(Very OT) Baby Vaccinations

Nov 14, 2005
2,207
791
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Re: The law acknowledges that there are risks involved with vaccines


A large portion of that 2.6 billion has gone to unsuccessful claimants as attorneys fees. Even if the special master finds that there is no connection between the alleged injury and the vaccine, the unsuccessful claimant will get his/her attorneys fees paid out of the fund, unless the special master determines that the claim was a complete scam. I was peripherally involved in a case where there was no evidence connecting the vaccine and the woman's very real Guillen-Barre (sp) Syndrome, and so the claim was properly denied. Yet she received over $46,000 in attorneys fees from he fund. So the 2.6 billion number is very misleading.
 

huskerbux

Recruiting Coordinator
Aug 24, 2006
6,515
539
113
Omaha
Originally posted by mothmonsterman:


Originally posted by goody1986:
There is literally no reputable research that establishes that vaccines are harmful. Zero. Don't get swindled by folks in tin hats worried about government intrusion into, you know, the health of the public. The discussion is purely political and does not exist among actual scientists. You are a fool to not vaccinate your children for the harm it may cause to them and others.
While there are some anti-government people who don't like vaccines, the large majority of anti-vaxxers don't have a problem with the government, they're more opposed to the "the evuhhl corporashunzzzzz!!!1!!!!!1!!ELEVEN!!!" I am an anarchist, so no one hates and distrusts the government more than I do, but you'd better believe that my son will get his shots on the regular schedule. As for the OP's question, please for the love of all that's good, get your kids vaccinated. It's safer for your child, it's safer for my child and it's safer for everyone else's child. Anti-vaxxers are smelly hippies for the most part, don't be a smelly hippy.
I agree with your request to have kids vaccinated. Can't beleive this is an issue. I did read a report that its not all hippies though. The report talked about how its not low-income either (medicare takes care of those).

Over 50% of a Beverly Hills neighborhood had registered their kids at a preschool and claimed no vaccines and it was even higher in a Santa Monica neighborhood. So its the rich idiots that listen to the Jenny McCarthey's of the world and choose to put everyone else's kids in danger.
 

TheBeav815

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
Feb 19, 2007
18,219
7,374
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Chicago Suburbs
Originally posted by TarheelHuskerFan:
I've heard so many bad things on both sides and have no idea what to do. What are your opinions? What experience have you guys had with this?

Thanks
Tarheel, as a father, a person with a degree in the study and care of human beings & practice reading studies, and somebody who grew up in a medical family, let me promise you one thing:

Only one side of the "debate" actually has any facts to it.

The other side takes junk imitations of science and utterly minuscule blips of bad data and tries to pass them off as reality in order to scare the sh*t out of people.

It's not a debate. Not any more than it's a debate whether Alabama or Eastern Michigan is more likely to win the CFB playoff next year.

Find a pediatrician who will be sweet to your child and firm with parents. I love our doctor to death, my daughter's mom would have LOVED to get terrified and overreact to a jillion things when my daughter was little and the doctor always gave us a fair, honest opinion and didn't pick sides.

TBH if I had an infant who was too small for shots right now, I'd try to find a doc who refuses to see parents who won't vaccinate. There was a measles outbreak about 15 minutes from me this year at a daycare, and guess where a parent is gonna take their kid who is sick with measles? You guessed it, to the pediatrician's waiting room. You don't want to be sitting there with a baby who is too little for the MMR and have to hope the fever doesn't give them brain damage.

Congratulations on the baby. I love nothing in life more than the time I get with my little girl. She turned 5 on Saturday. Healthy, happy, smart and sweet. She's had all her shots.

Here's my general advice as a father:

Don't spend all your spare moments agonizing over which book or which blog you need to follow word for word. Don't let mom do it, either. Opinions are like a$$holes, and that's true of a lot of parenting advice. Seek out good information, but don't let it keep you up at night.

Give them an unlimited supply of love, tell them you love them and you're proud of them, and don't shake them. Seriously, don't shake them. Jokes aside, we all have our moments when you're exhausted and just wanted an hour to yourself, and that sweet little girl wouldn't stop screaming and just take her nap. And you start to get frustrated and angry. And that's when you say, "Lay her down safe in her crib, go step out on the porch (don't let the door lock behind you) and take some deep breaths. Because one of you is a baby who doesn't know any better and one is a grown man."

You will have times when you know 100% in your gut that you're doing it right. You will also have times when you lie awake thinking, "I'm gonna ruin that child's life. There's only this much in the college fund and I don't know how to get him to eat a healthier variety of leafy vegetables, and I wonder if he's on track with his consonant sound formation compared to his age group, because if I wait too long on speech therapy then..." and in those moments, remind yourself, "He's f**king two, he is fed, clothed and loved. He's fine. Go to sleep."

