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Covid 5.0

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I'd heard that with Mexicos restrictions combined with ours, pickers wont be coming, so, there will be jobs for some,if this doesn't turn around by harvest.
There's lots to fix,lots to guess at, we all need to step up.
 
Man I don't see the people or economy making it that long. I think people and business are going to have to start getting back to normal. I know someone brought it up a few days ago and said at what point does one have to weigh the life of few for the lives and economy of everyone. There are going to be tough decisions to make in the coming days and weeks. Im glad I don't have to make them.
Keep in mind..it isn't the life of a few...and it isn't only the old. Doctors and nurses are at extremely high risk of death during pandemics because of the extreme stress and amount of viral load they come in contact with...America will have 2 million deaths if nothing is done, 1 million deaths if you isolate the old and vulnerable...and maybe half that if you isolate during the peak and then play a careful dance until the middle of next year.

A million deaths is more than a few...a million deaths where people do not get funerals and die alone without their loved ones. Many of those deaths would be preventable if there was some leadership that could navigate the problem of getting money to unemployed, while supporting small business, and having some expectations that the super wealthy, large corporate entities don't get their bailouts. Big business leaders by nature are looking for exploits and there is a ton of opportunity to get their hands on billions. Amazon and Tesla are both looking for 5 billion to keep their space services open. Somebody needs to say...Bezos, you just built a 66 billion dollar house...you can fund that service for the time being with your own bank.

Mnuchin is looking for 450 billion of taxpayer money where he doesn't have to document its movement. The economy has enough money...the economy has enough production...people still need food, entertainment, medical treatment...the issue is BIG business is going to scare us into bailing them out when they don't actually need it, over, and over and over.
 
Keep in mind..it isn't the life of a few...and it isn't only the old. Doctors and nurses are at extremely high risk of death during pandemics because of the extreme stress and amount of viral load they come in contact with...America will have 2 million deaths if nothing is done, 1 million deaths if you isolate the old and vulnerable...and maybe half that if you isolate during the peak and then play a careful dance until the middle of next year.

A million deaths is more than a few...a million deaths where people do not get funerals and die alone without their loved ones. Many of those deaths would be preventable if there was some leadership that could navigate the problem of getting money to unemployed, while supporting small business, and having some expectations that the super wealthy, large corporate entities don't get their bailouts. Big business leaders by nature are looking for exploits and there is a ton of opportunity to get their hands on billions. Amazon and Tesla are both looking for 5 billion to keep their space services open. Somebody needs to say...Bezos, you just built a 66 billion dollar house...you can fund that service for the time being with your own bank.
I think the death estimates have come down a lot due to the steps that have been taken. We'll see. New York is going to get really ugly over the next week or two then this thing is going to drag out for months.
 
So, are they scrubbing the subways in NY? Other areas? I may have missed that, but its working or helping in So Korea
 
So, are they scrubbing the subways in NY? Other areas? I may have missed that, but its working or helping in So Korea
I don't believe that anybody has found that surfaces in public buildings that you don't touch with your hands are a significant source of infection. Hopefully people are maintaining the physical distance in the subway and buses and using the hell out of hand sanitizer if they have to touch anything.
 
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Italy reported 4789 cases and 601 deaths, showing a 2nd straight day of decline in both numbers. If the trend continues this is very good news.
It's good news but it will be a couple of weeks of horrible fatality rates yet I'm afraid for them. Then they'll have to very careful to keep the thing from taking off again.
 
From the CDC morbidity report (link)

"This first preliminary description of outcomes among patients with COVID-19 in the United States indicates that fatality was highest in persons aged ≥85, ranging from 10% to 27%, followed by 3% to 11% among persons aged 65–84 years, 1% to 3% among persons aged 55-64 years, <1% among persons aged 20–54 years, and no fatalities among persons aged ≤19 years."

The flu kills people of all ages every year. The corona virus will be no different. We need to remember that the media makes money by appealing to readers emotions and not their reason.
 
I don't believe that anybody has found that surfaces in public buildings that you don't touch with your hands are a significant source of infection. Hopefully people are maintaining the physical distance in the subway and buses and using the hell out of hand sanitizer if they have to touch anything.
I was stunned by NYs local government, when Nebraska schools were shuttered, ncaa activities, pro sports etc,all shut down, yet they still had bars open, schools open etc.
The stress they put on its systems are unforgivable.
 
