B1G Cancels Football Season

[Nebraska_Reality]

No second chances for Jim Jordan? Interesting. Your zero tolerance applies equally to everyone, right? So when Trump signed this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Step_Act -- that got you pretty upset, didn't it? I mean no second chances for Jordan means no second chances for anyone . . . right? And that logic works because you're better than everyone. Might I say . . .perfect.
You did imply in an earlier post that bureaucrats are a smarter and better class of people than those who post on this board.
You're non-partisan? You didn't vote for Barry? One of those I doubt is true . . . the other I know isn't true.
You're big on purity tests. Especially if you think it helps take people's eyes off things you'd rather they not see.
You know who else loves purity tests and virtue signaling?
Religious fanatics and cancel culture authoritarians.

No second chances for Jim Jordan? Interesting. Your zero tolerance applies equally to everyone, right? So when Trump signed this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Step_Act -- that got you pretty upset, didn't it? I mean no second chances for Jordan means no second chances for anyone . . . right? And that logic works because you're better than everyone. Might I say . . .perfect.
You did imply in an earlier post that bureaucrats are a smarter and better class of people than those who post on this board.
You're non-partisan? You didn't vote for Barry? One of those I doubt is true . . . the other I know isn't true.
You're big on purity tests. Especially if you think it helps take people's eyes off things you'd rather they not see.
You know who else loves purity tests and virtue signaling?
Religious fanatics and cancel culture authoritarians.

1) I have no problem with second chances in most instances...but that usually requires the person owning up to the mistake...which Gym refuses to do. He had like 30+ chances to do the right thing, but he denies. I guess you need to explain to me how someone deserves a second chance when they can't take responsibility for their mistake in the first place.

2) Well, I'm not perfect, but......I've never cheated on my wife, or sexually assaulted anyone. I reported abuse when I suspected it was taking place with a student of mine, as opposed to looking the other way when BEING TOLD repeatedly about things that were going on. So, do I think I'm better that Jordan and Trump? Yeah...maybe a little bit. I'd hope you do too with regards to yourself.

3) I've voted for Rs, Ds, and Ls. You're free to think whatever you want, but you don't know squat.

4) Do I think that people on a medical advisory board know more about medicine than 99% of the people on here, including me, when it comes to medical issues and looking at what's going on? Yes.

 

[Nebraska_Reality]

unless you have something concrete I would appreciate you keeping your unimformed opinions to yourself. the medical advisory boards have not provided anything concerning their due diligence. wish they would. instead of accepting no explanation it would be prudent of all of us to question the basis of their recommendations

You're right....a bunch of medical experts, far more educated and knowledgeable than either one of us, didn't do something so simple as what you mentioned.

It isn't the B1G, but here are links to the report the PAC-12 issued/ desired outcomes they are seeking before moving forward, and the reasons why they are not. No...not a bunch of stats, but conclusions. No...we're not going to see data from any conference....even the ones that end up playing. Also, I have linked the list of people involved on their advisory board; you'll see that it isn't just a who's who of government bureaucrats....

https://xs.pac-12.com/2020-08/Pac-12 Covid-19 Return to Play Considerations 08.10.2020.pdf

https://xs.pac-12.com/2020-08/Pac-12 COVID-19 Medical Advisory Committee.pdf

If you're going to be demanding data from conferences that aren't playing, then you should also be demanding the data from conference that are playing.

 

[huntered]

You're right....a bunch of medical experts, far more educated and knowledgeable than either one of us, didn't do something so simple as what you mentioned.

It isn't the B1G, but here are links to the report the PAC-12 issued/ desired outcomes they are seeking before moving forward, and the reasons why they are not. No...not a bunch of stats, but conclusions. No...we're not going to see data from any conference....even the ones that end up playing. Also, I have linked the list of people involved on their advisory board; you'll see that it isn't just a who's who of government bureaucrats....

https://xs.pac-12.com/2020-08/Pac-12 Covid-19 Return to Play Considerations 08.10.2020.pdf

https://xs.pac-12.com/2020-08/Pac-12 COVID-19 Medical Advisory Committee.pdf

If you're going to be demanding data from conferences that aren't playing, then you should also be demanding the data from conference that are playing.

point no. 1 speak for yourself on knowledge and education
point no. 2 a very good and varied list of "experts" from the pac
point no. 3 please see post and compliments for espn article that does list specifics from various conferences

finally, personally dammed tired of our media just saying "an unnamed source" or in the big's case "a group of medical experts". for the time being, why cant they tell us what they know or think they know. appearing to cloak information in secrecy draws suspicion.

