Rewatching the Northwestern game...

NorthwoodHusker

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But another year of S&C will make all the difference. Like other teams don't have these same programs. Tired of hearing this.

SF is the head coach and calls the plays, he hired Chins to run all aspects of the D and allows him to do that. Yes, ultimately SF is responsible for everything including kids getting into trouble but D is Chins sole responsibility.
Ok, heres from the horses mouth.
At the time, our scores were crap, those who were motivated scored well, those who werent scored like crap.
The admin, knowing this, still prevented the coaches from implementing the required, yes, required SnC to get us to the point Boyd was talking about.
The year SF took over, he said they had to scale back their SnC because the players werent ready, which meant they were still that year and a half behind.
https://www.omaha.com/huskers/boyd-...cle_1a7c4940-a387-11e5-9643-0bc10d4a2c5d.html
So, I dont care what other teams were doing, it was what our team wasnt doing prior to getting rid of an admin running our football program into the ground, with a head coach allowing it to do so.
So yes, itll be 18 months starting this fall.
 

Pennsyhusker

Head Coach
Aug 6, 2009
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The games against Colorado,Troy and Northwestern were all frustrating. I’m not sure which was the most frustrating. Probably Northwestern, but Colorado was right there also.
Troy was frustrating, but understandable, since we were playing with Bunch at QB.
Both CU and NW were crushers to me because we had both games essentially won, but gave the opponent life with super stupid defensive penalties.
 

shine003

Offensive Coordinator
Feb 25, 2005
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This. Did we give Callahan a pass and say “it isn’t his fault it is Cosgrove’s”? Nope. We fired his ass. He was the one who hired Cosgrove and stuck by him even as the defense melted before our eyes.

I think Frost is a great coach. Getting him here was HUGE. But ultimately, the buck stops with him for ALL aspects of the team.

All that said... I think Chinander will turn out to be a good DC. Our lack of a true nose tackle last year, and solid linebackers, was not his fault. Furthermore, we were installing a new defense and had a bunch of poison apples on the team that hurt chemistry. So... in year two I hope to see marked improvement. I will reserve all negative judgments toward Chinander after I see us play this Fall. If our defense is as porous as last year’s, then we can raise some red flags. I am cautiously optimistic. “Cautious” because we still lack linebackers. Hopefully, some of the young talent can step forward.
Revisionist history. Cosgrove was blamed and Callahan was given the chance to fire him but wouldn’t. Hence, bye bye. Besides, there was a lot of other things going on at the time directly related to Callahan. Oh, and that was after 4 years, not one. And not coming off of 3 defensive coordinators in 3 years.
 

SkerInCo

First Team All-Big Ten
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I kind of don't get the whole mantra that we can't have a successful defense with the offense we run. Sure they're on the field more but that's merely a depth issue. Recruit better, problem solved.
 

Hoosker Du

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
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I don't need to make any excuses. Everything I pointed out illustrates reasons for those numbers.

Let's revisit this thread in 6 months after Chin has a chance to utilize real depth, and they can actually play with a rotation along the defensive line.

Then again you have a constant agenda and I doubt your terrible takes will change.
The one constant in your takes is sadly being clueless. But I'm used to it by now. We rotated 7 different players in the front 3, and Stoltenberg was injured the entire year anyway. He hadn't been effective since last year.

Frost has miraculously made due with the talent on his side of the ball, but the excuses continued throughout the year for Chinander. And defense takes less time for personnel to acclimate than offense.

Do you realize how silly you sound when you say that a pass rush has ZERO to do with coaching? Sure, if you don't teach an ounce of technique, ala Bob Diaco, it is solely dependent on personnel. And if you don't use your personnel creatively, sure, it's solely dependent on talent and athleticism.

If you don't scheme to use anyone beyond an OLB to get to the QB, then the DC isn't using his personnel to his advantage. Northwestern averaged 1.4 yards/rush, but threw for app. 450 yards. Do we send anyone other than an OLB? From what I've seen, we either send an OLB, or on occasion we send a CB. Less frequently a S.

