70 team super league ...

[RedCap]

Equivalent support and resources? There's about 6 teams that will always have significantly more resources and support than the rest. Again, Ohio State literally spent $17M just to keep this years roster in tact, not sure of many other teams that can or are even willing to do that:

O$U
Oregon
Texas
Michigan
Tex A&M
Notre Dame
USC

After those, I think the next chunk would be your Bama's, Georgia's, Tennessee, Miami, LSU, Penn St, Nebraska. After that, there's a massive fall off imo which just means again that the rest of the league will always be at a severe disadvantage.

Actually I would now rephrase what is meant by equivalent support to be the amount of total revenue sharing a team can afford to pay its players in light of the House settlement terms. Those teams that can afford the maximum revenue sharing allowed will have a distinct advantage and ought to comprise the "super league" however many teams that is. It won't be 70.

 

[bigboxes]

regardless, this 70-team proposal might be the (next) end game for major college sports. the idea is to bring in the top 70 programs, divide them into tiers based on their value, and sell the product as a package rather than piecemeal as we see today. there would be uneven revenue distribution between tiers based on value.

the proposers forecast the top tier - teams like bama, uga, nd, and tosu - would make more revenue than under their current media contracts. the 70 programs would only play one another. g5 and lower division schools like tulane and boise would theoretically be left out to form their own consortium.

Shhhh... it will be over soon

 

[beaglehusker]

Why are you here, and where were you after the BYU embarrassment. Go back to your own board

 

[Zeke2005]

I work in Boulder and live in Boulder county. I have more personal reasons to want the CU/Deion hype to die a painful death.

Back in the day, we wanted our opponents to do well because that might be needed to get us into the MNC game. With the CFP, maybe those motivations will resurface. This year, we might be able to lose only to OSU to have a chance. But if we also lose to IU, then we would be behind IU, OSU, PSU, and Oregon in the pecking order. Maybe also Illinois. In that case, CU doing well doesn’t help us.

Sorry guess I’m stuck in 2002 and the BCS computer rankings.

 

[Zeke2005]

Who would take K-State?

The Great Plains Athletic Conference in the NAIA

 

[Zeke2005]

There's going to be decent teams that will get left out or may want to not be in the top tier. Look at the best fcs teams. Better than a lot of low fbs teams. 70 is too many.

I agree, should be around 40 or leave all 135ish in it. The tiered system would be garbage as well. Some SEC and Big Ten schools would take a cut in funding. Why would they agree to this?

 

[huskerfan66]

the foundational concept is that football is a national game, second in popularity to the nfl. and that it is most valuable when the largest number of programs are represented across the nation. the 70-team league can then be sold at a premium over what current contracts in the sec and b10 offer. additionally, private equity is willing to pony up $9 billion for the rights which can be used by the programs for title 9, house, olympic sports, and other such costs.

They put in 9 billion. What's in it for them? Why give it to them? The league could pocket that money and use it for what you said

 

[huskerfan66]

I agree, should be around 40 or leave all 135ish in it. The tiered system would be garbage as well. Some SEC and Big Ten schools would take a cut in funding. Why would they agree to this?

If you're going to have a tiered system, wouldn't letting the b1g and $ec do their own thing be the same result? Nobody outside of those conference would be in the top tier of a 70 team super league anyway

 

[AVeritas]

They put in 9 billion. What's in it for them? Why give it to them? The league could pocket that money and use it for what you said

pocket the $9 billion they don't have? this is about selling the rights to a 70-team mega league, nfl lite. the rights have to be sold before the $9 billion is appropriated. the concept is that conferences today do a p'poor job marketing their product. as a whole it would be worth far more than even the top tier teams are receiving today. and someone is willing to put $9 billion on the table to prove that.

 

[AVeritas]

If you're going to have a tiered system, wouldn't letting the b1g and $ec do their own thing be the same result? Nobody outside of those conference would be in the top tier of a 70 team super league anyway

notre dame would certainly be in the top tier, likely clemson and fsu from the acc, perhaps a team or two from the b12 as well, likely byu perhaps cu.

 

[huskerfan66]

pocket the $9 billion they don't have? this is about selling the rights to a 70-team mega league, nfl lite. the rights have to be sold before the $9 billion is appropriated. the concept is that conferences today do a p'poor job marketing their product. as a whole it would be worth far more than even the top tier teams are receiving today. and someone is willing to put $9 billion on the table to prove that.

I don't see the upside. They aren't gifting 9 billion. They want something. If you're broke it makes sense.

 

[huskerfan66]

notre dame would certainly be in the top tier, likely clemson and fsu from the acc, perhaps a team or two from the b12 as well, likely byu perhaps cu.

