Why was Frost successful at UCF?
- Thread starter moralvictories
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McKenzie Milton.
#Gamechanger!!!
They also had speed at the RB and WR position at the same time. If only we would’ve had another Toure and a stud RB at the same time. Plus a better QB.
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just thinking outside the box here, but did he have more talent than any team he played in 2017 with the exception of Auburn? That's a 1 game over achievement setting a trend of future dominance in the BIG. Frost was able to harness and develop that talent in just 1 year! I expect Frost to repeat his UCF 2017 performance this year!
It's not difficult to recruit to Central Florida in relation to the rest of their conference. McKenzie Milton was special. Regardless of coach, that team should never win fewer than nine games a year.
One thought I have had related to this is that Scott was able to coach looser with less pressure and expectations. He was able to have a wide open game plan and coach to win. Maybe it is a combination of being both a former player and a born and raised Nebraskan that he puts more pressure on himself coaching here. He coaches to stay in games to have a chance to win as opposed to coaching to take chances to take over and dominate a game. Game gets close or momentum starts slipping away the offense goes in a shell and defaults back to sideline swing passes. At UCF his offense kept attacking.
Someone else built that 2017 UCF team. Just like someone else built the Stanford team that Harbaugh inherited. Just like Callahan built the team that Pelini inherited. If Cally would've stayed, he'd also had Gabbert and most likely have beaten Texas. Some people just know how to recruit. Others know when to step in.
he went 19-7 at UCF
lots of coaches do that in a couple years at the G5 level
had he not gone 13-0, he might well still be there
lots of coaches do that in a couple years at the G5 level
had he not gone 13-0, he might well still be there
for the same reasons hell be successful here.....trust FROST
GBR
GBR
I was looking at the 2005-2008 incoming freshmen when Guinta was in charge of recruiting. I predict if he is here for a few years, NU will begin to really collar some talent.
His first year for Callahan (2005), among others, NU signed M. Lucky, J. O'Hallaran, P. Dillard, M. Slauson, N. Suh, B. Turner. It's fair to say those were all very good, and in Suh's case, great college players.
In 2006, NU signed Thenarse, McNeill, P. Allen among others.
In 2007, NU signed R. Helu, Q. Castille, Prince A., N. Paul, E. Hagg, A. Henery, J. Crick.
In 2008, NU signed P. Dennard, K. Reed, W. Compton, B. Steinkuhler, C. Meredith, B. Maher.
Looks like this guy was a really good hire. Seems he can identify them, and hopefully Mickey and the others can get them to join the U.
He had a great QB and a team full of Florida speedsters playing in a conference with the likes of East Carolina, Temple, Tulsa, Tulane, etc. He doesn't have that same talent advantage in the Big Ten.
Well, my "theory" is based on watching some of his UCF film. It was interesting watching his UCF teams and when there was talk about him coming here, I watched things much closer. It has been a while so I am going by old persons memory here. The UCF D was never much to brag about, he did have some solid players but basically they just had to slow teams down on D so the UCF O could outscore other teams. The D gave up 25.2 points a game which was close to the middle of the pack in the league.
Those above who mentioned Milton were dead on. He was responsible for 45 TD's, 4,650 total yards and yards per play of 9.3 just to mention a few.
Then throw in another difference maker, Mike Hughes was a huge difference as well on special teams. He had 233 punt return yards and averaged 16.6 yards per return.
So, to be clear, Frost had some studs at key positions.
However, as I watched his O I was continually amazed at how his teams consistently took advantage of teams by putting the D in conflict and the opposition wasn't good enough to over come that. It was surprising to me how many plays broke wide open with very few major blocks. The LB or DBs or both just took really bad angles or made bad reads. In other words, it wasn't like they just mowed teams down with consistent man o man play. A lot of big plays and the opposing teams quickly found themselves playing catchup and doing what they didn't necessarily want or could do on O. Milton was a master had seeing where he had an advantage.
My "theory" is that once Frost came to the B1G he quickly found out that there was a much higher level of athlete and better coached so he couldn't get the easy scores with his O. What worked before didn't fly against the better D's of the league. If you stop and think about it, if a team had a pulse on D the last few years, we struggled and sometimes mightily. I believe it was the Memphis game where UCF scored several quick TDs and there were plays where hardly anyone on D was blocked well, but were caught looking the wrong way and taking bad steps and a fast RB and opportunistic QB feasted.