We'll see what happens this year, and I'm hopeful that additional personnel will give him some additional options. And yes, I agree that having Alex Davis on the field is almost like having 10 defenders out there.
 

Hoosker Du

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Do you remember the cu games in 97 and 99? Nebraska had comfortable leads in both those games, only to see Colorado comeback with maybe 5/6 minutes in each game and almost win. It happens in college football a lot these days, defense just isn't what it used to be, unless you're a few southern teams that stockpile NFL talent, and even they give up some big yards and points quite a few times. I believe Alabama gave up 320 ypg, that's not exactly stellar, but it's offense that is the show these days.

I think with another year of players and coaches being together, Nebraska will see improvement on defense, hopefully enough to win the games like Northwestern.
I get it. We are going to give up more yards and points when we run up - tempo on offense. But you simply can't fold as a defense and give up 10 points in 2:40 of clock. Especially when you pin them on their own 1-yard line and they have to go 99-yards during that time. And that is ultimately on Chinander, just like the other multitude of times last season the defense failed to stop opposing offenses. He will be heavily scrutinized this season.
 

Bugeater

Offensive Coordinator
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I get it. We are going to give up more yards and points when we run up - tempo on offense. But you simply can't fold as a defense and give up 10 points in 2:40 of clock. Especially when you pin them on their own 1-yard line and they have to go 99-yards during that time. And that is ultimately on Chinander, just like the other multitude of times last season the defense failed to stop opposing offenses. He will be heavily scrutinized this season.
Well, let’s hope those folding chairs don’t show up this season, that was ugly to watch.
 

Cornicator

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The one constant in your takes is sadly being clueless. But I'm used to it by now. We rotated 7 different players in the front 3, and Stoltenberg was injured the entire year anyway. He hadn't been effective since last year.

Frost has miraculously made due with the talent on his side of the ball, but the excuses continued throughout the year for Chinander. And defense takes less time for personnel to acclimate than offense.

Do you realize how silly you sound when you say that a pass rush has ZERO to do with coaching? Sure, if you don't teach an ounce of technique, ala Bob Diaco, it is solely dependent on personnel. And if you don't use your personnel creatively, sure, it's solely dependent on talent and athleticism.

If you don't scheme to use anyone beyond an OLB to get to the QB, then the DC isn't using his personnel to his advantage. Northwestern averaged 1.4 yards/rush, but threw for app. 450 yards. Do we send anyone other than an OLB? From what I've seen, we either send an OLB, or on occasion we send a CB. Less frequently a S.

We'll see what happens this year, and I'm hopeful that additional personnel will give him some additional options. And yes, I agree that having Alex Davis on the field is almost like having 10 defenders out there.


 
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dinglefritz

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Revisionist history. Cosgrove was blamed and Callahan was given the chance to fire him but wouldn’t. Hence, bye bye. Besides, there was a lot of other things going on at the time directly related to Callahan. Oh, and that was after 4 years, not one. And not coming off of 3 defensive coordinators in 3 years.
According to T.O., you've got the story wrong if you are implying that Tom told him to fire him. According to T.O., Callahan came to T.O. and asked if he wanted him to fire Cosgrove. Tom said that he replied, "I wouldn't ask you to do that (sic)." Callahan didn't "refuse" to fire Cosgrove but he also didn't take the initiative to do it either. Tom could have asked Callahan to fire him but according to the man himself, he did not. Callahan was gone no matter what. The whole IF he had won X number of game to close the season narrative was after the fact. Callahan was gone the day T.O. took over as AD.
 