I don't believe that anybody has found that surfaces in public buildings that you don't touch with your hands are a significant source of infection. Hopefully people are maintaining the physical distance in the subway and buses and using the hell out of hand sanitizer if they have to touch anything.
This. Plus, the virus on surfaces out in open outdoor spaces are unlikely to survive for very long due to UV. I'm all about mitigation, but some actions are futile. For example, the pictures of trucks in the streets of South Korea spraying disinfectant on the roads was probably all for naught. Although it did achieve a display to tell citizens they were taking proactive measures.
 
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My valuable contribution...
 
This. Plus, the virus on surfaces out in the open are unlikely to survive for very long. I'm all about mitigation, but actions are futile. Fore example, the pictures of trucks in the streets of South Korea spraying disinfectant on the roads was probably all for naught. Although it did achieve a display to tell citizens they were taking proactive measures.
Those subways are, people out,people in. Very little time between potential contact areas.
Possibly changing the schedules, and still scrubbing can work both ways?
 
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I agree with you that it is going to be suggested, but at some point people are going to start to snap and put real pressure on our leaders to get America restarted. I can't remember the exact stat I heard, but basically the majority of the US lives basically paycheck to paycheck with no real savings. It'll be pretty damn difficult to continue to tell people to stay in place when they have nothing left. Risks will be taken and deaths with probably mount up in the older population as we won't be able to continue to stay home. The scary part is I feel like we are going to see rioting in the next few weeks in major cities. That is what scares me. A lot of people have lived in luxury (compared to a lot of countries) for so long and as those luxuries go away there is going to be a lot of anger.

Rioting is what is going to scare me. Not everyone works jobs that they can work from home.
 
Rioting is what is going to scare me. Not everyone works jobs that they can work from home.
We're still early in, and everyones going to get help. Riots are only exposing oneself towards infection.
There's many things to hold back society at this point.
 
after things chill out a bit, will there be test that would tell you if you ever "had" coronovirus.

I just got over a cold this week. And hell I am curious if I was a mile case, and therefore can join the herd of immune?
 
after things chill out a bit, will there be test that would tell you if you ever "had" coronovirus.

I just got over a cold this week. And hell I am curious if I was a mile case, and therefore can join the herd of immune?
I doubt there will be any widespread retrospective serologic studies done to determine exposure rates. In some areas that may and should be true just for educational purposes. I think you could maybe go to your Dr at some point and request an antibody test but you would likely pay for it entirely out of your own pocket.
 
From the CDC morbidity report (link)

"This first preliminary description of outcomes among patients with COVID-19 in the United States indicates that fatality was highest in persons aged ≥85, ranging from 10% to 27%, followed by 3% to 11% among persons aged 65–84 years, 1% to 3% among persons aged 55-64 years, <1% among persons aged 20–54 years, and no fatalities among persons aged ≤19 years."

The flu kills people of all ages every year. The corona virus will be no different. We need to remember that the media makes money by appealing to readers emotions and not their reason.
Stop. It is not the flu and this is not just media hype. Entire cities are shutdown, economies crippled. It’s not because of sensationalized media, it’s because of the advice of every leading expert in the field. Why can’t we just listen to the experts and stop pretending like it’s less than it is, just because we want it to be.
 
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SIAP somewhere, but I started following this page about 9-10 days ago. We had around 167,000 cases world wide the day I first found it. If you can look at it on a desktop

I might not be doing something right with it, but viewing on a desktop there is more information than last week, and more than when I look at it on my phone. It currently shows "changes today" in both confirmed cases and deaths.

USA is # 3 in the world in cases. If New York was it's own country it'd be # 7 in confirmed cases and #9 in deaths. 43 deaths today, up 37.7%.

https://ncov2019.live/
 
SIAP somewhere, but I started following this page about 9-10 days ago. We had around 167,000 cases world wide the day I first found it. If you can look at it on a desktop

I might not be doing something right with it, but viewing on a desktop there is more information than last week, and more than when I look at it on my phone. It currently shows "changes today" in both confirmed cases and deaths.

