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Miles should be done....

coachDubs said:
I never said that. You were corrected so don't spin it to a different discussion. Own up to the mistake.

Oh, speaking of upsets, Gardner Webb says hello.
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I never said that you said what you are claiming I said you said. How's that for a bunch of gobbledegook? I posed the question...hence the question mark...if upsetting a better team from time to time trumps a sub .500 career at NU? Nothing more...nothing less. The "spin" you reference was simply meant to evoke a logical approach to the discussion on talent vs coaching...again...nothing more...nothing less. Nothing sinister meant...just wanting what we all want...a basketball team that wins games and can advance at the end of the year. Right now, we are a tad short.

I don't think I know Mr. Webb but if you see him tell him hello from me. I'm outta here.........
 
WCDC said:
Many comments over the season of the "talent" Miles recruited. I said it before...I see MVC talent trying to compete in the B1G. NU looks like Creighton the first year they went into the Big East. The talent level wasn't there to compete and their record showed it. Miles recruits at a level that simply can't compete with the better teams in the league. McDermott upped his recruiting and the results showed. Miles seems content to recruit lesser talented players and the results show. Just my opine.....
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So the rival rankings were wrong on all his players? These are young talented players, let them grown in the system for two years.
 
Nebraska is traditionally one of the worst basketball programs in the country. Expecting a coach to be able to significantly change that in even 10 years is unrealistic. Our only hope to get out of the cellar is to stick with a guy long term. Every time we blow up the program because we apply the standards of improvement of our football program to our basketball program we just reset the clock and get further away from doing anything. Things aren't great but changing coaches hasn't worked since Nee left...maybe it's time to just give someone 15-20 years and let it play out.
 
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Huskers_Rule said:
That would be a TERRIBLE decision. This team has YOUNG talent and will improve regardless the next two years.
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So why waste their growth on a mediocre game coach like Miles? But, there are no guarantees...even with hiring a new coach. Just because this team is young it doesn't mean our issues on offense under Miles will be fixed. Nor does it mean Molinari will be worth his paycheck.
 
shine003 said:
Nebraska is traditionally one of the worst basketball programs in the country. Expecting a coach to be able to significantly change that in even 10 years is unrealistic. Our only hope to get out of the cellar is to stick with a guy long term. Every time we blow up the program because we apply the standards of improvement of our football program to our basketball program we just reset the clock and get further away from doing anything. Things aren't great but changing coaches hasn't worked since Nee left...maybe it's time to just give someone 15-20 years and let it play out.
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I agree, if Miles had crappy young talent I would not say that but clearly the next two years should be MUCH better. If they are not then I think all Husker fans will be on the same page.
 
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huskerbaseball13 said:
So why waste their growth on a mediocre game coach like Miles? But, there are no guarantees...even with hiring a new coach. Just because this team is young it doesn't mean our issues on offense under Miles will be fixed. Nor does it mean Molinari will be worth his paycheck.
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It all depends on who you could get. I don't think we have the marbles to get any proven Power 5 coach which puts us in the gamble on a lower division coach that has a record of success which means we are looking for another Miles. Who is the best Power 5 coach you think we could attract?
 
shine003 said:
Nebraska is traditionally one of the worst basketball programs in the country. Expecting a coach to be able to significantly change that in even 10 years is unrealistic. Our only hope to get out of the cellar is to stick with a guy long term. Every time we blow up the program because we apply the standards of improvement of our football program to our basketball program we just reset the clock and get further away from doing anything. Things aren't great but changing coaches hasn't worked since Nee left...maybe it's time to just give someone 15-20 years and let it play out.
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That would be the dumbest thing we could do. As the losses continue to rack up, Nebrasketball fans enthusiasm for the program will dwindle. At the very least, a new coach breathes new life into the fanbase on the program. At this rate, keep a guy like Miles 10 years and watch the PBA turn into the Bob. As Miles continues to lose more and more(it's been a lot)...it will be increasingly tougher on the recruiting trail. He needed to win this year. He didn't. If he's around next year he's coaching for his job. Also, I'm not sure I could stomach being 0-15 against Creighton.
 