This post was edited on 3/16 9:37 AM by TheBeav815
 

Jimmy Frank

Graduate Assistant
Nov 26, 2006
5,017
674
113
Originally posted by Harry Caray:

Originally posted by BetterRed:

I've had discussions with people who don't believe in flu shots, for instance. They don't believe in them, either. They're the same people who feel vaccinations are the result of such things as creating autism and other bad side affects in people.
I believe in getting the major vaccinations, but not the flu shot. There's a big difference. The flu shot is developed based on an educated guess about which strains they think will be most common. If you have a naturally strong immune system, you probably don't need it. Ironically, the only times I've gotten a bad case of the flu were the years I had to get a flu shot. Haven't had the flu since I stopped getting the shot.
If you have a strong immune system you should get it. You're only helping it get better.
 

Jimmy Frank

Graduate Assistant
Nov 26, 2006
5,017
674
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgpfNScEd3M
A Message for the Anti-Vaccine Movement
 

meo1960

Assistant Head Coach
Jan 15, 2003
10,337
809
113
Originally posted by Tyante:
You are missing the lines before those. Vaccines prevent deadly or crippling illnesses with no links between blah blah blah.

Some people made up a link between vaccines and other problems that don't exist,

>>>Perhaps some do. And then there are those who were fine before being vaccinated and got sick afterwards. Defenders of medical conglomerate won't tolerate their vaccine being implicated. They protect it with any means possible.

then people like Jenny McCarthy find evidence of these made up links and profess them as facts to the public. Since she's famous, people listen to her.

>>>Some people may blindly follow famous people. I don't. However, I'll concede that many do. I do my own "research" and trust the feedback my body is giving me. "made up links"? R U referring to internet links? And you know they are made up how? If someone posts their situation on the internet, and it just happens to put the medical community in a bad light, does that mean it was made up? But those who view these doctors as gods, have to besmirch that person, I get it! Show me one "made up link"/illness caused by a drug/vaccine, and I'll show you another where doctors & scientists have falsified data for personal gain. Not sure why JM is highlighted here. There are many others.

Ignorance is not a good reason to keep your children from getting vaccines.

>>>Ah, there we go! Arguments are weak, so we resort to calling those who don't hold our view, ignorant, or other derogatory names. Typical debate tactic. Attack the person because we can't compete in the marketplace of ideas.

This post was edited on 3/16 11:23 AM by meo1960
 

SeaOfRed75

Junior
Dec 5, 2010
1,514
1,323
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meo,

People get "sick" from vaccines how? We talking permanent issues here or fever etc that passes? And thats not conclusive either. Thats why people keep mentioning studies etc that can actually help determine if there is real A causes B type thing going on.

Also you shouldnt rip others for resorting to name calling when you are using the "evil medical industrial complex" argument.
 

TheBeav815

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
Feb 19, 2007
18,219
7,374
113
Chicago Suburbs
Originally posted by meo1960:

Originally posted by Tyante:
You are missing the lines before those. Vaccines prevent deadly or crippling illnesses with no links between blah blah blah.

Some people made up a link between vaccines and other problems that don't exist,

>>>Perhaps some do. And then there are those who were fine before being vaccinated and got sick afterwards. Defenders of medical conglomerate won't tolerate their vaccine being implicated. They protect it with any means possible.

then people like Jenny McCarthy find evidence of these made up links and profess them as facts to the public. Since she's famous, people listen to her.

>>>Some people may blindly follow famous people. I don't. However, I'll concede that many do. I do my own "research" and trust the feedback my body is giving me. "made up links"? R U referring to internet links? And you know they are made up how? If someone posts their situation on the internet, and it just happens to put the medical community in a bad light, does that mean it was made up? But those who view these doctors as gods, have to besmirch that person, I get it! Show me one "made up link"/illness caused by a drug/vaccine, and I'll show you another where doctors & scientists have falsified data for personal gain. Not sure why JM is highlighted here. There are many others.

Ignorance is not a good reason to keep your children from getting vaccines.

>>>Ah, there we go! Arguments are weak, so we resort to calling those who don't hold our view, ignorant, or other derogatory names. Typical debate tactic. Attack the person because we can't compete in the marketplace of ideas.

This post was edited on 3/16 11:23 AM by meo1960
Anyone can post to the internet. This board is the perfect example of how you don't have to know sh** about a subject to put your opinion online. If I had a dollar for every STUPID football idea I've seen on here, I wouldn't need a job.

People can put a link into existence regardless of whether they have any training in biology, chemistry, immunology, or even research methodology. Any idiot can put up a story and say, "our baby was fine and then got a shot and had a fever, now he's autistic" and they conveniently don't know that even at 10 months with no shots, their baby didn't respond to its name, give eye contact, or meet any of the milestones for normative social interaction for that age. Their child was always impaired, they didn't know the signs to look for to realize their child was abnormal until more overtly recognizable skills like speech were delayed, which so happens to occur around age 2.

That's like speculating that going to college causes schizophrenia because the typical age of onset/diagnosis is late teens and early twenties.

