The west is 2-8 against the east...This is one reason our job is attractive.

[Toms Wife]

If we were located in the east I think our job becomes much less desirable. It would be tough to compete against the quality of coaches there and their ability to recruit. We have shown we can win the winter recruiting awards against every team in the West by a mile...in the East it is a different story. (Even Maryland has been putting together some nice classes...this one included.)

We just need to win games. It starts with beating Wisconsin and Iowa. If a coach thinks he can beat Wisky and Iowa fairly consistently, he will be golden for a lot of years. (Bo was 4-3 against those two teams...not good enough.) Forget NIU. So far Riley's biggest downfall is being 0-5 against those two teams.

 

[shine003]

Context is everything here...As long as Wisconsin is fielding top 15 teams, i don’t think anyone will beat them consistently. If we can get to the point where we can split or slightly better with Wisconsin, I think that’s doing pretty well

 

[19Football19]

If we were located in the east I think our job becomes much less desirable. It would be tough to compete against the quality of coaches there and their ability to recruit. We have shown we can win the winter recruiting awards against every team in the West by a mile...in the East it is a different story. (Even Maryland has been putting together some nice classes...this one included.)

We just need to win games. It starts with beating Wisconsin and Iowa. If a coach thinks he can beat Wisky and Iowa fairly consistently, he will be golden for a lot of years. (Bo was 4-3 against those two teams...not good enough.) Forget NIU. So far Riley's biggest downfall is being 0-5 against those two teams.

So you’re saying we don’t want to compete with the big boys and hope for an upset once a decade or two??? That’s like being the tallest midget.

 

[Toms Wife]

So you’re saying we don’t want to compete with the big boys and hope for an upset once a decade or two??? That’s like being the tallest midget.

No, it like telling a coach there can be job security here without having to beat three top 10-15 programs every year just to win your division.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

Based solely on conversations I have had and the action of guys I know that are in the coaching profession -

No alpha-male coach is going to take a job based on the team being in a weaker division or easier.

That is not the mindset of driven guys who will ultimately be successful at Nebraska.

Things that make a job attractive -

Can I get the players I need to the school - recruiting and admissions
Will I get support from the Admin -
If we win the league will we be in the CFP.

There are other ancillary things, but it being in the weaker division isn't one of them.

Again, based solely on the actions and words of a few guys I know that coach.

 

[cecilB]

and then there was last year. or, the year before, or the years when the SEC west was the weak step sister. remember the B12 south being the weaklink- then it became the North? This stuff is cyclical. If Nebraska can routinely beat both Iowa and Wisconsin it the same years, it wont have to be too anxious about what the East throws at them....as they will have to be a salty and tough minded team/program to take them both down in the same years routinely. It will happen, there will years the split, and probably years when both are dropped (hoepfully the games are spirited)....That's when fingers are crossed for good cross-over draws.

Yes, the job should be attractive. However, recruiting rankings are bunk, and any coach worth having isn't going to choose us because he perceives the competition to be easy. Do that and the two team mentioned will continue to bludgeon. I think we want a coach that doesn't back down, and chose this job because of the caliber of coaching and depth of programs he'll face on a week to week basis. It is the most well resourced league, with arguably the best and level of coaches, with more stringent academic requirements....its not for the sheepish.

 

[cecilB]

Based solely on conversations I have had and the action of guys I know that are in the coaching profession -

No alpha-male coach is going to take a job based on the team being in a weaker division or easier.

That is not the mindset of driven guys who will ultimately be successful at Nebraska.

Things that make a job attractive -

Can I get the players I need to the school - recruiting and admissions
Will I get support from the Admin -
If we win the league will we be in the CFP.

There are other ancillary things, but it being in the weaker division isn't one of them.

Again, based solely on the actions and words of a few guys I know that coach.

I think you bring up an interesting point by including admissions. That detail is lost in the weeds of B1G money. Membership came with elevated entance requirements and fewer exceptions.....certainly not so hoity-toity it's insurmountable, but adds to the challenge and awesomeness of coaching in the this conference.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

No, he was pointing out that Nebraska is ripe for a fairly quick turnaround based on our position in a weak division, and that's something that can be sold to a prospective head coach.

You don't have to get through both Meyer and Harbaugh every season in order to compete for the BIG. And that's an advantage.

I just don't think that factors into the equation. Guys take jobs to beat Meyer, Harbaugh and Franklin, not hide from them.

It may be an advantage, I just don't believe it factors into the thought process of guys who will be successful at being a head coach.

