contagious, so overall, we should be better in this department.
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The old method led to the team repeatedly getting manhandled by quality competition....thus it was wrong. Melvin Gordon ran for like a gazillion yards against that strength training method.
 
Hoosker Du said:
We're talking 18-22 year old kids. We know they would max every other day if they could. I can't imagine that Dobson didn't have a plan for players to progress, as in increasing those numbers on the card each week. If the new program benefits us on the field, that's great, but just like anything else, I have to see before I believe.

Wasn't the bigger issue in the last regime accountability, in that players were skipping workouts? And if I recall correctly, a fair number were skipping.
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You are correct. There was zero accountability (and the strength staff had no way to enforce things because Dobson was often absent and the guys doing the actual work with the players did not have any support to make players accountable.
 
nebcountry said:
It was a long time ago, at least to me. Boyd Epley came to our high school and spoke to all the athletes/coaches about S&C. We adopted Epley's program at our school.

From what I remember, we would only lift for max a couple times per year. The rest of the time, it was all percentage based, more or less from a "card" following Epley's method. It was a very rigid system (x pounds, x reps, x rest), you didn't stray from the "card". Was Dobson's method bad, well if the players don't believe in it and don't give their best, then I would say yes.

"Explosive Power" was the lingo. It's not about getting big, it's about getting stronger. I personally like the new approach to S&C from what I've read.
Click to expand...
Yep...The BFS lifting cards! Find your max...break it down into 8-5-3 reps, 10-10-10 reps and there was a 5-5-5 day too, I think. Super popular and you followed the card, period. It was Boyd's baby and everyone seemed to use it. You maxed out at the start...you maxed at the end, that was it. Heck some of the days you were done with your lifts in 20 minutes
 
Hoosker Du said:
We're talking 18-22 year old kids. We know they would max every other day if they could. I can't imagine that Dobson didn't have a plan for players to progress, as in increasing those numbers on the card each week. If the new program benefits us on the field, that's great, but just like anything else, I have to see before I believe.

Wasn't the bigger issue in the last regime accountability, in that players were skipping workouts? And if I recall correctly, a fair number were skipping.
Click to expand...

Here's a sample I found for the Huskers summer S&C program (note it's a PDF and I would bet it's old). NU can't require athletes to participate, the NCAA wants it to be purely voluntary. I would have to search the web to be sure (I have other things I need to do atm), but I'm pretty sure the S&C coach is limited to overseeing in the broadest sense to limit injury only. So NEITHER Dobson NOR Phillip can "turn somebody in" for not participating.

Now, I like what Coach Mark Phillip is doing. Bringing energy into the program, and Olympic style lifts. It would be great if every single player participated, I could see great participation under Phillip. I understand the old program (at least Epley's version). It's supposed to build STRENGTH, not mass.
 
DeevDan said:
@WHCSC I can't tell if you were being facetious or not but that video was pathetic. The kid barely did any work on that rep
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Sarcasm. I can't believe a D1 strength coach allowed that. That kid could have been really hurt.
 
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WHCSC said:
Sarcasm. I can't believe a D1 strength coach allowed that. That kid could have been really hurt.
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Yeah no disrespect to the kid but he was way too flabby to be handling that kind of weight. I think I saw 4 plates and absolutely no control while he basically just drops it on his stomach and then uses his gut, back, and friend to pull it up
 
I am aware of articles that say with Boyd back and our new state of the art S+C research facility; we are probably again near the head of the pack. We are or will be using equipment that records all effort in a set; even if you slough on any part of any individual rep you get caught - and this is recorded and researched. A lineman was just quoted elsewhere, that he put on about 18 pounds and has never been faster or so strong; our assumed starting rb says bigger and stronger and has never been so light on his feet. >>>>
 
dockentwo said:
I am aware of articles that say with Boyd back and our new state of the art S+C research facility; we are probably again near the head of the pack. We are or will be using equipment that records all effort in a set; even if you slough on any part of any individual rep you get caught - and this is recorded and researched. A lineman was just quoted elsewhere, that he put on about 18 pounds and has never been faster or so strong; our assumed starting rb says bigger and stronger and has never been so light on his feet. >>>>
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Not trying to be a jerk, but I will believe when I see it.
 
I read that article yesterday and it explains a lot about the S&C program over the last few years, complete crap. Dobson literally handicapped strength growth of these kids. Strength training needs flexibility, especially on-the-fly flexibility. Strength changes day-to-day, week-to-week, and month-to-month. What you lift one day you might struggle with the next week or blow through it. If you're able to get 300 for 5 and card says 275 x 5, there is absolutely no need to handicap that strength growth, there are so many wasted reps and workouts this way.
 
Suvey101885 said:
Not trying to be a jerk, but I will believe when I see it.
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After the Coach Solich episode; we heard about player noncompliance and other negatives - new coaches were going to fix it all = same stories after next two coaches : who can blame you; appreciate you were reserved in your comment. ..... I guess I am trying to hold out hope for two reasons / maybe three
* The strength and conditioning research faction; is more of a third party / should add accountability
** I think the drive of this AD is under appreciated : they will call people on the carpet in the background
*** Maybe this strength coach is for real: and I and others like the changes he is making in workouts, ring true
 
Nebraska was very good at the end of close games under Dobson's watch. I have a hard time believing that happens if we're rolling out a team that isn't doing well in the S&C department.
 
puddinhead0404 said:
Nebraska was very good at the end of close games under Dobson's watch. I have a hard time believing that happens if we're rolling out a team that isn't doing well in the S&C department.
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I can think of several points to strengthen your argument ( ahem). We also jumped up on some people before getting outcoachedx / ask Georgia and So Cal if we were tough. ... Wasn't part of the riff with Bo and AD ; rumored BO not going to use all the new S+C changes and research? So fine we were good and our guys have a lot of heart - but if you bounce around the net - multiple players saying its better and they are getting stronger and faster ..so we may see it soon.
 
nebcountry said:
It was a long time ago, at least to me. Boyd Epley came to our high school and spoke to all the athletes/coaches about S&C. We adopted Epley's program at our school.

From what I remember, we would only lift for max a couple times per year. The rest of the time, it was all percentage based, more or less from a "card" following Epley's method. It was a very rigid system (x pounds, x reps, x rest), you didn't stray from the "card". Was Dobson's method bad, well if the players don't believe in it and don't give their best, then I would say yes.

"Explosive Power" was the lingo. It's not about getting big, it's about getting stronger. I personally like the new approach to S&C from what I've read.
Click to expand...

Bingo, they also don't want players going for max lifts regularly and risking injuries which has happened in the past. You can get stronger progressively by increasing sets and reps with less risk of injury. The card will add weight per a schedule. Flexibility is good as long as no starter like Lewis sustains a major injury going too heavy.

Epley didn't seem to care for D. Kennedy's philosophy, but I heard him comment years back about Dobson and he said something like he's got NU going in the right direction again. Our problem is that every opponent takes lifting just as seriously now.
 
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