 

[Nebraska_Reality]

point no. 1 speak for yourself on knowledge and education
point no. 2 a very good and varied list of "experts" from the pac
point no. 3 please see post and compliments for espn article that does list specifics from various conferences

finally, personally dammed tired of our media just saying "an unnamed source" or in the big's case "a group of medical experts". for the time being, why cant they tell us what they know or think they know. appearing to cloak information in secrecy draws suspicion.

I don't know why they can't. They didn't tell me.

 

[John_J_Rambo]

You're right....a bunch of medical experts, far more educated and knowledgeable than either one of us, didn't do something so simple as what you mentioned.

It isn't the B1G, but here are links to the report the PAC-12 issued/ desired outcomes they are seeking before moving forward, and the reasons why they are not. No...not a bunch of stats, but conclusions. No...we're not going to see data from any conference....even the ones that end up playing. Also, I have linked the list of people involved on their advisory board; you'll see that it isn't just a who's who of government bureaucrats....

https://xs.pac-12.com/2020-08/Pac-12 Covid-19 Return to Play Considerations 08.10.2020.pdf

https://xs.pac-12.com/2020-08/Pac-12 COVID-19 Medical Advisory Committee.pdf

If you're going to be demanding data from conferences that aren't playing, then you should also be demanding the data from conference that are playing.

from that document:

Our statistics to date indicate that Pac-12 institutions have been relatively successful in returning student-athletes to exercise without an undue risk in viral transmission, as almost all new cases have been a result of activities outside of the athletic departments.

the 'conclusions' that led to postponement:
-high community prevalence and 'likely' unsafe travel on commercial airplanes
-unknown cardiac issues (fair and warranted)
-need for more and faster testing

I can see why other medical boards so far are deeming football safe, and I can see why ultra arch conservative drs (who already don't like football) say it's too dangerous.

I can't really see why anyone would argue this is any more definitive than what's been said on this board (literally all 3 points have been covered ad nauseum)

these folks also outline when it's 'safe' to return to football: LESS THAN 1 CASE PER 100,000 PEOPLE PER DAY

seems reasonable.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

from that document:

Our statistics to date indicate that Pac-12 institutions have been relatively successful in returning student-athletes to exercise without an undue risk in viral transmission, as almost all new cases have been a result of activities outside of the athletic departments.

the 'conclusions' that led to postponement:
-high community prevalence and 'likely' unsafe travel on commercial airplanes
-unknown cardiac issues (fair and warranted)
-need for more and faster testing

I can see why other medical boards so far are deeming football safe, and I can see why ultra arch conservative drs (who already don't like football) say it's too dangerous.

I can't really see why anyone would argue this is any more definitive than what's been said on this board (literally all 3 points have been covered ad nauseum)

these folks also outline when it's 'safe' to return to football: LESS THAN 1 CASE PER 100,000 PEOPLE PER DAY

seems reasonable.

Take it up with the author, I didn't write it.

 

[John_J_Rambo]

Take it up with the author, I didn't write it.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

from that document:

Our statistics to date indicate that Pac-12 institutions have been relatively successful in returning student-athletes to exercise without an undue risk in viral transmission, as almost all new cases have been a result of activities outside of the athletic departments.

the 'conclusions' that led to postponement:
-high community prevalence and 'likely' unsafe travel on commercial airplanes
-unknown cardiac issues (fair and warranted)
-need for more and faster testing

I can see why other medical boards so far are deeming football safe, and I can see why ultra arch conservative drs (who already don't like football) say it's too dangerous.

I can't really see why anyone would argue this is any more definitive than what's been said on this board (literally all 3 points have been covered ad nauseum)

these folks also outline when it's 'safe' to return to football: LESS THAN 1 CASE PER 100,000 PEOPLE PER DAY

seems reasonable.

OK, in all seriousness, when I read the article, I see where it addressed the resumption of activities, but I didn't see where it addressed individual schools. If that makes sense. So if 10 of the 12 schools are in communities with less than 1 case per 100,000 people per day, do they have to wait until the other 2 schools meet that threshold as well? Hell we may never see the PAC 12 play another sporting event.

 

[RedMyMind]

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

View embedded media

but will conferences apologize to the Big Ten and the PAC 12 when it comes out that the Big Ten and the PAC 12 were right????? That's the real question.

 

[DaServo]

but will conferences apologize to the Big Ten and the PAC 12 when it comes out that the Big Ten and the PAC 12 were right????? That's the real question.