 

[WHCSC]

I just don't think that factors into the equation. Guys take jobs to beat Meyer, Harbaugh and Franklin, not hide from them.

It may be an advantage, I just don't believe it factors into the thought process of guys who will be successful at being a head coach.

But the West coach would still get a chance at those guys, it just wouldn't be as frequent.

 

[SnohomishRed]

I just don't think that factors into the equation. Guys take jobs to beat Meyer, Harbaugh and Franklin, not hide from them.

It may be an advantage, I just don't believe it factors into the thought process of guys who will be successful at being a head coach.

I have to disagree with this, you bet coaches are looking at this. its not ducking anyone its setting your program up to win against Meyer, Harbaugh and Franklin.

We have the advantage in the west if our coaching was as good or better - pretty simple. Wisconsin has admission problems, Iowa does not seem to care to compete in recruiting and the rest are a step below program wise. Win the West and you are one game from winning the conference, plus you will be playing at least one of the three each year.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

I have to disagree with this, you bet coaches are looking at this. its not ducking anyone its setting your program up to win against Meyer, Harbaugh and Franklin.

We have the advantage in the west if our coaching was as good or better - pretty simple. Wisconsin has admission problems, Iowa does not seem to care to compete in recruiting and the rest are a step below program wise. Win the West and you are one game from winning the conference, plus you will be playing at least one of the three each year.

Feel free to disagree, I am just telling you that I have friends in the coaching world and when discussing their next job, not one time do I remember them saying, I am going to take that job because it is easier to win there or I am not taking that job because the coaches in that division or conference are really good.

They talk about recruiting, admissions and admin support. Maybe my friends are in the minority and the rest of the coaching world is looking for the easiest route.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

But the East coach would still get a chance at those guys, it just wouldn't be as frequent.

Not really what I am saying. I agree the relative weakness of the division is probably an advantage. I just don't believe coaches factor that into their decision process. They all think they can beat those guys regularly.

The 3 most high profile coaches in the league are all on the same side of the division and all 3 are relatively new hires. Chris Ash was a hot DC prospect from Ohio St, he went to Rutgers, DJ Durkin hot DC goes to Maryland.

 

[Toms Wife]

I just don't think that factors into the equation. Guys take jobs to beat Meyer, Harbaugh and Franklin, not hide from them.

It may be an advantage, I just don't believe it factors into the thought process of guys who will be successful at being a head coach.

You could be right about these alpha males. However, that runs counter to the claim that people maker here that coaches don't want to come here because they won't get a lot of years to build a program or because Nebraska fires nine win coaches. If one is an alpha meal who thinks he can consistently beat Meyer, Harbaugh, Franklin, etc. is he really going to have the weakness of mind to think he should be retained after having only a middling record?

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

You could be right about these alpha males. However, that runs counter to the claim that people maker here that coaches don't want to come here because they won't get a lot of years to build a program or because Nebraska fires nine win coaches. If one is an alpha meal who thinks he can consistently beat Meyer, Harbaugh, Franklin, etc. is he really going to have the weakness of mind to think he should be retained after having only a middling record?

That is more on the admin support, Nebraska has fired coaches that wins division titles. That is a concern. If you are competing in a good P5 league and win division titles on occasion and play in the conference title game, most coaches would believe their job is safe. When that isn't enough, that makes the job less attractive. That isn't middling. Secondly you put the word consistently beat Meyer, Harbaugh and Franklin. I never said consistently beat them. I said they take those jobs to compete and beat them.

 

[SnohomishRed]

Not really what I am saying. I agree the relative weakness of the division is probably an advantage. I just don't believe coaches factor that into their decision process. They all think they can beat those guys regularly.

The 3 most high profile coaches in the league are all on the same side of the division and all 3 are relatively new hires. Chris Ash was a hot DC prospect from Ohio St, he went to Rutgers, DJ Durkin hot DC goes to Maryland.