Any moron can slap down a blog that suggest a causal link between two unrelated phenomena because they're not subject to any rules. When you step into the realm of real science and medicine, where you're actually required to prove things, there are ZERO accepted studies that find threatening side effects in any statistically significant level.

Period. There is no debate. There is a set of facts that is accepted worldwide by smart people worldwide, and that's it. Nobody can force me to believe the earth spins around the sun, but if I deny it that doesn't make it a debate, it just makes me willfully ignorant.
 

gw2kpro

Blackshirt
Dec 2, 2007
3,365
2,136
113
Originally posted by schuele:

I feel blessed to live in an era where the odds of dying from or being disabled by a terrible epidemic are very remote. But that didn't happen by accident, and it shouldn't be undone by people who don't know what the #*&@ they are talking about.
This. I think there is a generation, still living, who has first-hand knowledge of a time when everyone knew someone who contracted something like polio.

And, that generation, if they were still physically able to, would up and bitch-slap people who, with no facts on their side -- not a single one -- convince people not to provide the very protection to their kids that eradicated things like this.
 

meo1960

Assistant Head Coach
Jan 15, 2003
10,337
809
113
The world needs doctors. There have been great advances in the treatment of disease. The brains of those who can actually learn & retain everything required to become a physician are the envy of the rest of us. Thank You to all those who entered the field to actually try to help others. FWIW, my wife is a Nurse Practitioner so I have the tiniest idea of all the material she's had to digest.

My argument, not yet stated, is that they are looking in the wrong place. I believe disease is a symptom of the body not being able to perform its designed function properly. Shouldn't we be putting more emphasis on preventing disease in the first place? And naturally, even if we are doing all things properly, to the best of our ability and income, we can still succomb to illness. But I believe we bring many diseases upon ourselves because we mismanage ourselves by not providing proper nourishment, taking in toxins, not avoiding others, jumping out of perfectly good airplanes(attempt at light-hearted humor), etc...

I would like to see more research dollars spent on the input side of the equation. (Foods, Food Additives, Toxins, Water, etc., and their affects on the body).

As a doctor, do you believe foods play any part in disease? How about sleep? Does quality of sleep play an affect? Do foods perhaps play a part in quality of sleep? Water Quality? Fluoride & Chlorine in water? How about EMF radiation? Are there any people sensitive to Electro-Magnetic radiation? What symptoms would each of these have? Not only do many doctors ignore the input side of the equation, they are active in trying to disallow any alternatives to their treatments. Fortunately for them, and most unfortunate for me, a case like mine, and others who suffer similar symptoms, is not the norm.---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Stop reading here if you could care less about my Medical Nightmare.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


My Symptoms at the time:

Random nose bleeds. Roaming Joint pain. Chronically inflamed airway(subglottic stenosis), Cartilage deformation after days

of swelling, Depression & Irritability(Severe!), Heavy phlegm in airway & lungs, High Blood Pressure, Low Thyroid function,

Tired for 3 or 4 hours after waking(going back to my teenage years), developed toenail fungus(still have). Severe brain fog,

deteriorating memory(I had to

memorize my way through engineering school).

If I had followed the advice of any of the 15, or so, doctors I had gone to see, eventually leading to a trip to Mayo Clinic(whom I considered at that time to house the best physicians in the world), I would be long dead. I was given 2 years to live with a chronically inflamed airway. Was down to 4.5mm(25=normal) in 1991 at the time of being Trach'd. All tests negative. They couldn't find anything, however for insurance purposes, and also, so I wouldn't be bankrupted, they decided that the closest thing to what I had was a very rare disease called Wegener's Granulomatosis. An auto-immune disease with no known cause and no known cure. Everyone was dying from this. Needless to say, rents were crushed and I was motivated to find an answer.

Found a local Doctor right by me who used to teach at Mayo. Dr. Moisan. He was the first doctor who put a scope down my airway, took a picture and sent that pic, along with a "nice" letter to the physician I saw at Mayo and told him "I don't think this is in his head". Mayo was the WORST experience out of all the doctors I had seen, given I had such high hopes. Dr. Moisen, then told me I had a case for Malpractice against the Mayo Doctor. And it was Dr. Moisen who told me that I was the most stubborn patient he had ever had, a badge I wear with Honor! I only later learned that subsequent studies showed that patients who take an active role in their treatment have the best outcomes.

So, out of hope with the medical community, I began my health adventure. Even a blind squirrel(that would be me in this analogy), finds a nut every now & then. I stumbled upon the fact that when I eliminated sugar from my diet, my symptoms diminished. Not eliminated, but enough to keep any further cartilage deformation from happening. And like clockwork, when I would eat sugar, back they came, with a vengeance. And the craziest thing happened. On a subsequent follow up to the physician who gave me the 2 year window declared, well, I guess our diagnosis was wrong? Imagine that. Now naturally, from the doctors perspective, the fact that I had stopped eating sugar had NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. I had succeeded in living past their deadline. Crazy huh?