They are right and regardless of the posturing I don’t see a season being completed even if they try to start one. What escapes people is the liability involved for everyone, the least of which concerns players. States are enacting laws that places a burden on employers including universities. If you get COVId it’s automatically assumed you got it from work and unemployment is expedited, worker’s comp is available along with other liability if the employee seeks further damages. It’s a fools errand to attempt running an entire football operation while exposing the employer.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

They are right and regardless of the posturing I don’t see a season being completed even if they try to start one. What escapes people is the liability involved for everyone, the least of which concerns players. States are enacting laws that places a burden on employers including universities. If you get COVId it’s automatically assumed you got it from work and unemployment is expedited, worker’s comp is available along with other liability if the employee seeks further damages. It’s a fools errand to attempt running an entire football operation while exposing the employer.

I'm sorry, I was informed earlier, possibly in another thread, by @Nebraska_Reality, that it is required that you read all of the posts made by a poster before replying to that poster.

You see if you read through all of the threads, and pay particular attention to my posts, you will see the post you replied to was dripping with sarcasm.

If you want to change the rules you need to talk to @Nebraska_Reality. Of course he will tell you that it wasn't his opinion and to take it up with Herbstreit.

Posted tongue in cheek. Have a great night.

 

[John_J_Rambo]

They are right and regardless of the posturing I don’t see a season being completed even if they try to start one. What escapes people is the liability involved for everyone, the least of which concerns players. States are enacting laws that places a burden on employers including universities. If you get COVId it’s automatically assumed you got it from work and unemployment is expedited, worker’s comp is available along with other liability if the employee seeks further damages. It’s a fools errand to attempt running an entire football operation while exposing the employer.

good thing the vast majority of college football players aren't legally recognized as employees

 

[leodisflowers]

You're right....a bunch of medical experts, far more educated and knowledgeable than either one of us, didn't do something so simple as what you mentioned.

It isn't the B1G, but here are links to the report the PAC-12 issued/ desired outcomes they are seeking before moving forward, and the reasons why they are not. No...not a bunch of stats, but conclusions. No...we're not going to see data from any conference....even the ones that end up playing. Also, I have linked the list of people involved on their advisory board; you'll see that it isn't just a who's who of government bureaucrats....

https://xs.pac-12.com/2020-08/Pac-12 Covid-19 Return to Play Considerations 08.10.2020.pdf

https://xs.pac-12.com/2020-08/Pac-12 COVID-19 Medical Advisory Committee.pdf

If you're going to be demanding data from conferences that aren't playing, then you should also be demanding the data from conference that are playing.

Shouldn't you just be on the Colorado board discussing Pac-12 football.

 

[JaySker402]

So this spring schedule.... what about early enrollees. Are they eligible to play 5 seasons then, as they would be within 4 years? Any chance that could actually be a positive in recruiting?

 

[leodisflowers]

I think we will probably learn by Friday what the fate is. I think NU is going to keep pressing, but will probably fall in line by Friday. It's too bad we couldn't get Ohio St. on board. They were the key.

 

[vs540husker]

 

[scarletred]

I think we will probably learn by Friday what the fate is. I think NU is going to keep pressing, but will probably fall in line by Friday. It's too bad we couldn't get Ohio St. on board. They were the key.

It sucks that that nobody want’s to play football bad enough to at least give it ago like the other 3 conferences...

So frustrating..

 

[WHCSC]

I think we will probably learn by Friday what the fate is. I think NU is going to keep pressing, but will probably fall in line by Friday. It's too bad we couldn't get Ohio St. on board. They were the key.

Statement by University of Nebraska-Lincoln Chancellor Ronnie Green and University of Nebraska System President Ted Carter:
“The University of Nebraska-Lincoln is a fully committed member of the Big Ten Conference. It is an unparalleled athletic and academic alliance.

We have the greatest fans in college athletics. This has been a difficult and disappointing week for the Husker family. We all look forward to the day when we can cheer on our student-athletes, on the field and in the arena.”

 

[inWV]

There was a world where college FB could have been played in the fall. Americans began to walk away from that world after May 1, rather than driving case counts down through Memorial Day and standing up legit testing and contact tracing. Simple things like an actual commitment to wearing facial coverings once it was realized they were helpful would have been a big help.
But none of that happened and of course, that was predicted. Denial of reality (bordering on delusion) doesn't cancel reality. Covid doesn't care what your opinion of it is. It's going to do what it wants.
I'm disappointed, but I knew this day was coming.