Pennsyhusker

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Revisionist history. Cosgrove was blamed and Callahan was given the chance to fire him but wouldn’t. Hence, bye bye. Besides, there was a lot of other things going on at the time directly related to Callahan. Oh, and that was after 4 years, not one. And not coming off of 3 defensive coordinators in 3 years.
If you read my post then you know I defended Chinander and was not attacking him. Nor am I saying that the Callahan and Frost situations are identical. But they are analogous insofar as the strength of both coaches was/is offense and that they were/are loyal to a defensive coordinator that many questioned. All I am saying is that I hope, if Chinander turns out to be a liability, that Frost doesn’t make the same mistake and is willing to cut him loose.
 

yort2000

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Discussing personnel and logic as it pertains to Northwestern is futile. One could honestly argue NW went 8-1 in the Big Ten last season with the worst QB play in the West, the worst running game, the worst kicker, and a below average defense.

They were the 1st Big Ten Division champion ever to give up more yards, first downs, and sacks per game. They were also the first division champion where the starting QB had a 1 to 1 TD to int ratio. And they were the first Power 5 division champion ever to average less than 3.5 yards per carry on the season.
Nebraska ran for 250 yards vs. NW. But they did fail to execute in the 4th. That's a reflection of focus and likely thinking the game is over.
These quotes highlight the difference between a winner's mentality and a loser's mentality. Fitzgerald does a great job of getting his teams to have that winner's mentality and thinking they are able to win every game no matter the current circumstances. It takes a lot to get rid of the loser's mentality instilled by Riley. I'm sure a lot/most of the Nebraska players were thinking I wonder what's going to happen to make us lose this one for most of the first 1/2 of the season.
 

NikkiSixx

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Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn’t Wisconsin run a 3-4 defense too? They seem to hold up in the B1G.
Yes I think you're right that Wisconsin and Michigan State also play a 3-4. However I don't think alignment always equals level of aggressiveness.

Those schools are still complimenting offenses built on ball control & time of possession, where Scott's is hurry up/quick strike, and then your D is back on the field again. It's a lot of snaps for a defense and a very long season for that side of the ball.

We have to give the coaches time to recruit & develop for that style of defense and give them more than 1 season to really know how it will play out in the league in my opinion.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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When has Chins ever had his guys?
Now, going undefeated counts on the defensive side too.
Many fans say, winnings all that matters, undefeated is, undefeated.
Getting takeaways didnt happen all that much.
Tough to be aggressive on the line when your NT is hobbling.
Tough to play pass defense when the previous staff brought in three different coaches, one, mostly a recruiter.
Oh, it wasnt year one it all came together, but they did win six at ucf, somebody was playing defense there.
Also, not the right safeties or dbs to an extent, and linebackers are still a problem, so, personnel wasnt the right fit, first year, only matched the year prior.
When you give your coach time, that includes everyone he's handpicked.
 

Catch50

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That's sorta how I looked when you said pass rush has ZERO to do with coaching. It's not quite the dopiest comment this week, but it placed.
Would it be too dopey to suggest rushing 3 and dropping 8 when the pass rush is too tired or not good in the first place? Especially for young and/or not mobile QB's. We really needed that win. I believe you really put pressure on the QB to make accurate throws all the way down the field. I have seen it work many times.
 

yort2000

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Would it be too dopey to suggest rushing 3 and dropping 8 when the pass rush is too tired or not good in the first place? Especially for young and/or not mobile QB's. We really needed that win. I believe you really put pressure on the QB to make accurate throws all the way down the field. I have seen it work many times.
That was exactly Diaco's mentality and you saw how well that worked.
 

Catch50

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That was exactly Diaco's mentality and you saw how well that worked.
I've seen plenty of times it has worked. Plus NW had to go 99 yards.

I'd pay $100 to hear coach Mario comment on this.
 

Nebraska Fan

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and am reminded how many times Chinander's defense let Frost's offense down last year. That game was a miserably painful example of how a repeatedly bad defense can steal defeat out of the jaws of victory.

Up by 14 with app. 12 minutes left, and then again up by 10 with less than 3 minutes left...and still lost the fricken game!! Grrrr..