I've never smoked but sugar addictions are NO FUN either. Now, 23 years later, I have discovered what I believe to be the main culprit(s). Seems I have been living most of my life with a Gluten Intolerance. Since eliminating this from my diet 23 days ago, I have felt fantastic. Respiratory system all clear. I Have lost 10 lbs, so far, without trying. I'm now also testing affects of EMF on my sleep. I've been waking with a loud ringing in my head for years. Doctors would call this tinnitus. I call it being able to hear high frequency transmissions. (Maybe I'm part Shih-Tzu or something). Last night, when I was awoken, I put a mylar blanket($3 bucks from Walmart) over my head and ringing stopped. So things look encouraging on that front. If EMF is messing with my REM sleep, that would seem to explain my Depression, Irritability, high BP and who knows what else.

Thats my story and my stubborn little self is continuing on my personal health journey. Blessings to all.
 

TheBeav815

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
Feb 19, 2007
18,219
7,374
113
Chicago Suburbs
Originally posted by meo1960:
The world needs doctors. There have been great advances in the treatment of disease. The brains of those who can actually learn & retain everything required to become a physician are the envy of the rest of us. Thank You to all those who entered the field to actually try to help others. FWIW, my wife is a Nurse Practitioner so I have the tiniest idea of all the material she's had to digest.

My argument, not yet stated, is that they are looking in the wrong place. I believe disease is a symptom of the body not being able to perform its designed function properly. Shouldn't we be putting more emphasis on preventing disease in the first place? And naturally, even if we are doing all things properly, to the best of our ability and income, we can still succomb to illness. But I believe we bring many diseases upon ourselves because we mismanage ourselves by not providing proper nourishment, taking in toxins, not avoiding others, jumping out of perfectly good airplanes(attempt at light-hearted humor), etc...

I would like to see more research dollars spent on the input side of the equation. (Foods, Food Additives, Toxins, Water, etc., and their affects on the body).

As a doctor, do you believe foods play any part in disease? How about sleep? Does quality of sleep play an affect? Do foods perhaps play a part in quality of sleep? Water Quality? Fluoride & Chlorine in water? How about EMF radiation? Are there any people sensitive to Electro-Magnetic radiation? What symptoms would each of these have? Not only do many doctors ignore the input side of the equation, they are active in trying to disallow any alternatives to their treatments. Fortunately for them, and most unfortunate for me, a case like mine, and others who suffer similar symptoms, is not the norm.---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Stop reading here if you could care less about my Medical Nightmare.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


My Symptoms at the time:

Random nose bleeds. Roaming Joint pain. Chronically inflamed airway(subglottic stenosis), Cartilage deformation after days

of swelling, Depression & Irritability(Severe!), Heavy phlegm in airway & lungs, High Blood Pressure, Low Thyroid function,

Tired for 3 or 4 hours after waking(going back to my teenage years), developed toenail fungus(still have). Severe brain fog,

deteriorating memory(I had to

memorize my way through engineering school).

If I had followed the advice of any of the 15, or so, doctors I had gone to see, eventually leading to a trip to Mayo Clinic(whom I considered at that time to house the best physicians in the world), I would be long dead. I was given 2 years to live with a chronically inflamed airway. Was down to 4.5mm(25=normal) in 1991 at the time of being Trach'd. All tests negative. They couldn't find anything, however for insurance purposes, and also, so I wouldn't be bankrupted, they decided that the closest thing to what I had was a very rare disease called Wegener's Granulomatosis. An auto-immune disease with no known cause and no known cure. Everyone was dying from this. Needless to say, rents were crushed and I was motivated to find an answer.

Found a local Doctor right by me who used to teach at Mayo. Dr. Moisan. He was the first doctor who put a scope down my airway, took a picture and sent that pic, along with a "nice" letter to the physician I saw at Mayo and told him "I don't think this is in his head". Mayo was the WORST experience out of all the doctors I had seen, given I had such high hopes. Dr. Moisen, then told me I had a case for Malpractice against the Mayo Doctor. And it was Dr. Moisen who told me that I was the most stubborn patient he had ever had, a badge I wear with Honor! I only later learned that subsequent studies showed that patients who take an active role in their treatment have the best outcomes.

So, out of hope with the medical community, I began my health adventure. Even a blind squirrel(that would be me in this analogy), finds a nut every now & then. I stumbled upon the fact that when I eliminated sugar from my diet, my symptoms diminished. Not eliminated, but enough to keep any further cartilage deformation from happening. And like clockwork, when I would eat sugar, back they came, with a vengeance. And the craziest thing happened. On a subsequent follow up to the physician who gave me the 2 year window declared, well, I guess our diagnosis was wrong? Imagine that. Now naturally, from the doctors perspective, the fact that I had stopped eating sugar had NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. I had succeeded in living past their deadline. Crazy huh?