And I do not doubt that - However the best coaches are also very smart individuals. they realize that rebuilding involves having the time to rebuild and that especially at school like NU you have to be bale to keep the fan base satiated while working your way up. Plenty of programs have done this - Baylor, KSU heck in fact Iowa does it right now.
Coaches also have agents, assistant coaches and wives, there is going to be the element of does the job give you enough time to fit your vision - we have that here

I will add the expectations are at the lowest point in modern history for this program winning on a regular basis the West or maybe even beating WI and Iowa consistently would be enough for at least 5 years

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

And I do not doubt that - However the best coaches are also very smart individuals. they realize that rebuilding involves having the time to rebuild and that especially at school like NU you have to be bale to keep the fan base satiated while working your way up. Plenty of programs have done this - Baylor, KSU heck in fact Iowa does it right now.
Coaches also have agents, assistant coaches and wives, there is going to be the element of does the job give you enough time to fit your vision - we have that here

I will add the expectations are at the lowest point in modern history for this program winning on a regular basis the West or maybe even beating WI and Iowa consistently would be enough for at least 5 years

That is not even the same discussion. Rebuilding, fan base expectations, and time are factors, I agree, but as I said before, that is more admin support issue and not holy crap Urban Meyer and James Franklin are in this division, I am not going to take the Michigan job, I'll wait for the Illinois job to open up so I only have to compete with Paul Chryst.

 

[inWV]

Until we bring our A game against Iowa (they always do, we don't always) and get on par with Wisconsin, we can't compete against the best of the B1G East division. To Tuco's points
- Can we get the players? We are getting quality recruits, but we are lacking in difference making players on both offense and defense. We've seen those players on Wisconsin and tOSU has a roster full of them. I don't see that as a short term project. Riley is trying to lure guys like that to Lincoln.
- The Admin, with the firing of Eichorst, has signaled that they support FB and have greater expectations for it. Resources have already been deployed in the back office recuiting operation.
- If we win the CCG, we will either be in the playoff or one of the contenders for it.

Is Riley the guy to get us to the "promised land"? Probably not. He could have served to stabilize the program and to beef up our recruiting profile. The former seems dicey, but he was attempting the latter. We will see if the team bows up in the remaining games. There are no quick fixes. NU is young and it lacks difference making talent at positions that matter. If we had beat NIU and kept pace with Wiscy a bit better, we might not be talking coaching change, but the underlying problems would still exist. To attribute all of our problems to a lack of coaching acumen is to buy the quick fix. Case in point: Banker was judged to be wanting and we could view Diaco as a "quick fix". Is it probable that a 4-3 lineup with Freedom, Mick and the Davis twins with an LB crew of Young, Weber, Newby and Gifford playing some mix of the three spots, with Kalu still at CB wouldn't given us better productivity than we've seen from the transition to the 3-4? And if we change to another defensive scheme next year, we will face the same personnel/adjustment to scheme issues.
If we make a coaching change, Frost or coach TBD will face the same issues. We may be +/- a game or two in the win/loss column, but we will likely be in the same spot we are now.

 

[WHCSC]

They talk about recruiting, admissions and admin support. Maybe my friends are in the minority and the rest of the coaching world is looking for the easiest route.

Wouldn't those things make it an easier route too? If they really want a challenge they should avoid schools with those advantages. I get what you're saying though.

 

[cidsports]

If we were located in the east I think our job becomes much less desirable. It would be tough to compete against the quality of coaches there and their ability to recruit. We have shown we can win the winter recruiting awards against every team in the West by a mile...in the East it is a different story. (Even Maryland has been putting together some nice classes...this one included.)

We just need to win games. It starts with beating Wisconsin and Iowa. If a coach thinks he can beat Wisky and Iowa fairly consistently, he will be golden for a lot of years. (Bo was 4-3 against those two teams...not good enough.) Forget NIU. So far Riley's biggest downfall is being 0-5 against those two teams.

If Nebraska was in the East, it would be similar to Michigan, so the Nebraska job might even be more attractive.

Don't college coaches want to compete against the best of the best?

Developing talent is as important, as it is to recruit talent. Further, talent needs to make it to Lincoln and they need to remain in Lincoln, as well.

Nebraska's last solid coach was Dr. Tom Osborne. I am sorry, I didn't think Frank Solich was a good promotion. Bo Pelini's prior Big Ten coaching experience was a footnote at best. Ohio kid, who followed a coaching family (Stoops), out of Youngstown.

Mike Riley needs to close out 2017 strong. Right now, it should be about the players improving each day.

peace

 

[ExxHusker]

I want a coach that knows he can beat anybody.

 

[Tuco Salamanca]

Wouldn't those things make it an easier route too? If they really want a challenge they should avoid schools with those advantages. I get what you're saying though.