Huskers_Rule said:
It all depends on who you could get. I don't think we have the marbles to get any proven Power 5 coach which puts us in the gamble on a lower division coach that has a record of success which means we are looking for another Miles. Who is the best Power 5 coach you think we could attract?
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I have no idea if we could. As I said earlier, if it's looking like we will just get another Miles we might as well keep him around for another year. Hopefully Eichorst has a good pulse on our prospects if he pulls the trigger.
 
Huskers_Rule said:
That would be a TERRIBLE decision. This team has YOUNG talent and will improve regardless the next two years.
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What happens when a handful transfer? Then your youth excuse gets to happen all over again. I have said it 1000 times. Youth is a pretty shitty excuse when it comes to basketball.
 
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The it's gonna take 10 years crowd is full of crap. The inferiority complex of the Nebrasketball fan is nauseating.

Creighton played in the MVC, had a bunch of MVC player except McDermott and won 27 games in the Big East and won an NCAA tournament game. 3 years later, they have reloaded their roster with a few transfers and a some decent HS recruiting and if not for an injury to their PG, they would be a legit elite 8 team. Why? Because they have an identity. They have 2 4 star high school players coming in next year, are in the final 3 for a top 15 player in the country and another 6'10 4 star player. Don't feed me that BS. For crying out loud Wichita St went to a final 4 in 2013.
 
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Tuco Salamanca said:
The it's gonna take 10 years crowd is full of crap. The inferiority complex of the Nebrasketball fan is nauseating.

Creighton played in the MVC, had a bunch of MVC player except McDermott and won 27 games in the Big East and won an NCAA tournament game. 3 years later, they have reloaded their roster with a few transfers and a some decent HS recruiting and if not for an injury to their PG, they would be a legit elite 8 team. Why? Because they have an identity. They have 2 4 star high school players coming in next year, are in the final 3 for a top 15 player in the country and another 6'10 4 star player. Don't feed me that BS. For crying out loud Wichita St went to a final 4 in 2013.
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all true but Creighton basketball players aren't way down in the pecking order amongst the athletes on campus like at Neb ... hell at Nebraska they probably play second fiddle to volleyball
 
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I think Miles will still be back next year, and that may well be the better option than firing him. But could we please stop with the "You CAN'T fire Miles unless you have a proven winner from a Power 5 team lined up!"

If that's the standard to which NU must hold itself, volleyball is the only sport that can change coaches - ever. Nebraska basketball isn't going to going to get a proven winner from a comparable conference. So if you want Miles back - fine. But making this argument over and over and over again is like saying you're open to a coaching change, but only if John Wooden comes back from the dead and volunteers to take the job.
 
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shine003 said:
Nebraska is traditionally one of the worst basketball programs in the country. Expecting a coach to be able to significantly change that in even 10 years is unrealistic.
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Northwestern is an even worse program than we are, yet Collins has turned them around in only 4 years. We'll see if he has sustained success, but considering that all of his players are underclassmen this year, there's a good chance he will.

Youth is not an excuse at this point in the season. Tai has played for 4 years, and Watson/Jacobson/Morrow/McVeigh have all played significant minutes for 2 full seasons. In college basketball terms, that is an eternity. You also have to remember that our 2014-15 team was one of the most experienced in the country and ranked in the preseason Top 25....and proceeded to lose its last 9 games and finish 13-18.
 
Harry Caray said:
Northwestern is an even worse program than we are, yet Collins has turned them around in only 4 years.
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Meh, not really worse unless you're putting weight in to the NIT. Collins has done a very nice job, but the B1G is down. Wait, or can we only say that when Miles is discussed?

All the different criterias confuse me...