ND yes I agree. Expansion isn't over but it's close. I don't think clemson or fsu would be top tier in value nor byu

 

[Huskers123456]

pocket the $9 billion they don't have? this is about selling the rights to a 70-team mega league, nfl lite. the rights have to be sold before the $9 billion is appropriated. the concept is that conferences today do a p'poor job marketing their product. as a whole it would be worth far more than even the top tier teams are receiving today. and someone is willing to put $9 billion on the table to prove that.

Your conference might be doing a poor job of marketing but our conference is making money hand over fist.

There is zero incentive for any team in the Big 10 or SEC to deviate from the status quo. Not one. The powerful teams like OSU and Bama don't have a reason to take a chance of upsetting the balance of power. The teams like Maryland or Vandy have zero reasons to take a chance of getting left out in the cold.

 

[AVeritas]

I don't see the upside. They aren't gifting 9 billion. They want something. If you're broke it makes sense.

$9 billion is the immediate upside, plus the additional revenue from selling the product holistically rather than piece mean as done today. if you think a bunch of academics and a.d.s who never saw an mba class can match negotiating wits with venture capitalists, like paul edgerley or mitt romney, you're mistaken.

 

[AVeritas]

Your conference might be doing a poor job of marketing but our conference is making money hand over fist.

There is zero incentive for any team in the Big 10 or SEC to deviate from the status quo. Not one. The powerful teams like OSU and Bama don't have a reason to take a chance of upsetting the balance of power. The teams like Maryland or Vandy have zero reasons to take a chance of getting left out in the cold.

the cases they are laying out says you are completely wrong. the each b10 and sec school in the 70 would see larger returns. otherwise, this would be senseless.

 

[Huskers123456]

the cases they are laying out says you are completely wrong. the each b10 and sec school in the 70 would see larger returns. otherwise, this would be senseless.

It is senseless.... that's why it won't happen.

 

[king_kong_]

Your conference might be doing a poor job of marketing but our conference is making money hand over fist.

There is zero incentive for any team in the Big 10 or SEC to deviate from the status quo. Not one. The powerful teams like OSU and Bama don't have a reason to take a chance of upsetting the balance of power. The teams like Maryland or Vandy have zero reasons to take a chance of getting left out in the cold.

This does a lot of assuming that the status quo will continue

It won’t

Completely unsustainable

Collective bargaining is coming. An overly paired down product won’t return nearly as much as a national one at some point.

I’ve said all along it should be 64 teams. 70 sounds good, too.

Rich will stay rich, don’t worry.

 

[V-Doub]

They put in 9 billion. What's in it for them? Why give it to them? The league could pocket that money and use it for what you said

Whole thing sounds like some sort of corporate socialism to financially level the playing field for about 30 non-SEC/B1G schools. Plus, the B1G and SEC don’t need that corporate money. Why let someone buy a share of your business if you don’t need their investment money and you already own the product everyone wants?

Seems like a ruse to convince the B1G and SEC to hitch themselves to about 30ish programs they don’t want or need. All while financially weakening the B1G and SEC to the benefit of those same 30ish schools. When you have a massive oil reserve on your property, you don’t sell off your land to your competitors. I’m sure there will be many more landscape altering changes in CFB… but this 70 team welfare project for current Big XII and ACC teams is a ridiculous pipe dream.

 

[huskerfan66]

$9 billion is the immediate upside, plus the additional revenue from selling the product holistically rather than piece mean as done today. if you think a bunch of academics and a.d.s who never saw an mba class can match negotiating wits with venture capitalists, like paul edgerley or mitt romney, you're mistaken.

We don't need the 9 billion. Hire/create our own to market. Someone's doing a good job negotiating

 

[V-Doub]

This does a lot of assuming that the status quo will continue

It won’t

Completely unsustainable

Collective bargaining is coming. An overly paired down product won’t return nearly as much as a national one at some point.

I’ve said all along it should be 64 teams. 70 sounds good, too.

Rich will stay rich, don’t worry.

Landscape shifting change will continue. But the B1G and SEC will not participate in anything that weakens them in any way. They drive the boat and they’re not gonna let any third party corporation into the captains chambers. Makes no sense to sell off part our product to a third party that you don’t need to be successful. What am I missing?

 

[king_kong_]

Landscape shifting change will continue. But the B1G and SEC will not participate in anything that weakens them in any way. They drive the boat and they’re not gonna let any third party corporation into the captains chambers. Makes no sense to sell off part our product to a third party that you don’t need to be successful. What am I missing?

They don’t drive the boat

The TV networks do

FOX owns the B1G and will gladly participate in any discussion that involves them making more money

That is what you’re missing. The “P2” are completely beholden to their broadcast business partners, which also enjoy ratings for games outside of those two conferences.

 

[V-Doub]

They don’t drive the boat

The TV networks do

FOX owns the B1G and will gladly participate in any discussion that involves them making more money

That is what you’re missing. The “P2” are completely beholden to their broadcast business partners, which also enjoy ratings for games outside of those two conferences.