I've never smoked but sugar addictions are NO FUN either. Now, 23 years later, I have discovered what I believe to be the main culprit(s). Seems I have been living most of my life with a Gluten Intolerance. Since eliminating this from my diet 23 days ago, I have felt fantastic. Respiratory system all clear. I Have lost 10 lbs, so far, without trying. I'm now also testing affects of EMF on my sleep. I've been waking with a loud ringing in my head for years. Doctors would call this tinnitus. I call it being able to hear high frequency transmissions. (Maybe I'm part Shih-Tzu or something). Last night, when I was awoken, I put a mylar blanket($3 bucks from Walmart) over my head and ringing stopped. So things look encouraging on that front. If EMF is messing with my REM sleep, that would seem to explain my Depression, Irritability, high BP and who knows what else.

Thats my story and my stubborn little self is continuing on my personal health journey. Blessings to all.
There is definitely still more out there for medicine. In another 50 years, we'll be amazed at some of the things we used to deal with today.

To the points about food and water, we have food and water widely and cheaply available that won't kill you, which is a lot more than most parts of the world enjoy. I used to work for the association that accredits dietetics education and provides the RD and DTR credential. Basically food is the new frontier of snake oil sales. For every ailment you imagine, somebody will pop up and tell you there's a dietary ingredient causing it. True, blinded studies pretty much never support it. They generally boil down to a placebo effect. Gluten included.

It makes me NUTS every time I see somebody talking about how some "cleanse" or some herbal supplement will fix everything that's wrong with your life. They never pass muster when you run a real study on them.

That's not to say you can't find people with strange food sensitivities that can't quite be explained, I know a few. But you're playing percentages. Some people can't have gluten, but that doesn't necessarily mean nobody should.

I personally have ADD, and you'll find people who want to tell you that phosphates in the diet cause this, if you just cut those out, poof you're cured. To which I anecdotally say, "horse shit." I've tried that and it does nothing appreciable for me.

Are there rare and baffling conditions out there that are not yet adequately described and treated? Absolutely.

There is a great myth that once upon time people just let their bodies do their thing and everything was perfect. It couldn't be further from the truth. People died young and epidemics would sweep through areas and kill 1/4 or 1/2 the population. Women routinely died in childbirth. Parents burying children was commonplace. Can you develop a natural immunity to smallpox? Sure you can, all you have to do is let a bunch of people die of it, and the ones who live are immune! Tada!

High frequencies causing you issues is HIGHLY unlikely. That's very simple to test, just find a frequency generator and see how high it goes before you can't hear it any more.

This post was edited on 3/16 1:40 PM by TheBeav815
 

huskerfan1000

Walk On
Mar 28, 2010
325
91
28
Ill share my experience on a different but similar subject, my mercury fillings, I got a total 8 mercury fillings in 70s and early 80s, and never had an issue with them. Ive had a real interest in diet and nutrition for 30 years now, I have kept journals on my diets etc. thru the years.
Around 2010 I felt something was wrong with me, I know how I should feel based on diet and exercise and I just didnt feel right, but I put it off as age and moved on, by 2013 it was getting very noticeable I just felt weak alot of the time where I had always felt very healthy this time I thought the decline was becoming more rapid so I figured could be something serious going on and I started researching all the symptoms and doing tons of research, the odd thing that kept coming up in my research was the mercury fillings, but I had had them for so many years without issue. So after deliberation I set up an appointment with a dentist I had known since we were kids, shes highly competent with great integrity. She looked at my teeth etc, said it would be 5k to remove them and she would do whatever I requested but felt it was very unnecesary based on her 25 years plus experience. Mercury fillings had been around for 100 years and they are standard and accepted by the experts in the field. Even her assistants asked why I would spend 5k to have them removed.
So thought do I really want to have spend 5k on an uncertainty. So for time being I decided it was something else, but again the issues were still there, did more investigating and started talking to dentists not only in USA but other counties, found a dentist who was a mercury free dentist which is rare, and talked to him, decided to travel and do a consult, for some reason all along I felt this was the issue I just got an overwhelming sense, so I went ahead and had them removed.
So even as I was leaving office after only having the 1st 4 removed (the other 4 were removed later) the difference was already life changing literally felt like a different person, could not even put into words how dramatic a difference has been and how it maybe even saved my life. So to each his own, but doing my own exhaustive research saved my life.
 

meo1960

Assistant Head Coach
Jan 15, 2003
10,337
809
113
Medicine has the be the largest, most difficult puzzle ever.

I love puzzles!
 

HuskerBandGeek

Redshirt Freshman
Jan 1, 2004
790
207
43
One thing that often gets overlooked in this debate, autism diagnosis guidelines were changed to make the disease a spectrum disorder as opposed to one solid definition. You could fit many people into the mildly autistic range if you really wanted to.

You know what else started occurring at that diagnostic reclassification? A spike in autism diagnosis that lead to people scrambling for answers while ignoring the face that being diagnosed had become easier and allowed for a wider variety of interpretations.

Get your kids vaccinated, barring allergies, the risk is far outweighed by the benefits. I sleep better at night knowing my kids will never be crippled by polio, or have permanent damage from preventable disease.
 