Chinander still needs to prove to me that he can be trusted as our DC. He hasn't remotely done so yet.
That's fair enough although "hasn't remotely" is a bit overstated. He displays a ton of confidence possibly beyond his experience level so this year will be interesting. Don't know if we keep him should the defense turn in a great year.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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Missed fg, missed xp, AM overthrows, safeties consistently out of position, mysterious D holding plays, no call on qb slide hit etc etc.
It was a sloppy game, AM wasnt on his game.
Must be the D coordinator.
And NW did this all season long.
 

TruHusker

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Sep 21, 2001
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There is zero doubt we are lacking elite talent on the D side of the ball, especially last year. I am not certain how much better we are going to be this year in that regard. We still are not solid in the LB area and our secondary is serviceable at best.

Certainly, the S&C program was lacking as noted by Boyd but I also heard players say the criticism that they weren't lifting was totally misplaced. There will undoubtedly be some gains from getting stronger and in better condition, but they will be hard to measure. Other teams have good S&C programs as well. so my guess is next year at this time we will hear the same line that another year of S&C will solve many of the problems.

If we don't start recruiting some elite LB's and DB's, all of this is a moot point. When this D gets revisited again next off season, no matter what happens, there is a bottom line somewhere. Use all the stats you want, injured players, etc, the play on the field and the results do not lie. The NW game was merely one example that should not have happened and it is easy to go back and point out problems but that was a total breakdown, pure and simple. Players were not in position to make plays.

I know Chin needs "his guys" and that would take several years, good coaches can get the best out of who they have to work with. I am not anti or pro Chin, but there is a bottom line, results oriented test that does indicate what is going on. We were horrible at times last year, no way to sugar coat it. So, for me, Chin has got to show me on the field he can stop teams by taking away their strength, that he can get players in position, that he can get his team to swarm to the ball and not get caught up in traffic so often, that they can defend the entire field.

I, for one, do not buy in to the D being put in a bad position constantly because the O scores so quickly. Play it the other way, the D has more opportunity to get turnovers, isn't that suppose to the mantra of a Chin D? The other side is a productive O will put more pressure on the other team to score and keep up, causing them to do things they are not comfortable doing which should play into the D's hands.

No, I really don't care to see any more games like NW or Illinois just to name two that really stood out. Time to produce.

Follow up: if this is what we can expect from the D then we better have a REALLY good O.
 
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NorthwoodHusker

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Towards the end of the game, they dialed up the blitzes, I would say they were fifty fifty at that point in the game,alot of pressures, but, our safeties couldnt be in the right spot, and bootle got a flag if he stared too long.
Did it happen to iowa,wiscy etc, yea. Wiscys D gave up 1point less than ours against them, osu gave up a td less etc.
I get what everyones saying, but, we arent as far off as some think, and because first year, round peg etc, I have plenty of patience.
 
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Discussing personnel and logic as it pertains to Northwestern is futile. One could honestly argue NW went 8-1 in the Big Ten last season with the worst QB play in the West, the worst running game, the worst kicker, and a below average defense.

They were the 1st Big Ten Division champion ever to give up more yards, first downs, and sacks per game. They were also the first division champion where the starting QB had a 1 to 1 TD to int ratio. And they were the first Power 5 division champion ever to average less than 3.5 yards per carry on the season.
So do they have the greatest coach ever?
 

kidofSN

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Good coaches still get players in the right position to make plays. It is up to the players to make the play. Way to often last season our players were not even close to being in the right position to make plays. Example Iowa going for it on 4th and 8. Watch that play and tell me our guys even had a chance to make the play in the formation we started in! That was ALL coaching!
 

timnsun

Assistant Head Coach
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Good coaches still get players in the right position to make plays. It is up to the players to make the play. Way to often last season our players were not even close to being in the right position to make plays. Example Iowa going for it on 4th and 8. Watch that play and tell me our guys even had a chance to make the play in the formation we started in! That was ALL coaching!
Excellent point on 4th and 8... my hope is Chin and Co read that they were gonna punt it except that we lined up so soft, they took what we gave them, so that we never do that again.
 

slick1979uk

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I don't need to make any excuses. Everything I pointed out illustrates reasons for those numbers.