B1G and SEC have the leverage. Cause FOX and ESPNs product is shit without them. They have the power to tell FOX to get fvcked, we’ll take our product to CBS/NBC/Other if FOX wants to make a deal that will weaken either or both leagues. SEC and B1G do drive the boat and FOX will do whatever they have to keep the Big2 from going alone and signing with another network(s).

 

[huskerfan66]

They don’t drive the boat

The TV networks do

FOX owns the B1G and will gladly participate in any discussion that involves them making more money

That is what you’re missing. The “P2” are completely beholden to their broadcast business partners, which also enjoy ratings for games outside of those two conferences.

Which can be renegotiated. Some venture capital group not so much

 

[king_kong_]

B1G and SEC have the leverage. Cause FOX and ESPNs product is shit without them. They have the power to tell FOX to get fvcked, we’ll take our product to CBS/NBC/Other if FOX wants to make a deal that will weaken either or both leagues. SEC and B1G do drive the boat and FOX will do whatever they have to keep the Big2 from going alone and signing with another network(s).

No, they don’t.

B1G sold its football broadcast rights to FOX, which is also a majority owner of the B1G Network.

Sorry. B1G’s leverage has already been liquidated.

It’s why FOX execs were not only at the table with the B1G negotiating with NBC and CBS during this latest deal, but also executed the documents.

Feel free to look all this up on your own. Every word is true, and was reported on right on this very board as it was happening.

 

[dinglefritz]

Don't wait by the mailbox for the invite to the P2. It won't be coming. 😂

Anything that is associated with Disney needs to be scrapped immediately.

Disney has f’d up every company they’ve touched.

 

[TFrazier]

B1G and SEC have the leverage. Cause FOX and ESPNs product is shit without them. They have the power to tell FOX to get fvcked, we’ll take our product to CBS/NBC/Other if FOX wants to make a deal that will weaken either or both leagues. SEC and B1G do drive the boat and FOX will do whatever they have to keep the Big2 from going alone and signing with another network(s).

No, they don’t.

B1G sold its football broadcast rights to FOX, which is also a majority owner of the B1G Network.

Sorry. B1G’s leverage has already been liquidated.

It’s why FOX execs were not only at the table with the B1G negotiating with NBC and CBS during this latest deal, but also executed the documents.

Feel free to look all this up on your own. Every word is true, and was reported on right on this very board as it was happening.

According to this Fox owns 61% of BTN.

Insider: Fox, Big Ten made a big bet on TV future; it paid off Thursday

Insider on the big bet that paid off for the Big Ten and Fox with new TV rights deal.

www.indystar.com

 

[king_kong_]

According to this Fox owns 61% of BTN.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5658646/2024/07/25/big-ten-football-tv-partners-schedule/

B1G’s dash for cash has always been extraordinarily short-sighted.

Its inability to negotiate on its own behalf and/or recognize its own value is astonishing.

FOX obtained its initial majority share as a penalty reward for the B1G cancelling the season during COVID, thus breaching its contract with its inability to fulfill the inventory promised. FOX didn’t have to pay a single additional cent for it.

Now we are mere passengers on FOX’s train, with very little say as to where it’s headed.

The fact most people don’t know this and opt for ignorant conference elitism is hilarious and says a lot about both their business sense and college football fandom.

I, of course, have been posting about this for years.

 

[TFrazier]

B1G’s dash for cash has always been extraordinarily short-sighted.

Its inability to negotiate on its own behalf and/or recognize its own value is astonishing.

Now we are mere passengers on FOX’s train, with very little say as to where it’s headed.

The fact most people don’t know this and opt for ignorant conference elitism is hilarious and says a lot about both their business sense and college football fandom.

I, of course, have been posting about this for years.

Yep…a lot of assumptions are made on message boards when a simple Google search will provide most of the answers.

 

[king_kong_]

By the way, the SEC still does have leverage because it is not run by incompetent fools.

 

[schuele]

B1G’s dash for cash has always been extraordinarily short-sighted.

Its inability to negotiate on its own behalf and/or recognize its own value is astonishing.

FOX obtained its initial majority share as a penalty reward for the B1G cancelling the season during COVID, thus breaching its contract with its inability to fulfill the inventory promised. FOX didn’t have to pay a single additional cent for it.

Now we are mere passengers on FOX’s train, with very little say as to where it’s headed.

The fact most people don’t know this and opt for ignorant conference elitism is hilarious and says a lot about both their business sense and college football fandom.

I, of course, have been posting about this for years.

Yeah I don't really know why the B1G thought it was so critical to hitch itself to FOX's streaming service. The FOX Sports app is very good - I like using it. But the BTN app was just fine too, and you still have to subscribe to BTN to watch it on the FOX Sports app. So in my opinion, anyone who cares enough about Big Ten athletics to subscribe to BTN, was going to use either app. You're not gaining new viewers.