Tyante

Redshirt Freshman
Sep 11, 2007
637
85
28
Originally posted by meo1960:

Originally posted by Tyante:
You are missing the lines before those. Vaccines prevent deadly or crippling illnesses with no links between blah blah blah.

Some people made up a link between vaccines and other problems that don't exist,

>>>Perhaps some do. And then there are those who were fine before being vaccinated and got sick afterwards. Defenders of medical conglomerate won't tolerate their vaccine being implicated. They protect it with any means possible.

then people like Jenny McCarthy find evidence of these made up links and profess them as facts to the public. Since she's famous, people listen to her.

>>>Some people may blindly follow famous people. I don't. However, I'll concede that many do. I do my own "research" and trust the feedback my body is giving me. "made up links"? R U referring to internet links? And you know they are made up how? If someone posts their situation on the internet, and it just happens to put the medical community in a bad light, does that mean it was made up? But those who view these doctors as gods, have to besmirch that person, I get it! Show me one "made up link"/illness caused by a drug/vaccine, and I'll show you another where doctors & scientists have falsified data for personal gain. Not sure why JM is highlighted here. There are many others.

Ignorance is not a good reason to keep your children from getting vaccines.

>>>Ah, there we go! Arguments are weak, so we resort to calling those who don't hold our view, ignorant, or other derogatory names. Typical debate tactic. Attack the person because we can't compete in the marketplace of ideas.

This post was edited on 3/16 11:23 AM by meo1960
I'm not talking about made up internet links. I'm talking about people making up links between vaccines and having other medical issues, ie ignorance. The facts are vaccines have all but eradicated many nasty viruses as other people have pointed out in this thread.

One reason I pointed out JM is she has been on talk shows giving people false information saying she got a degree from google to support her claims.

I'm not arguing doctors are infallible. That is also not the point of this thread. This thread is about vaccines. Show any proof that vaccines are bad for people. There is a lot of proof that they do as claimed.
 

WestCoastCornhusker

All-American
Nov 28, 2005
4,280
94
48
Originally posted by TarheelHuskerFan:
I've heard so many bad things on both sides and have no idea what to do. What are your opinions? What experience have you guys had with this?

Thanks
THERE ARE 50 MILLION Illegal Immigrants that cross the border that never seen a doctor or hospital in their lives, they have all types of diseases, they work in the kitchens of our restaurants. GET THE VACCINES!
 

dinglefritz

College Football Hall of Fame
Jan 14, 2011
23,907
17,560
113
Originally posted by Tyante:
Originally posted by meo1960:

Originally posted by Tyante:
You are missing the lines before those. Vaccines prevent deadly or crippling illnesses with no links between blah blah blah.

Some people made up a link between vaccines and other problems that don't exist,

>>>Perhaps some do. And then there are those who were fine before being vaccinated and got sick afterwards. Defenders of medical conglomerate won't tolerate their vaccine being implicated. They protect it with any means possible.

then people like Jenny McCarthy find evidence of these made up links and profess them as facts to the public. Since she's famous, people listen to her.

>>>Some people may blindly follow famous people. I don't. However, I'll concede that many do. I do my own "research" and trust the feedback my body is giving me. "made up links"? R U referring to internet links? And you know they are made up how? If someone posts their situation on the internet, and it just happens to put the medical community in a bad light, does that mean it was made up? But those who view these doctors as gods, have to besmirch that person, I get it! Show me one "made up link"/illness caused by a drug/vaccine, and I'll show you another where doctors & scientists have falsified data for personal gain. Not sure why JM is highlighted here. There are many others.

Ignorance is not a good reason to keep your children from getting vaccines.

>>>Ah, there we go! Arguments are weak, so we resort to calling those who don't hold our view, ignorant, or other derogatory names. Typical debate tactic. Attack the person because we can't compete in the marketplace of ideas.

This post was edited on 3/16 11:23 AM by meo1960
I'm not talking about made up internet links. I'm talking about people making up links between vaccines and having other medical issues, ie ignorance. The facts are vaccines have all but eradicated many nasty viruses as other people have pointed out in this thread.

One reason I pointed out JM is she has been on talk shows giving people false information saying she got a degree from google to support her claims.

I'm not arguing doctors are infallible. That is also not the point of this thread. This thread is about vaccines. Show any proof that vaccines are bad for people. There is a lot of proof that they do as claimed.
The most convincing link of anything to autism is genetics. People with kids with autism spectrum children want to find any reason they can to explain their child's problem. Blaming themselves for their own crappy genes just doesn't make them feel better. There has been no proven link between vaccinations and autism spectrum disorders. As with anything we take, there can be unfortunate reactions to medicines, vaccines or other environmental factors. The risk to an individual from vaccination is minute compared to the risk to the general population posed by unvaccinated individuals. IF your kid is the one that has the one in a million vaccination reaction, it iS a big deal. But IF we don't use vacccination the risk is huge to the general population. IMO, anybody that doesn't vaccinate their kid is a fool unless there is a proven medical reason for not doing it. Its too bad that there is not vaccine for stupidity.
 