The B1G is just not a forgiving league with the upper end of teams having very good defenses and even the average teams have the ability to not get caught with their eyes in the wrong places. So now it comes down to actually blocking and executing and we simply have stunk at that on a consistent basis.
Eventually, I believe, Frost had to come to grips with where his teams could not compete and make the changes in staff. He has gone through 2 O coordinators for a reason. Is it any wonder? I wouldn't be surprised if he came to this conclusion that he didn't have the right coaches on the right seat of the right bus a long time ago but kept thinking getting some better athletes i.e. O line, WR and a little better coaching would cure the ills but it didn't.
So that is my theory. He did have some very good players especially for the league he was in.
Stats
Those above who mentioned Milton were dead on. He was responsible for 45 TD's, 4,650 total yards and yards per play of 9.3 just to mention a few.
Then throw in another difference maker, Mike Hughes was a huge difference as well on special teams. He had 233 punt return yards and averaged 16.6 yards per return.
So, to be clear, Frost had some studs at key positions.
However, as I watched his O I was continually amazed at how his teams consistently took advantage of teams by putting the D in conflict and the opposition wasn't good enough to over come that. It was surprising to me how many plays broke wide open with very few major blocks. The LB or DBs or both just took really bad angles or made bad reads. In other words, it wasn't like they just mowed teams down with consistent man o man play. A lot of big plays and the opposing teams quickly found themselves playing catchup and doing what they didn't necessarily want or could do on O. Milton was a master had seeing where he had an advantage.
My "theory" is that once Frost came to the B1G he quickly found out that there was a much higher level of athlete and better coached so he couldn't get the easy scores with his O. What worked before didn't fly against the better D's of the league. If you stop and think about it, if a team had a pulse on D the last few years, we struggled and sometimes mightily. I believe it was the Memphis game where UCF scored several quick TDs and there were plays where hardly anyone on D was blocked well, but were caught looking the wrong way and taking bad steps and a fast RB and opportunistic QB feasted.
The B1G is just not a forgiving league with the upper end of teams having very good defenses and even the average teams have the ability to not get caught with their eyes in the wrong places. So now it comes down to actually blocking and executing and we simply have stunk at that on a consistent basis.
Eventually, I believe, Frost had to come to grips with where his teams could not compete and make the changes in staff. He has gone through 2 O coordinators for a reason. Is it any wonder? I wouldn't be surprised if he came to this conclusion that he didn't have the right coaches on the right seat of the right bus a long time ago but kept thinking getting some better athletes i.e. O line, WR and a little better coaching would cure the ills but it didn't.
So that is my theory. He did have some very good players especially for the league he was in.
Stats
They didn't play anyone except Auburn at the very end for a bowl game that wasn't important.