Charlie Marlow said:
I remember when people say you can't fire BO unless you have some proven winner lined up...
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At least Randy isn't the only one referencing the silent minority, congrats.
 
coachDubs said:
Meh, not really worse unless you're putting weight in to the NIT. Collins has done a very nice job, but the B1G is down. Wait, or can we only say that when Miles is discussed?

All the different criterias confuse me...



At least Randy isn't the only one referencing the silent minority, congrats.
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So am I wrong?
 
coachDubs said:
Meh, not really worse unless you're putting weight in to the NIT. Collins has done a very nice job, but the B1G is down. Wait, or can we only say that when Miles is discussed?

All the different criterias confuse me...



At least Randy isn't the only one referencing the silent minority, congrats.
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;)
 
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OK then, forget about the posters. I just think if its clear that its not working for a coach, its time to move on. I don't like the whole 'dont fire him unless there is someone better lined up first' thinking. You are just stuck with Coach Failure for one more year and who knows if there will be any better candidates available the following year. And regardless of resume, there are no guarantees. You just have to bite the bullet sometimes.

But then again, maybe that one extra year is all they needed. Just like Saban at Mich St. He was on the hot seat and then he had his breakout season. He turned around and said 'adios, I'm going to LSU.'
 
Charlie Marlow said:
I don't like the whole 'dont fire him unless there is someone better lined up first' thinking.
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That doesn't even bother me so much, except when people define "someone better" as a total pipe dream.

Honest question: Is John Cook the only "proven winner from a Power 5 program" that NU has ever hired in any sport? Maybe I'm missing someone, but Cook is the only name I can come up with. And yet suddenly that's now the burden that has to be met to fire a coach?
 
Fire him or not. Land on the magic number on the coaching carousel and train the next quality programs head coach if NU gets lucky.
 
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coachDubs said:
Meh, not really worse unless you're putting weight in to the NIT. Collins has done a very nice job, but the B1G is down. Wait, or can we only say that when Miles is discussed?

All the different criterias confuse me...

.
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Agree the Big Ten is down for both teams. However one coach is 4 games better against the league this year than the other.

In their careers, one coach has gone

14-19 6-12
15-17 6-12
20-12 8-10
21-9 10-7

Showing steady improvement from year 1 to year 4 and will make the NCAA tournament this year.

The other is

15-18 5-13
19-11 11-7
13-18 5-13
16-18 6-12
12-17 6-11

Has not shown steady improvement from year 1 to year 5. And will be out of the post season for the 4th time in 5 years.

The first coach also has achieved his results with lesser talent.
 
I mean, I doubt we are going to get Bill Self or Coach K or equivalent so at that point there is no sure-fire picks. So this year or next, the new coach will come with risk involved. I don't think we improve our odds by waiting a year.
 
Tuco Salamanca said:
Agree the Big Ten is down for both teams. However one coach is 4 games better against the league this year than the other.

In their careers, one coach has gone

14-19 6-12
15-17 6-12
20-12 8-10
21-9 10-7

Showing steady improvement from year 1 to year 4 and will make the NCAA tournament this year.

The other is

15-18 5-13
19-11 11-7
13-18 5-13
16-18 6-12
12-17 6-11

Has not shown steady improvement from year 1 to year 5. And will be out of the post season for the 4th time in 5 years.

The first coach also has achieved his results with lesser talent.
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I would argue that NW now has more talent. And the bad thing(for us) is they bring back 80 some percent of scoring back next year. They will be very solid again next year.
 
huskerbaseball13 said:
I would argue that NW now has more talent. And the bad thing(for us) is they bring back 80 some percent of scoring back next year. They will be very solid again next year.
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Northwestern is worried that Coach K might hang it up soon and Collins will succeed him at Duke.

Now there's a burden I would like to see NU basketball bear someday.
 
Will the world end if Miles gets another year? No.
 
Tuco Salamanca said:
Agree the Big Ten is down for both teams. However one coach is 4 games better against the league this year than the other.