Let's revisit this thread in 6 months after Chin has a chance to utilize real depth, and they can actually play with a rotation along the defensive line.

Then again you have a constant agenda and I doubt your terrible takes will change.
Du was complaining back in 1995 about that team also, so dont expect him to think logically. He only thinks with emotion.
 
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phoenix4nu

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Good coaches still get players in the right position to make plays. It is up to the players to make the play. Way to often last season our players were not even close to being in the right position to make plays. Example Iowa going for it on 4th and 8. Watch that play and tell me our guys even had a chance to make the play in the formation we started in! That was ALL coaching!
It was a combination of coaching and lack of talent. That’s how you have a 4-8 season. I think both areas will improve over time.
 
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kidofSN

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NO..11 All Pro players could be on defense and if they line up as they did on that 4th and 8 the offense converts 9.5 times out of ten. The defense called was that bad. And if you watch the whole season that happens more times on 3rd down than can be explained away by anyone!
 

timnsun

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NO..11 All Pro players could be on defense and if they line up as they did on that 4th and 8 the offense converts 9.5 times out of ten. The defense called was that bad. And if you watch the whole season that happens more times on 3rd down than can be explained away by anyone!
I think the point is that if we have better talent, that kind of defense doesn’t need to be called. I am not an X’s and O’s kind of guy, so I can’t break down film to be able to say much about anything. Was that a safe call so as to avoid giving up a long gain? I think the more talented we are, the better the playcalling will be. At least I hope so.
 
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81husker

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Chinander is the Defensive Coordinator and is responsible on game days calling the defense and variety of blitzes..

SF is just as guilty losing that game not making a 4th and 1 or 2.. can’t remember which..
IIRC an OL jumped turning that into 4th and 6 or 7and they came up short on that play.

Make that first down and NU could have run the clock out.
 

Tuco Salamanca

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IIRC an OL jumped turning that into 4th and 6 or 7and they came up short on that play.

Make that first down and NU could have run the clock out.
There were at least 2 occasions in the 4th qtr where Spielman came up 1 yard short on 3rd down. One forced a FG instead of keeping the drive alive and possibly scoring a TD and the other was in OT and on the 4th down Martinez threw a pick on 4th and 1. Again a TD there forces NW to score a TD in OT.


No railing on Spielman just pointing out 2 offensive plays that could have affected the end result.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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NO..11 All Pro players could be on defense and if they line up as they did on that 4th and 8 the offense converts 9.5 times out of ten. The defense called was that bad. And if you watch the whole season that happens more times on 3rd down than can be explained away by anyone!
If they were all pro, they wouldnt be behind the line to gain.
 

SnohomishRed

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There is no doubt Chin is the question mark going forward. The offense looks to be in good hands.

We have not had a decent defense since 2010. In fact going back some almost 20 years that has been the missing part. Callahan had decent offenses, Bo' offense most years was respectable, Riley was bad all around.

The hope I have us that we are in fact an attacking defense now which has not been the case for a long time. I am hoping we make good progress this year but it is the unknown at this point
 
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81husker

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There is no doubt Chin is the question mark going forward. The offense looks to be in good hands.

We have not had a decent defense since 2010. In fact going back some almost 20 years that has been the missing part. Callahan had decent offenses, Bo' offense most years was respectable, Riley was bad all around.

The hope I have us that we are in fact an attacking defense now which has not been the case for a long time. I am hoping we make good progress this year but it is the unknown at this point
One thing NU has suffered from in the recent years that landed on the D is the frequency of 3 and Outs. No, I don’t have numbers, but in my recollection the offense has jogged off after three plays and left it for the defense to stop the opponent way too often.

An already struggling defense was left to deal with fatigue and depth hasn’t been a strong suit.

I really want to see that turn around. Although, if Frosts attacking offense is successful, the defense better be ready to be on the field a lot.
 
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