TheBeav815

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
Feb 19, 2007
18,219
7,374
113
Chicago Suburbs
Originally posted by WestCoastCornhusker:
Originally posted by TarheelHuskerFan:
I've heard so many bad things on both sides and have no idea what to do. What are your opinions? What experience have you guys had with this?

Thanks
THERE ARE 50 MILLION Illegal Immigrants that cross the border that never seen a doctor or hospital in their lives, they have all types of diseases, they work in the kitchens of our restaurants. GET THE VACCINES!
Oops, you've spilled some stupid on the thread! Let me clean it up for you:

Many Latin American countries have better vaccination rates than we do. The rest are comparable. But by all means, feel free to post the zero evidence you'll find to support this vaguely racist reason to be pro-vaccine.
 

schuele

Athletic Director
Apr 17, 2005
13,743
9,074
113
Originally posted by TheBeav815:
THERE ARE 50 MILLION Illegal Immigrants that cross the border that never seen a doctor or hospital in their lives, they have all types of diseases, they work in the kitchens of our restaurants. GET THE VACCINES!
Oops, you've spilled some stupid on the thread! Let me clean it up for you:

Many Latin American countries have better vaccination rates than we do. The rest are comparable. But by all means, feel free to post the zero evidence you'll find to support this vaguely racist reason to be pro-vaccine.
And then there's the fact that even based on the higher estimates of the number of people in the country illegally, 50 million is off by about 300 percent - EVEN WHEN YOU PUT IT IN CAPITAL LETTERS!

I would sincerely like to see the U.S. do more to tighten its borders, and I would like to see everyone get their kids vaccinated. But fighting hysteria with hysteria is not likely to produce those results.

This post was edited on 3/17 10:06 AM by schuele
 

TheBeav815

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
Feb 19, 2007
18,219
7,374
113
Chicago Suburbs
Originally posted by schuele:

Originally posted by TheBeav815:
THERE ARE 50 MILLION Illegal Immigrants that cross the border that never seen a doctor or hospital in their lives, they have all types of diseases, they work in the kitchens of our restaurants. GET THE VACCINES!
Oops, you've spilled some stupid on the thread! Let me clean it up for you:

Many Latin American countries have better vaccination rates than we do. The rest are comparable. But by all means, feel free to post the zero evidence you'll find to support this vaguely racist reason to be pro-vaccine.
And then there's the fact that even based on the higher estimates of the number of people in the country illegally, 50 million is off by about 300 percent - EVEN WHEN YOU PUT IT IN CAPITAL LETTERS!

I would sincerely like to see the U.S. do more to tighten its borders, and I would like to see everyone get their kids vaccinated. But fighting hysteria with hysteria is not likely to produce those results.

This post was edited on 3/17 10:06 AM by schuele
What's a few hundred percent between friends?

This post was edited on 3/17 10:08 AM by TheBeav815
 

Blackshirt30

All-American
Gold Member
Feb 9, 2005
4,909
1,970
113
It's personal decision you and your family need to research and decide on your own. Everybody's opinion here on both sides of the debate don't mean squat.
 

TheBeav815

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
Feb 19, 2007
18,219
7,374
113
Chicago Suburbs
Originally posted by Blackshirt30:
It's personal decision you and your family need to research and decide on your own. Everybody's opinion here on both sides of the debate don't mean squat.
No, it's not. It's a public health decision. It's also very likely a decision on whether your child will be allowed to attend most schools or daycares.

What you're seeing on here, these aren't "opinions" at all. These are facts and they're supported by properly conducted studies.

Whether or not Miracle Whip tastes good is an opinion. Vaccinating being better than not vaccinating is a fact.
 

BornNBredRed

Assistant Head Coach
Jun 24, 2001
9,958
193
63
Originally posted by schuele:
Personally I am glad that some of the smartest people in the world dedicate their lives to protecting public health. It's baffling to me how some people take their hatred for politicians and other things governmental, and use that to make a case against vaccinations. I'll bet my aunt who contracted polio as a child, and spent the rest of her life in a wheelchair, wishes she could have been so oppressed by the government that she had been vaccinated..

I feel blessed to live in an era where the odds of dying from or being disabled by a terrible epidemic are very remote. But that didn't happen by accident, and it shouldn't be undone by people who don't know what the #*&@ they are talking about.
Amen
 

siegsker

Senior
Aug 13, 2010
2,768
106
63
Amen, Beav. You are doing great work in this thread. Thanks :)

Also, if you don't have the degree to back it up, I guess I could care less about "doing your own research." I mean, I could. If I tried really, really hard. ;)
 

TheBeav815

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
Feb 19, 2007
18,219
7,374
113
Chicago Suburbs
Originally posted by siegsker:
Amen, Beav. You are doing great work in this thread. Thanks :)

Also, if you don't have the degree to back it up, I guess I could care less about "doing your own research." I mean, I could. If I tried really, really hard. ;)
Exactly. Telling the average person to go and do their own research is like handing some kid a .22 and telling him he's in the Army. It takes proper training in math and in research methods to be able to separate what is legitimate science and what is not.