 

[leodisflowers]

Statement by University of Nebraska-Lincoln Chancellor Ronnie Green and University of Nebraska System President Ted Carter:
“The University of Nebraska-Lincoln is a fully committed member of the Big Ten Conference. It is an unparalleled athletic and academic alliance.

We have the greatest fans in college athletics. This has been a difficult and disappointing week for the Husker family. We all look forward to the day when we can cheer on our student-athletes, on the field and in the arena.”

The white flag has been raised.

 

[John_J_Rambo]

There was a world where college FB could have been played in the fall. Americans began to walk away from that world after May 1, rather than driving case counts down through Memorial Day and standing up legit testing and contact tracing. Simple things like an actual commitment to wearing facial coverings once it was realized they were helpful would have been a big help.
But none of that happened and of course, that was predicted. Denial of reality (bordering on delusion) doesn't cancel reality. Covid doesn't care what your opinion of it is. It's going to do what it wants.
I'm disappointed, but I knew this day was coming.

Americans were told to flatten the curve to keep hospitals from being overwhelmed. We did that. Then the goalposts moved.

 

[dinglefritz]

There was a world where college FB could have been played in the fall. Americans began to walk away from that world after May 1, rather than driving case counts down through Memorial Day and standing up legit testing and contact tracing. Simple things like an actual commitment to wearing facial coverings once it was realized they were helpful would have been a big help.
But none of that happened and of course, that was predicted. Denial of reality (bordering on delusion) doesn't cancel reality. Covid doesn't care what your opinion of it is. It's going to do what it wants.
I'm disappointed, but I knew this day was coming.

Mask wearing wasn't going to change this situation given the criteria being used to make the determination of whether to play or not. The most recent concern about the POTENTIAL of myocarditis from the virus was the tipping point. The number of cases in the footprint states had nothing to do with this decision. Unfortunately given that fear of myocarditis, we may never have college sports again given that influenza can and does cause myocarditis as well.

 

[JoelBittner]

https://www.history.com/topics/middle-ages/pandemics-timeline

Click on the link and ask yourself this question: which one of these did we agree to where masks and shelter in place till a cure was found????

A: none

We're setting a precedent, that if it becomes the norm, we'll be destroying our social and economic system at least once every generation. And I want to emphasize, doing that to ourselves will lower our standard of living and won't protect us from the random nature of reality.

 

[jflores]

https://www.history.com/topics/middle-ages/pandemics-timeline

Click on the link and ask yourself this question: which one of these did we agree to where masks and shelter in place till a cure was found????

A: none

We're setting a precedent, that if it becomes the norm, we'll be destroying our social and economic system at least once every generation. And I want to emphasize, doing that to ourselves will lower our standard of living and won't protect us from the random nature of reality.

Agree but things change. The environment has changed which has altered what a 11th century leprosy suffer and your average American salaryman has to choose from.

Its no longer the economic norm to go out to the north 40 come hell or high water or starve as it was even just 100 and some years ago. One can shelter in place and work in many jobs just as easily as we can park our fat American butts at corporate communal place of work.

And that's before consideration of the fact that most of the plagues listed in your link there had little to no understanding of what was medically happening to them and could just as reasonably explained that "God hates me" or "Satan has taken me".

Now granted, not everyone can do this, there are people that still must farm, or work in a factory, or on a jobsite somewhere and that's where the political rub comes in alot of how we respond to things and what's appropriate.

 

[TheBeav815]

The longer I think about this the larger this looms in my mind:

The players in a couple conferences started to raise the specter of collectively bargaining whether they're really a players' union or not. The premise was established at that point of, The perception will be (fairly or unfairly) that you're putting players' lives on the line so you can make your CFB money. When there' a lot of money on the table and somebody feels hard-done-by, that's when the lawyers start doing what they do.

Also, don't underestimate the union-busting effect of not having a season right now. Players from two conferences put their toes in that water of, "If you're gonna run us out there, then we have terms and conditions." I don't think they take that step without a pandemic.

 

[dinglefritz]

Agree but things change. The environment has changed which has altered what a 11th century leprosy suffer and your average American salaryman has to choose from.

Its no longer the economic norm to go out to the north 40 come hell or high water or starve as it was even just 100 and some years ago. One can shelter in place and work in many jobs just as easily as we can park our fat American butts at corporate communal place of work.

And that's before consideration of the fact that most of the plagues listed in your link there had little to no understanding of what was medically happening to them and could just as reasonably explained that "God hates me" or "Satan has taken me".