USA is # 3 in the world in cases. If New York was it's own country it'd be # 7 in confirmed cases and #9 in deaths. 43 deaths today, up 37.7%.

https://ncov2019.live/

With the masses that went on Spring Break and are coming back and creating community spread, I wouldn't be surprised if we end up #1.
 
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Stop. It is not the flu and this is not just media hype. Entire cities are shutdown, economies crippled. It’s not because of sensationalized media, it’s because of the advice of every leading expert in the field. Why can’t we just listen to the experts and stop pretending like it’s less than it is, just because we want it to be.

I agree with your statement, but those numbers are something.
 
Covid 19 is becoming awfully hard to escape from. I live in Central Washington. We are nothing like Seattle is so many different ways. We get hot in the summer and colder, not Nebraska cold, in the winter. Usually have snow on the ground for at least 6 weeks in the winter and all winter in the Cascades that we are nestled up to. The Columbia River goes through town providing the area with lots of water for irrigation. Before the dams the land was covered with sagebrush. Because of the warm weather, the river and many lakes such as nearby 55 mile long Lake Chelan (where you need $700-800k minimum to buy a single family home on the lake) we have a lot of summer homes owned by people from the Puget Sound region. There are recreation homes and cabins from here to the Canadian border 150 miles away. With the schools out along with people just wanting to get out of crowded metropolitan area (Seattle) these owners of summer homes have come to our region to hide out. They are bringing Seattle's problems to us. They are overwhelming stores and services in the smaller towns in the area. More importantly, I believe they will bring the virus with them. I am betting this will not be isolated to our region. I think all areas that have lots of summer homes will be hit hard from people escaping cities. I have a cousin who has lived in Breckenridge, CO for 40 years. She tells me that residents from Summit County are not to leave the county and people from outside the county are not suppose to come to it. Will be interesting to see how well this is enforced.
 
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Very good to hear, hope they fill it out.
Absolutely. Beds/staffing issues are connected. I have been a nurse for 35 years.....and staffing is a big concern. My employer started recruiting temp staff 2 weeks ago

My wife is a nurse at the local hospital. She is in education and does orientation for new nursing hires. In the last month she has even gone in on a weekend just to get a single travelling nurse onboard so they can immediately go to work. There is a real priority to increase the number of nurses at the hospital.
 
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Stop. It is not the flu and this is not just media hype. Entire cities are shutdown, economies crippled. It’s not because of sensationalized media, it’s because of the advice of every leading expert in the field. Why can’t we just listen to the experts and stop pretending like it’s less than it is, just because we want it to be.

Maybe I missed some breaking news. Experts say that a majority of Americans will contract the virus. If we practice isolation and distancing we can spread the cases out over time. A majority of Americans will still catch the virus. That is a CDC report. If you don't like it, you can call the CDC and ask them to stop compiling statistics.
 
For what it is worth. This from a friend who is a FBI analyst.

His email.....

Just a start.......accident my ass. China always uses the ploy with dual-use technology, faking right when its actually left.

https://www.nature.com/news/enginee...isky-research-1.18787?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews


https://www.nature.com/articles/nm.3985

http://english.whiov.cas.cn/News/Events/201502/t20150203_135923.html

https://www.state.gov/wp-content/up...-Report-2019-August-19-Unclassified-Final.pdf (Read page 45)

I don't believe it was an accident either, not for one second, never did.
 
I don't believe it was an accident either, not for one second, never did.

Did you bother to read the first of his links?

Editors’ note, March 2020: We are aware that this story is being used as the basis for unverified theories that the novel coronavirus causing COVID-19 was engineered. There is no evidence that this is true; scientists believe that an animal is the most likely source of the coronavirus.
 
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Did you bother to read the first of his links?

Editors’ note, March 2020: We are aware that this story is being used as the basis for unverified theories that the novel coronavirus causing COVID-19 was engineered. There is no evidence that this is true; scientists believe that an animal is the most likely source of the coronavirus.


I don't think the china virus was a complete accident. My opinion...worth exactly what you paid for it.
 
For what it is worth. This from a friend who is a FBI analyst.

His email.....

Just a start.......accident my ass. China always uses the ploy with dual-use technology, faking right when its actually left.

https://www.nature.com/news/enginee...isky-research-1.18787?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews


https://www.nature.com/articles/nm.3985

http://english.whiov.cas.cn/News/Events/201502/t20150203_135923.html

https://www.state.gov/wp-content/up...-Report-2019-August-19-Unclassified-Final.pdf (Read page 45)
Oh goody, another person with a PhD in molecular biology to discuss this paper with on the board.