| DATE | OPPONENT | RESULT | W-L (CONF) | HI PASS | HI RUSH | HI REC |
| Fri, Sep 1 | vs Florida Intl | W61-17 | 1-0 (0-0) | Milton 360 | Hamilton 56 | Snelson 98 |
| Sat, Sep 9 | vs Memphis | CANCELED | ||||
| Sun, Sep 17 | vs Georgia Tech | CANCELED | ||||
| Sun, Sep 24 | @ Maryland | W38-10 | 2-0 (0-0) | Milton 178 | Milton 94 | Akins 57 |
| Sun, Oct 1 | vs Maine | CANCELED | ||||
| Sun, Oct 1 | vsMemphis | W40-13 | 3-0 (1-0) | Milton 253 | Killins 115 | Smith 71 |
| Sun, Oct 8 | @ Cincinnati | W51-23 | 4-0 (2-0) | Milton 374 | Killins 47 | Smith 165 |
| Sun, Oct 15 | vs East Carolina | W63-21 | 5-0 (3-0) | Milton 324 | McCrae 67 | Smith 93 |
| Sun, Oct 22 | @ Navy | W31-21 | 6-0 (4-0) | Milton 233 | Killins 122 | Snelson 72 |
| Sun, Oct 29 | vs Austin Peay | W73-33 | 7-0 (4-0) | Milton 275 | Vedral 37 | Snelson 90 |
| Sun, Nov 5 | @ SMU | W31-24 | 8-0 (5-0) | Milton 412 | Killins 145 | Smith 141 |
| Sun, Nov 12 | vs UConn | W49-24 | 9-0 (6-0) | Milton 311 | Anderson 84 | Smith 120 |
| Sun, Nov 19 | @ Temple | W45-19 | 10-0 (7-0) | Milton 208 | Anderson 58 | Smith 89 |
| Sat, Nov 25 | vs South Florida | W49-42 | 11-0 (8-0) | Milton 373 | Killins 82 | Snelson 81 |
| Sun, Dec 3 | vs20 Memphis | W62-55 2OT | 12-0 (8-0) | Milton 494 | Anderson 113 | Smith 161 |
| DATE | OPPONENT | RESULT | W-L (CONF) | HI PASS | HI RUSH | HI REC |
| CHICK-FIL-A PEACH BOWL | ||||||
| Tue, Jan 2 | vs 7 Auburn * | W34-27 | 13-0 (8-0) | Milton 242 | Milton 116 | Smith 89 |
Hope so…still we will be near or below the overall talent level of most of our conference opponents.
Harbaugh built stanford. He inherited a 1-11 team and it took him several years to get it up going. He brought in andrew luck and that is really when things began to turn. As for callahan. Good recruiter yes, but I highly doubt he ever would have had 7 straight 9 win seasons like pelini did. The wheels were pretty much off in 07. He just couldnt coach in college.
Let's see the AAC is nothing like the BIG or the SEC for that matter and that game against Auburn I believe was an anomaly. You have Auburn play UCF five times and UCF wins maybe once and that's what happened. You build teams in the AAC with speed and of course the BIG has that but they have power teams which wears on opponent's.
The AAC is way easier to build teams to contend for titles than most other conferences, the fertile recruiting grounds of the south help build these speed teams in the AAC. I believe Frost not only fooled himself but us as well thinking he could use the same model he used at UCF here at Nebraska and contend for titles in the BIG. Success is measured over time, not with one season.
The AAC is way easier to build teams to contend for titles than most other conferences, the fertile recruiting grounds of the south help build these speed teams in the AAC. I believe Frost not only fooled himself but us as well thinking he could use the same model he used at UCF here at Nebraska and contend for titles in the BIG. Success is measured over time, not with one season.
I agree with everything except your Callahan analogy. I feel he would have done quite well in the BIG but his biggest downfall was his hiring of some assistants that were very head scratching. Callahan knew how to build a team to contend and knew who to recruit he just wasn't in tune with the Nebraska culture and that was also a roadblock for him.
Callahan is a solid coach and one who could have done great things here at Nebraska if he would have worked and tried to understand what the Nebraska culture was all about.
Shhh or all 4 of them will camp out on our board again.
Agree to disagree. Pelini was a 9 win coach. That used to be the minimum when we played only 11 regular games a season and no CCG. After Cally's recruits were gone I had no hope that Pelini would ever win the conference. Callahan gave me plenty of hope. He just needed a better DC. But that is just excuses.
As far as the OP, look at the front 7 in the G5 vs P5 teams. Thats where these gimmicky offenses get stopped. Much faster LBs in the B1G and much bigger, stronger faster DL in the B1G. That along with much better overall coaching staffs in P5.
As far as Callahan, the guy is a great offensive mind and had some great recruiters but not a good Head Coach. He didnt give 2 shits about the defensive side of the ball. Didnt seem to want anything to do with it. So he didnt care how horrible of a DC his buddy was.
As far as Callahan, the guy is a great offensive mind and had some great recruiters but not a good Head Coach. He didnt give 2 shits about the defensive side of the ball. Didnt seem to want anything to do with it. So he didnt care how horrible of a DC his buddy was.
Callahan likely could have had the same success or even better than Pelini if he hired a good defensive coordinator. I wouldn't say the wheels were completely off in 2007, Nebraska played a brutal schedule that year, perhaps he should have been given a chance to make some adjustments on his staff like Frost has been given.
