MOAB dropped in Afghanistan...
- Thread starter Hoosker Du
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I wonder how many feet the c130 that dropped the MOAB went up after the release. 24000 lbs less weight is yuge.
Very curious as to what the effectiveness was. I assume that lots caves and tunnels have been known for many years. A bomb they've had for over a decade. I'd be interested to hear why this was the right time and target to deploy it.
Translation:im going to look for something to complain about cuz i hate trump and am more biased than that ucla players dad.
It's most likely part of this new "cold war" to show the Russians what we have. Just like the tomahawk strikes were more political than logistical.
Looks to me like the men came for a discussion, and you came for a catfight...
No, you came to smear and havent been told what to think yet. Your ilk doesnt care about logic or facts, talking to you is worse than a brick wall so whats the point?
From my understanding of the MOAB, even though it is a heavy bomb, it is a concussion bomb rather than explosive. So damage will not be as much as effectiveness....If that makes sense.
As far as the timing? I. Only speculating that's a combination of timing, message sending, experimentation......Since to my knowledge we haven't used it at least not recently. Iran take notice since we suspect their nuclear program is underground.
The tunnels and caves have been used as a major transport system.
Wonder is this was done so that Assad, Iran, and Lil Kim could see what may be in store for them.
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When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed. Luke 11:21
When you care enough to send the very best! Welcome to Half-ghanistan!
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed. Luke 11:21
I watched the vid on the MOAB, cool explosion. Probably more of a message thing than a necessity. Combined with some experimentation.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new...omb-combat-time.html
U.S. forces used a GPS-guided GBU-43 bomb, which is 30 feet long and weighs a staggering 21,600 pounds.
A crater left by the blast is believed to be more than 300 meters wide
A specialized MC-130 'Hercules' cargo aircraft released the weapon at 7:00 p.m. local time.
It was too big to drop from a traditional bomb-bay door or release from an aircraft wing, so 'we kicked it out the back door,' a U.S. official told Fox News.
The weapon's sheer power produces a blast that can be felt miles away., largely because of its construction.
Engineers used an unusually thin aluminum skin to encase MOAB's payload, in order to avoid a thicker steel frame interfering with the impact on a target.
U.S. forces used a GPS-guided GBU-43 bomb, which is 30 feet long and weighs a staggering 21,600 pounds.
A crater left by the blast is believed to be more than 300 meters wide
A specialized MC-130 'Hercules' cargo aircraft released the weapon at 7:00 p.m. local time.
It was too big to drop from a traditional bomb-bay door or release from an aircraft wing, so 'we kicked it out the back door,' a U.S. official told Fox News.
The weapon's sheer power produces a blast that can be felt miles away., largely because of its construction.
Engineers used an unusually thin aluminum skin to encase MOAB's payload, in order to avoid a thicker steel frame interfering with the impact on a target.
If you are targeting tunnels and stuff, its less about blast radius and more about over pressure.
Sure, if you put some schmucks out in a field and set one of these bad boys off, it'll have a pretty wide effective range, but in all the nooks and crannies of a cave complex you need to generate a certain amount of pressure to kill everyone because you won't get shrapnel and burning death everywhere.
Are you referring to
"It explodes six feet (1.8 meters) above the ground"
"It is designed to destroy heavily reinforced targets or to shatter ground forces and armour across a large area"
"White House press secretary Sean Spicer told reporters that MOAB is 'a large, powerful and accurately delivered weapon' whose use was intended to collapse underground spaces used by ISIS terrorists to move freely and attack U.S. and allied troops."
Because I'm familiar with airburst. And I'm also familiar with hard targets. We aren't airbursting Iran into submission.
The shock waves into those tunnels, caves and bunkers will be EXTREMELY effective without doing extreme physical damage is the point I was making. The MOAB isn't the type that goes in deep before exploding. I am pretty sure it is concussion bomb meaning it explodes before impact and the damage inflicted is shock waves which is quite effective below ground without "blowing things up" if that makes sense. I hope.
Yah correct, saying basically the same thing.
However there's a limit to the effect. If you are sufficiently buried, penetration is a must at some point.
Otherwise its like setting off a firecracker above your house, cool noise, but no real disturbance. Depends on the target of course and Iran and North Korea generally take care to not linger about in the near surface.
Edit: Rest assured, the MOAB is an important tool in the tool kit
I couldn't help but be amused at one quote I read where the guy said its existence should be regarded as a major deterrent. Something to the effect of, "Countries won't mess with us because they know we have it."
Struck me as a funny statement from the country with the world's most powerful nuclear arsenal. Nukes, sure, who cares...but a bomb that leaves a 300m crater, WELL THEN...
I support strategic messaging as much as the next guy but we're kinda sending mixed signals from the White House.
POTUS had appeared to change his stance on intervening in Syria, but walked that back post-strike. Basically say its a "one off" punishment and strictly saying we are not going to go into Syria en masse. Which is at odds with his edict that Assad can't stick around. Its possible we remove him by non-military means through some negotiation or whatever, but on the face, he's appearing to take a traditional political approach here: "here's something bad that can't stand, but I won't commit to the most direct way of doing it".
Which, even with random weapons drops around the world and naval drive by's its hard to see Americans commit to a sustained campaign in Iran or North Korea, if we've all but ruled it out in a war-torn, militarily gutted Syria.
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Actually, he asked two questions, both of which seem to be of interest to others in the thread.
1. How effective was this? (jflores and others are discussing this) and
2. Why here and now? (bigboxes suggests it may be more significant politically than militarily).
Since he's actually contributing to the discussion, it seems like you're the one doing the smearing.
This is the most frustrating thing about the current WH. Man they can't all get on the same page.
I think the why here and now is really two fold. The Green Beret got killed, and that complex is a fairly decent size...a MOAB may have been the easiest way to get at it with the required shock/pressure/etc.
From the folks I know deployed it doesn't sound like there is anything in the works where we all of a sudden ramp up this huge effort.
I think the POTUS realizes that if he decides to make a major military move in any one or all of these countries, his entire domestic agenda vaporizes and this turns into Dubya's administration. I'll be interested to see where, if anywhere, he pulls the trigger on a military commitment.
That's where I roll my eyes at the responses on both sides of my friends list to the news on the last week of strikes. To my untrained eye, they seem to change nothing strategically. But they have grabbed outsize coverage and drawn a loud chorus of either cheers or boos depending on which bumper stickers are on your car.
I find it interesting that this headline is all over my feed from basically every outlet. Why such news? The sheer size of the bomb I guess?
I hope it's effective in degrading ISIS's capabilities in the area. I perceive this bombing as more functional, with the action in Syria as more symbolic, but I only know enough to know I know nothing.
I say that you are probably correct. Referring to your first part of your post. No opinion on last.
To quote a friend who I was deployed with...
"We've been degrading terrorist capabilities in this country for 15 years".
Having supported this particular effort in the past, I can say that they probably hit this thing with the idea that this was the weapon for the job, or at the very least, hey instead of doing something "normal" lets try this thing out and see how well it works and it'll at least save us dropping a bunch of other things.
Sometimes we can all be in the column of "just enough to be dangerous"It's ok, I won't be offended if you agree that I know nothing.
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