The authors state that "Coupled with the observation of previously identified pathogenic CoV backbones3,20, our results suggest that the starting materials required for SARS-like emergent strains are currently circulating in animal reservoirs."

I would love to hear what your FBI analyst has to say about emergence paradigms in coronaviruses and how he concluded that this must be an engineered strain. I mean he's an FBI analyst so surely he understands the science behind coronaviruses.

41591_2015_Article_BFnm3985_Fig4_HTML.jpg
 
Stop. It is not the flu and this is not just media hype. Entire cities are shutdown, economies crippled. It’s not because of sensationalized media, it’s because of the advice of every leading expert in the field. Why can’t we just listen to the experts and stop pretending like it’s less than it is, just because we want it to be.
all those things are shutdown/crippled due to decisions made by elected people, not by experts.

Dr Fauci (perhaps the foremost expert) himself said getting together with people you're regularly interacting with is fine. Going outside in parks and to exercise is fine. just use common sense and keep your distance.

Denver, where there have been zero deaths, just initiated a shutdown because the mayor's office and 911 were flooded with calls complaining about too many people in out in parks playing games and picnicking.

what a joke. hope you don't own a small business, because I'm sure the show will go on as far as tax collection goes. same goes for anyone with a car- hope you have all the parking allowances memorized, because the ticket brigade won't be quarantined.

the gov't cares deeply for you & always knows what's right.
 
I think two waves are inevitable. But the second wave will be effected by herd antibody, as your story points out, they dont have one.
Nature is going to try to live,this virus is no different. It's the reason why we need medicines to weaken its ability to cause great harm, and shorten it.
But ultimately, the vaccine.

The herd effect is the most costly effect, because it has to effect large amounts of the population, but keeping the curve down, it allows for the herd effect, plus best helps from our health systems without being overcome,yt over a longer period of time, reach the same numbers if it were unencumbered.

But, the herd effect is like a spiderweb, where we're all connected, but those with antibodies act as cut off points within the web, as the virus tries to expand, it hits enough dead ends where it never reaches certain places or people. Thats the natural effect,the survival effect.

What is it with you and commas?? LMFAO!! I clearly wasn't an English major but damn man you just stick them anywhere!You obviously love them but don't have a clue how to use them (that info is readily available via Google my friend). I guess I'm not surprised after seeing your math skills awhile back. Maybe just don't use them at all, that would look better than such blatant over-usage. But hey, you do you :p.
 
What is it with you and commas?? LMFAO!! I clearly wasn't an English major but damn man you just stick them anywhere!You obviously love them but don't have a clue how to use them (that info is readily available via Google my friend). I guess I'm not surprised after seeing your math skills awhile back. Maybe just don't use them at all, that would look better than such blatant over-usage. But hey, you do you :p.
Someone step on your wee? PS4 off
 
Maybe I missed some breaking news. Experts say that a majority of Americans will contract the virus. If we practice isolation and distancing we can spread the cases out over time. A majority of Americans will still catch the virus. That is a CDC report. If you don't like it, you can call the CDC and ask them to stop compiling statistics.
The CDC isn’t saying it’s the same as the flu, you are. Which is complete nonsense.
 
all those things are shutdown/crippled due to decisions made by elected people, not by experts.

Dr Fauci (perhaps the foremost expert) himself said getting together with people you're regularly interacting with is fine. Going outside in parks and to exercise is fine. just use common sense and keep your distance.

Denver, where there have been zero deaths, just initiated a shutdown because the mayor's office and 911 were flooded with calls complaining about too many people in out in parks playing games and picnicking.

what a joke. hope you don't own a small business, because I'm sure the show will go on as far as tax collection goes. same goes for anyone with a car- hope you have all the parking allowances memorized, because the ticket brigade won't be quarantined.

the gov't cares deeply for you & always knows what's right.
Yes it sucks financially that we are stuck in this global pandemic, but that doesn’t mean we should pretend like it’s not happening.
 
In order for the herd effect to work, 60% of a group must be infected or have a vaccine.

The doesnt stop us from learning,using better treatments etc.
 
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