He had a team fully buy-in, when 30-50 talented kids redefine working their asses off both mentally and physically the team wins. There’s not a special sauce, it’s just hard to get the chips to fall that way. The coaches that figure out how to force the chips to fall that way are named Urban Meyer and Nick Saban
I agree with this and will state the obvious:
Bill Callahan was the best coach we’ve hired since TO retired, and it’s not particularly close
I would say the best offensively minded coach. Defense, not so much which turned out to be his downfall. He needed to bring in some good defensive minds and I think he would have done just fine.
I liked Bill. Would’ve liked him better if Cosgrove and Phil Elmasion (SP?) weren’t on his staff.
Best offensively minded coach AND best recruiting minded coach.
SPEED.
Flat out SPEED.
Can't get to the edge with a speed demanding offense, you are dead.
SPEED. SPEED. SPEED.
Flat out SPEED.
Can't get to the edge with a speed demanding offense, you are dead.
SPEED. SPEED. SPEED.
despite the very common chorus sung by 13 loser B1G member schools' fans, this approach works in the B1G, as well
All the focus is on speed at WR - RB
When the opposing teams LBs - DEs and safeties can run with your RBs and WRs you are in deep trouble
need LB-DE speed
Good analysis, but bad if SF didnt realize that the B10 had more talent than the AAC. I mean that means SF is just not a very good coach. I mean thats a no brainer right there the B10 having much more overall talent than the AAC.
You were on to something, in that SF had more talent than the rest of the teams and had a stud in Milton..
But one of the things you forgot to mention os that when you watched UCF, they were not exactly a well oiled machine..and they were prone to being a little sloppy and made mistakes and got unforced penalties. Now, it didnt really hurt them very much because they had A. More talent than the other t eams and B. they had the ultimate "sin eater" in Milton at QB. I saw them after a sloppy play where they lost yards, or had a penalty and it was 3rd and long and Milton would just easily convert even a broken play, or run for the 1st down, or toss a 20 yard pass to a wide open guy. I mean it was like clock work. So the scores wouldnt indicate that SF's teams had many problems, but you could "see" problems when you watched every play.
Now SFS's NU teams have continued to be on the more sloppy side of things like his UCF teams were, but with talent being much more equal or even tilted towards the other teams...it has not boded well for NU to win games. Those 3rd down and 7's after a sloppy penalty going up against better more talented team defenses are not converted at nearly the same rate, and AM was never as good of a "sin eater" as Milton was at UCF to make as many of those plays. SF can replace however many assistants he wants, but until the culture of sloppiness is cured, then he is going to struggle to win games at NU, and if he continues to let phases of the game like say special teams, just go unchecked or unfixed for whole seasons..(which is frankly inexcusable) he gonna have a one and done at NU next year.
I agree with your take on the D, UCFs D jumped 20 spots when Chin left, and that was with losing two absolute studs on Defense and their D got 20 spots better after Chin was gone. I think our D is gonna take a significant step back this year Cuz we dont have the D line hoss and we saw how it hurt us in the Iowa and Wisky games last year...
So that means the O needs to take a pretty big step forward to compensate for the D taking a step or step and a half back..and now this year teams are not gonna look at NU's record and sleep walk through the 1st half of games like the admitted they did last year...
I just dont see an SF coached team being that successful and mainly because of the sloppy culture and lack of attention to detail that his teams even at UCF have shown as a HC...assistant coaches may help a little, but those are just band aids on an other wise gaping wound... IMHO>
Hard to agree with this when the results were so bad under callahan. A lot of love for callahan in this thread. Im not seeing some big turnaround after the 07 season like some here seem to think would have happened. If he was a competent college coach the results would have been better
But he didnt and your could say the same about a lot of coaches. Hiring good coaches is as big a part of the job as recruiting great players. I dont see the guy who barely beat ball state and got blown out repeatedly finding success, but we'll never know
I didn't say "college coach", I said coach.
every coach since TO, aside from Callahan, is out of football entirely as we speak.
frank and bo's football relevance died the second they left Lincoln. Bill, however, hasn't been out of work or favor for more than a month since his ouster.
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