In their careers, one coach has gone

14-19 6-12
15-17 6-12
20-12 8-10
21-9 10-7

Showing steady improvement from year 1 to year 4 and will make the NCAA tournament this year.

The other is

15-18 5-13
19-11 11-7
13-18 5-13
16-18 6-12
12-17 6-11

Has not shown steady improvement from year 1 to year 5. And will be out of the post season for the 4th time in 5 years.

The first coach also has achieved his results with lesser talent.
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1 coach took his team dancing already, in a much tougher league (Did I do that right)

1 coach is on the verge of dancing, in the weakest the leagues ever been. (Did I do that right, part 2)

Congrats on improving 2 wins during the worst conference ever (part 3). Nobody gives a shit about record, ask Doc Sadler how that worked out.
 
I forgot, and this is for @WCDC as well:
  1. 0-1 v Purdue (1 TBD)
  2. 0-1 v Maryland
  3. 1-0 v Wisconsin
  4. 0-1 v Minnesota
  5. 0-1 v Michigan State
  6. 1-0 v Michigan
  7. n/a
  8. 1-0 v Iowa
  9. 0-2 v Illinois
  10. 1-0 v Ohio State
  11. 2-0 v Nebraska
  12. 1-1 v Indiana
  13. 1-0 v Penn State
  14. 2-0 v Rutgers
  • 1-3 against the top 4
  • 3-3 against the next wave
  • 6-1 against the Wednesday teams
NW went 4-1 against the bottom 4 last season, there's the 2 win improvement. They also went 1-5 against the top 4 last year. More games played against the bottom 4 and less games played against the top 4.

Congrats to Collins on taking care of business against the 4 worst teams in the conference. Without that, there's a good chance they aren't dancing. I like Chris and glad AF he has them dancing.

Records, I tell you, records...
 
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coachDubs said:
I forgot, and this is for @WCDC as well:
  1. 0-1 v Purdue (1 TBD)
  2. 0-1 v Maryland
  3. 1-0 v Wisconsin
  4. 0-1 v Minnesota
  5. 0-1 v Michigan State
  6. 1-0 v Michigan
  7. n/a
  8. 1-0 v Iowa
  9. 0-2 v Illinois
  10. 1-0 v Ohio State
  11. 2-0 v Nebraska
  12. 1-1 v Indiana
  13. 1-0 v Penn State
  14. 2-0 v Rutgers
  • 1-3 against the top 4
  • 3-3 against the next wave
  • 6-1 against the Wednesday teams
NW went 4-1 against the bottom 4 last season, there's the 2 win improvement. They also went 1-5 against the top 4 last year. More games played against the bottom 4 and less games played against the top 4.

Congrats to Collins on taking care of business against the 4 worst teams in the conference. Without that, there's a good chance they aren't dancing. I like Chris and glad AF he has them dancing.

Records, I tell you, records...
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What was our record against incarnate word and gardener-webb
 
coachDubs said:
1 coach took his team dancing already, in a much tougher league (Did I do that right)

1 coach is on the verge of dancing, in the weakest the leagues ever been. (Did I do that right, part 2)

Congrats on improving 2 wins during the worst conference ever (part 3). Nobody gives a shit about record, ask Doc Sadler how that worked out.
Click to expand...

So after this season they will be even because Collins will have taken his team to the dance once too?

The comparison I made was from year 1 to year 4 for Collins (7 or 8 more victories overall and 4 or 5 in league) and year 1 to year 5 for Miles (2 or 3 less overall and 1 or 2 more in league). One is showing consistent improvement, the other not so much.

Lastly, at a time when the Big Ten is at its weakest, one took advantage of that fact will take his team dancing and the other is about to finish below .500 for the 4th time in 5 years.

Defending Miles' weak record by trying to make other's accomplishments look less significant is probably not the best approach.

One 10 game hot stretch to sneak into the dance shouldn't make up for 5 years of subpar basketball.
 
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