Those things are sort of out of his control. Coaching kids and calling a game is all him. JMHO

 

[Husker Sledge]

The appeal of playing in a weaker division and likening that to ducking competition is silly. When you're trying to rebuild a program and you want to gain traction as quickly as possible then a program playing in a traditionally weaker side would be appealing. You can't tell me Iowa, Minnesota, NW or even Wisconsin can put together quality wins ongoing that the traditional powers Michigan, PSU, and OSU can. I know Wisconsin has this inflated reputation right now but really a well coached Nebraska program should dominate the West division. If we make it a habit of getting to Indianapolis the exposure in itself will help build us to the point where we can actually win the Big 10 outright and compete in a playoff.

 

[jflores]

SSO on Frost

"I've said this to some people thru PM, but for isnhuge for Scott, he was very calculated taking the UCF job. He would choose us over a school like A&M for example, and possibly at a discount. I'm not sure his feelings on UCLA or Tennessee, but I think he would still take us over UCLA. Tennessee could be a very good job with the SEC east looking not that strong (Georgia getting good). All I know is he is well aware of the position Nebraska is in in the B1G West. We are very appealing."

Follow up question

"Does Nebraska give Scott Frost the most advantageous position to win? I am not sure it does, but if it is his dream job than it won't matter."

Answer by SSO

"Scott thinks it does."

"I'm not claiming he's taking us over Alabama or USC. But he definitely holds us favorably. Florida, Tennessee, those worry me a bit. I also worry are we a year early needing him? Better to be early to the party than late I suppose, because if he makes a move and we aren't looking, I doubt he stays somewhere for only a year. Vedral is a main reason he also likes the Nebraska idea. A Class C QB going down to Orlando and being his #2 guy in an offense people say it would be tough to recruit for here? Lindsey, DPE, Spielman, all those dudes would make a killing."

@Pennsyhusker

 

[TwinsRRUs]

We think it sucks playing OSU every year for a cross game... well, we are probably lucky that we aren't in the same division!

 

[cecilB]

The appeal of playing in a weaker division and likening that to ducking competition is silly. When you're trying to rebuild a program and you want to gain traction as quickly as possible then a program playing in a traditionally weaker side would be appealing. You can't tell me Iowa, Minnesota, NW or even Wisconsin can put together quality wins ongoing that the traditional powers Michigan, PSU, and OSU can. I know Wisconsin has this inflated reputation right now but really a well coached Nebraska program should dominate the West division. If we make it a habit of getting to Indianapolis the exposure in itself will help build us to the point where we can actually win the Big 10 outright and compete in a playoff.

In the case of Iowa and Wisconsin, they did just fine with two of those traditional powers. Even in losses there were plenty of classic big ten games.

In iowa's case during 80s, 90s, and 2000s....it was in the 80s when they broke down the Big 2 little 8. In wisky's case lets start in the 90s. They had some decent years in the 80s until Dave McClain died, but joined the fun in the1990s).

I have media guide from both of those handy. Fact are more fun than opinions, right?

80s through today Iowa vs PSU 10-10, vs Michigan 11-16, vs OSU 4-18-1(ouch).
90s through today Wisky vs PSU 7-9, vs Michigan 6-10, vs OSU 6-15-1

for giggles Iowa vs Wisky
1980s through today - Iowa 21 wins - Wisconsin 11 wins - 1 tie
1990s through today - Iowa 12 wins - Wisconsin 11 wins

I'm sure this is just what you suspected.

 

[Red I 73]

If we were located in the east I think our job becomes much less desirable. It would be tough to compete against the quality of coaches there and their ability to recruit. We have shown we can win the winter recruiting awards against every team in the West by a mile...in the East it is a different story. (Even Maryland has been putting together some nice classes...this one included.)

We just need to win games. It starts with beating Wisconsin and Iowa. If a coach thinks he can beat Wisky and Iowa fairly consistently, he will be golden for a lot of years. (Bo was 4-3 against those two teams...not good enough.) Forget NIU. So far Riley's biggest downfall is being 0-5 against those two teams.

And what do the schools in the east have that Nebraska doesn't? Access to talent. Talent not only in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan and New Jersey, but they are closer to a large talent pool in the Southeast where the recruits are familiar with recent success that tOS, Michigan, PSU Mich St. have had in the last five years. As Rich Glover said, he came to Nebraska because he knew he would be on TV every so often. Now every school is on TV multiple times each year. If I were a coach, I don't care about going to a program that has become a relic, I want a school that gives me access to players that can help me win. Too much effort is expended in a location like Lincoln to obtain the talent. Heck one of Saben's requirements was to be at a location that was close to the talent.