Now granted, not everyone can do this, there are people that still must farm, or work in a factory, or on a jobsite somewhere and that's where the political rub comes in alot of how we respond to things and what's appropriate.

The problem for the average American is that the people calling the shots can virtually all work from home. Joe Six Pack has to drag his ass to a real job and punch the clock in order to feed his family and keep a roof over his head. At some point the government telling landlords and lenders to forget about collecting the payment has to end. I guess they can all move in to hotels in New York City and L.A with the rest of the homeless.

 

[jflores]

The problem for the average American is that the people calling the shots can virtually all work from home. Joe Six Pack has to drag his ass to a real job and punch the clock in order to feed his family and keep a roof over his head. At some point the government telling landlords and lenders to forget about collecting the payment has to end. I guess they can all move in to hotels in New York City and L.A with the rest of the homeless.

Right you apparently didn't read or care to acknowledge the part in my post where I said everyone can't do that.

 

[dinglefritz]

Right you apparently didn't read or care to acknowledge the part in my post where I said everyone can't do that.

No I did. I was reinforcing that comment.

 

[inWV]

Americans were told to flatten the curve to keep hospitals from being overwhelmed. We did that. Then the goalposts moved.

Nationally, the US overall "flattened" the curve from 29-31K cases per day [31.5K when Trump sent his liberate (insert blue state) tweet], to 20-21K by late May. And about 2 weeks after Memorial Day, we were off to the races again. Now it appears that we will settle on a baseline of cases at around 50K per day, with 1K deaths per day. This may be cool with you, so let's go ahead and play us some FB. But it isn't with a majority of Americans. Yes, flatten the curve to keep hospitals from being overwhelmed. But that's when you and others quit listening. In order for the economy to open up safely, we had to do more. We skipped the more step and just opened up in some critical geographic areas.

Folks like you wanted all the goodies that came with crushing the number of cases down. Well, that didn't happen and there are consequences for that. I come from a sports family, competed in HS and college, and both of my kids run XC and track. Lost a track season already and my older kid may miss out on a coaching opportunity due to this thing.

 

[John_J_Rambo]

Nationally, the US overall "flattened" the curve from 29-31K cases per day [31.5K when Trump sent his liberate (insert blue state) tweet], to 20-21K by late May. And about 2 weeks after Memorial Day, we were off to the races again. Now it appears that we will settle on a baseline of cases at around 50K per day, with 1K deaths per day. This may be cool with you, so let's go ahead and play us some FB. But it isn't with a majority of Americans. Yes, flatten the curve to keep hospitals from being overwhelmed. But that's when you and others quit listening. In order for the economy to open up safely, we had to do more. We skipped the more step and just opened up in some critical geographic areas.

Folks like you wanted all the goodies that came with crushing the number of cases down. Well, that didn't happen and there are consequences for that. I come from a sports family, competed in HS and college, and both of my kids run XC and track. Lost a track season already and my older kid may miss out on a coaching opportunity due to this thing.

thanks for telling me what 'I', a person who lives with an oncology nurse, began quarantining mid-February and never enters a public place without a mask on, did to cancel football season.

the view from the ivory tower must be intoxicating.

 

[jflores]

thanks for telling me what 'I', a person who lives with an oncology nurse, began quarantining mid-February and never enters a public place without a mask on, did to cancel football season.

the view from the ivory tower must be intoxicating.

You're a G*d damn American hero, is what you are!

 

[John_J_Rambo]

You're a G*d damn American hero, is what you are!

internalizing >>>>>>> externalizing 100% of the time

the people pointing fingers are just as self-righteous as the people intentionally disregarding public health orders. two sides of the same coin.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

Again, look at the virus seasonality timetable. when it is your season you get Covid outbreaks.

 

[dinglefritz]

thanks for telling me what 'I', a person who lives with an oncology nurse, began quarantining mid-February and never enters a public place without a mask on, did to cancel football season.

the view from the ivory tower must be intoxicating.

Likewise, I've been following social distancing guidelines and wearing a mask in public places since early on. My 21 year old liberal college student....not so much.

 

[John_J_Rambo]

rock & hard place, defined.

 

[dinglefritz]

View embedded media

rock & hard place, defined.

so let them play up to 4 non-conference games and then still play a conference schedule in the spring. They're nuts if they think they can play 8 or more games in the spring and then come back for the fall. If anything no more than a round robin with division foes then a conference championship game in the spring should be played. Not allowing any games is strictly a power play that isn't logical.