The internet is full of people who could not begin to tell you what a proper sample size is or why it matters, let alone being equipped to ferret out potential confirmation bias in a researcher.

If you've never passed a stats class, I flatly DO NOT want you doing your own research. You need to go find an expert. In this case, a pediatrician.
 

Cdn Blackshirt

First Team All-Big Ten
Sep 30, 2009
3,634
55
48
I did my own research and became in the anti-vaccine camp.

I'll try to post some things this weekend - my week is hell.

If doing your own digging look up aluminum content in vaccines.


M.
 

Clevinger

Offensive Coordinator
Gold Member
Feb 26, 2007
9,251
1,671
113
Originally posted by TarheelHuskerFan:
I've heard so many bad things on both sides and have no idea what to do. What are your opinions? What experience have you guys had with this?

Thanks
When your kid gets a preventable illness like the measles, you'll wonder why you ever gave a crap about Jenny McCarthy's opinion.

Get the vaccinations.

The link to autism was debunked, with the so-called researcher having his article withdrawn.
 

shine003

Offensive Coordinator
Feb 25, 2005
8,112
2,347
113
Originally posted by Clevinger:
Originally posted by TarheelHuskerFan:
I've heard so many bad things on both sides and have no idea what to do. What are your opinions? What experience have you guys had with this?

Thanks
When your kid gets a preventable illness like the measles, you'll wonder why you ever gave a crap about Jenny McCarthy's opinion.

Get the vaccinations.

The link to autism was debunked, with the so-called researcher having his article withdrawn.
Saw first hand a 6 month old baby die of pneumoccocal meningitis that he picked up from his 4 year old brother that wasn't vaccinated. Horrific.

Vaccines save lives. No respectable western medical expert would disagree that the benefits FAR out way the risks.
 

bshirt73

Senior
Aug 31, 2014
2,542
1,521
113
Originally posted by meo1960:

Originally posted by Tyante:
You are missing the lines before those. Vaccines prevent deadly or crippling illnesses with no links between blah blah blah.

Some people made up a link between vaccines and other problems that don't exist,

>>>Perhaps some do. And then there are those who were fine before being vaccinated and got sick afterwards. Defenders of medical conglomerate won't tolerate their vaccine being implicated. They protect it with any means possible.

then people like Jenny McCarthy find evidence of these made up links and profess them as facts to the public. Since she's famous, people listen to her.

>>>Some people may blindly follow famous people. I don't. However, I'll concede that many do. I do my own "research" and trust the feedback my body is giving me. "made up links"? R U referring to internet links? And you know they are made up how? If someone posts their situation on the internet, and it just happens to put the medical community in a bad light, does that mean it was made up? But those who view these doctors as gods, have to besmirch that person, I get it! Show me one "made up link"/illness caused by a drug/vaccine, and I'll show you another where doctors & scientists have falsified data for personal gain. Not sure why JM is highlighted here. There are many others.

Ignorance is not a good reason to keep your children from getting vaccines.

>>>Ah, there we go! Arguments are weak, so we resort to calling those who don't hold our view, ignorant, or other derogatory names. Typical debate tactic. Attack the person because we can't compete in the marketplace of ideas.

This post was edited on 3/16 11:23 AM by meo1960
Hang in there compadre. Don't let the mob bring you down.
 

Archie Graham

Offensive Coordinator
Apr 12, 2007
8,673
2,237
113
Google 'lanthanides in vaccines' and you'll waste hours on the Internet.

Good grief this thread is depressing.
 

drhusker276

Walk On
Jan 20, 2009
175
4
18
Originally posted by Archie Graham:
Google 'lanthanides in vaccines' and you'll waste hours on the Internet.

Good grief this thread is depressing.
Yes. But at least there have been a surprisingly low number of fruit loops in the thread so far.

The answer is simple. There are few conditions (immunocompromised individuals) where it is advisable not to vaccinate. For everyone else, experience and scientific evidence overwhelmingly indicate you should vaccinate.
 

mothmonsterman

All-American
Jan 8, 2006
4,639
403
83
The belief that vaccines are generally dangerous, like a lot of other heterodox beliefs, is rooted in a distrust of elite institutions. For the most part this distrust is a healthy and I would say necessary attitude in a free society. Sometimes this skepticism is perfectly reasonable, sometimes it's not. For the most part someone's belief about the moon landing or whether the royal family is made up of lizard people is harmless to the rest of society. Skepticism about vaccines on the other hand, can endanger the lives of innocent people.
 

SeaOfRed75

Junior
Dec 5, 2010
1,514
1,323
113
Surprisingly low but still some.

Makes one wish Rivals had little icons by people's user names to indicate things.

--believes vaccines are bad for you
--believes in bigfoot
--believes Bo Pelini is nice guy and should still be head coach
--likes Nickelback