 

[V-Doub]

No, they don’t.

B1G sold its football broadcast rights to FOX, which is also a majority owner of the B1G Network.

Sorry. B1G’s leverage has already been liquidated.

It’s why FOX execs were not only at the table with the B1G negotiating with NBC and CBS during this latest deal, but also executed the documents.

Feel free to look all this up on your own. Every word is true, and was reported on right on this very board as it was happening.

According to this Fox owns 61% of BTN.

Insider: Fox, Big Ten made a big bet on TV future; it paid off Thursday

Insider on the big bet that paid off for the Big Ten and Fox with new TV rights deal.

www.indystar.com

B1G football is still the product. They are FOX’s cash cow and FOX wants to keep it that way. When their contract is up for negotiation, FOX won’t do anything that will piss off their golden goose. I guess we can revisit this in a few years, but I don’t see any single 70 team super league in the future. It will be multiple super conferences or one smaller super league that breaks away from the rest of CFB.

 

[king_kong_]

B1G football is still the product. They are FOX’s cash cow and FOX wants to keep it that way. When their contract is up for negotiation, FOX won’t do anything that will piss off their golden goose. I guess we can revisit this in a few years, but I don’t see any single 70 team super league in the future. It will be multiple super conferences or one smaller super league that breaks away from the rest of CFB.

Again, the B1G’s football broadcast rights are no longer theirs to sell

There is no “contract up” with FOX

It is their product, the B1G is just obliged to deliver it

Any super league will be created by networks, not the B1G

Hardly any athletic depts turn a profit even with the 8-figure annual broadcast infusion. FOX would be fine without college football. The NFL is its actual cash cow, and they have a very diversified portfolio.

College sports (all of them) would cease to exist without broadcast partners at this stage. All its eggs are in that one basket.

Anyone who honestly believes the leverage is with the schools is simply and obviously incorrect.

 

[V-Doub]

According to this Fox owns 61% of BTN.

Insider: Fox, Big Ten made a big bet on TV future; it paid off Thursday

Insider on the big bet that paid off for the Big Ten and Fox with new TV rights deal.

www.indystar.com

Also, owning 61% of a conference network does not = owning 61% of a conference.

 

[V-Doub]

Again, the B1G’s football broadcast rights are no longer theirs to sell

There is no “contract up” with FOX

It is their product, the B1G is just obliged to deliver it

Any super league will be created by networks, not the B1G

Fox owns part of the broadcast network, not the product. The networks provide access to the product, but they’re nothing without the product. B1G and SEC will dictate the terms in the end. If they (B1G and SEC) don’t like the direction the networks are going, they will demand and only agree to the status quo until the networks bring them something that maintains their financial dominance. Contracts expire, and when they do the party with the product always wins.

 

[king_kong_]

Fox owns part of the broadcast network, not the product. The networks provide access to the product, but they’re nothing without the product. B1G and SEC will dictate the terms in the end. If they (B1G and SEC) don’t like the direction the networks are going, they will demand and only agree to the status quo until the networks bring them something that maintains their financial dominance. Contracts expire, and when they do the party with the product always wins.

FOX owns the football broadcast rights as part of the 2017 deal.

Sorry. Our lot is cast.

 

[V-Doub]

Also, owning 61% of a conference network does not = owning 61% of a conference.

Laugh all you want, but I suggest we revisit this in a few years when nothing like the OP’s proposal exists.

 

[king_kong_]

Laugh all you want, but I suggest we revisit this in a few years when nothing like the OP’s proposal exists.

Whatever happens will not be up to the b1g

It can’t be, because we have sold our seat at the table

For our part, it will be up to FOX

 

[V-Doub]

Whatever happens will not be up to the b1g

For our part, it will be up to FOX

We’ll just have to agree to disagree. The notion that the party with the product has no say in the future direction of their partnerships only goes against every basic economic principle. But that really wasn’t my main point, whatever happens, it will look nothing like OP’s proposal.

 

[TFrazier]

Laugh all you want, but I suggest we revisit this in a few years when nothing like the OP’s proposal exists.

Fox also had a huge role in the last Big 10 expansion.

 

[king_kong_]

We’ll just have to agree to disagree. The notion that the party with the product has no say in the future direction of their partnerships only goes against every basic economic principle. But that really wasn’t my main point, whatever happens, it will look nothing like OP’s proposal.

This is not my opinion. It is literal fact.

The B1G sold its broadcast rights to FOX.

The conference is an outsourced manufacturer of college football games which are owned by FOX for them to distribute as they see fit.

If it sounds like bad business, that’s because it is.

Which is why I’ve been shouting this from the rooftops since it took place. It was incomprehensibly incompetent for the B1G to agree to this, and remains so today. Will only get worse in the future.