Interview with TJ Lateef at Elite 11

[timnsun]

You can't have too many threats in the room at once at QB. The people playing need to know that they are the guy(s) and not hanging by a thread. This is essential for them to play confident and take risks that win games and championships.

The worst teams I have ever been associated with are the ones where the kids are of the mentality that if they don't perform great for one game, sometimes one quarter or one inning, the coach is going to replace them. It makes the whole team play tight and slow, always worrying about the inevitable next mistake.

My opinion is specific to our situation. Had DR not come, I would be for bringing in a 2025 recruit, but we already have a backup with game experience who can play in a pinch this fall, and if we have to go to #3, DK can be someone who they can work with now and will be more ready in 2025.

Fast forward to 2025, we'll have the same top 3 QBs coming back, the only difference is that HH will probably move further away from QB to something that gets him ready for the NFL and DK will be more than ready to be the backup. This new kid in 2025 is not going to overtake DK as the backup as a freshman after DK has a 18 months in the program under his belt.

In 2026, we still have DR and DK (I don't think DK is transferring as he knew the situation before he decided to stay with his original commitment). The 2025 kid would be a RS freshman, essentially sitting in his year 2 has the 3rd string QB (a kid with no ties to Nebraska in an environment where if he's any good, many suitors will be knocking on his door to start in 2026 instead of being 3rd at Nebraska with the prospect of being 2nd in 2027).

Sure, kids can get hurt, but this has been exacerbated by Frost's and Riley's poor work ethic for the team. Before that, we rarely had to go to a number 3 at QB. In over 40 years from TO to Pelini, we lost our starting QB to injury in only 4 if these seasons. I think we had to go to a number 3 maybe twice for a few games because of injury. You can't base recruiting on fear of that.

Thanks for posting this, and fleshing out your thought process. I still don’t agree with it, but I appreciate it.

I guess I don’t want a QB that’s worried about an incoming freshman. Is that QB really the guy we want playing if he isn’t confident? Iron sharpens iron, so if the top guy isn’t the top guy, then bring in the guy who can get it done.

In 2010 (I think) when Martinez came in as the starter as a redshirt freshman over a returning senior, we were better off because of it.

Get the best players and play the best players. That’s my thought.

 

[rgrachek]

I understand your logic BUT it’s contrary to what every successful program has done to be successful.

Look at the QB rooms under TO. They did exactly what I'm suggesting and were pretty successful.

 

[dinglefritz]

Look at the QB rooms under TO. They did exactly what I'm suggesting and were pretty successful.

That was a different offense and Tom has said he always took at least one and tried to take two every year. Most of those guys were highly thought of recruits.

 

[timnsun]

Look at the QB rooms under TO. They did exactly what I'm suggesting and were pretty successful.

When I used Ohio State, you said the world doesn’t work that way anymore, and that was a dozen years ago or so. But it’s ok to go back 30 years and assume how we did it then works today as well? Ok…

 

[rgrachek]

When I used Ohio State, you said the world doesn’t work that way anymore, and that was a dozen years ago or so. But it’s ok to go back 30 years and assume how we did it then works today as well? Ok…

But the world has turned to a position where what TO did is more applicable now than even back then.

The point is that this system worked even when players couldn't just leave on a whim, when players expected to wait for years to play. It would work BETTER now.

Ohio State 2014 was the antithesis of what TO did.

Look at TO's recruiting. He started with Dave Humm for 2 years from the previous head coach. TO's best QB recruits were:

Vince Ferragamo (transfer) need after Humm left
Tom Sorley
Jeff Quinn
Turner Gill
Steve Taylor
Tommy Frazier
Scott Frost (Transfer) need after Frazier left
Eric Crouch

None of these guys had a highly ranked QB come in when they were in their first or second year as a starter except for Crouch who had Newcombe come in the same year and after a short time at QB, switched to receiver permanently. Berringer came in a year before Frazier, but Frazier was way better, not the case for DR and the 2025 kid.

 

[timnsun]

But the world has turned to a position where what TO did is more applicable now than even back then.

The point is that this system worked even when players couldn't just leave on a whim, when players expected to wait for years to play. It would work BETTER now.

Ohio State 2014 was the antithesis of what TO did.

Look at TO's recruiting. He started with Dave Humm for 2 years from the previous head coach. TO's best QB recruits were:

Vince Ferragamo (transfer) need after Humm left
Tom Sorley
Jeff Quinn
Turner Gill
Steve Taylor
Tommy Frazier
Scott Frost (Transfer) need after Frazier left
Eric Crouch

None of these guys had a highly ranked QB come in when they were in their first or second year as a starter except for Crouch who had Newcombe come in the same year and after a short time at QB, switched to receiver permanently. Berringer came in a year before Frazier, but Frazier was way better, not the case for DR and the 2025 kid.

If it’s more applicable now than ever, why aren’t any of the top schools doing this? Georgia? Nope. Bama? Nope. Ohio state? Nope. I could go down the list. Looking at middling schools, how many say, “we got our QB for 4 years, let’s not recruit a QB this year.” You’d be crazy, in my opinion, to go that route.

I know you aren’t gonna change your opinion, and I’m not gonna change mine either, so we’ll just see what happens I guess.

 

[rgrachek]

If it’s more applicable now than ever, why aren’t any of the top schools doing this? Georgia? Nope. Bama? Nope. Ohio state? Nope. I could go down the list. Looking at middling schools, how many say, “we got our QB for 4 years, let’s not recruit a QB this year.” You’d be crazy, in my opinion, to go that route.

I know you aren’t gonna change your opinion, and I’m not gonna change mine either, so we’ll just see what happens I guess.

Since 2020, Georgia has had 2 seasons where they didn't sign a QB, and their current starter who signed in 2020 (Beck) is only one of two high school QBs to sign with them since 2019 who is still with the team. The other signed this year. Fromm was a 4-star and as a result of going with him, 2- Five Star QBs transferred out.

Ohio State has had MANY significant QBs transfer out recently because of a crowed room, and is relying on Kansas State's QB from last season to play in 2024.

So much for the stockpile QB theory.

 

[timnsun]

Since 2020, Georgia has had 2 seasons where they didn't sign a QB, and their current starter who signed in 2020 (Beck) is only one of two high school QBs to sign with them since 2019 who is still with the team. The other signed this year. Fromm was a 4-star and as a result of going with him, 2- Five Star QBs transferred out.

Ohio State has had MANY significant QBs transfer out recently because of a crowed room, and is relying on Kansas State's QB from last season to play in 2024.

So much for the stockpile QB theory.

Fact checked, and it has happened only once, 2023, for Georgia. Otherwise, it went Carson Beck (20), Brock Vandagriff (21), Gunner Stockton (22), Ryan Puglisi (24).

And I really don’t care that QBs transferred out as long as some transfer in as well. I just don’t think we should settle for what we have, nor for lesser guys because we THINK they will stick around.

Again, nothing I say will change your mind, and vice versa.

 

[TFrazier]

But the world has turned to a position where what TO did is more applicable now than even back then.

The point is that this system worked even when players couldn't just leave on a whim, when players expected to wait for years to play. It would work BETTER now.

Ohio State 2014 was the antithesis of what TO did.

Look at TO's recruiting. He started with Dave Humm for 2 years from the previous head coach. TO's best QB recruits were:

Vince Ferragamo (transfer) need after Humm left
Tom Sorley
Jeff Quinn
Turner Gill
Steve Taylor
Tommy Frazier
Scott Frost (Transfer) need after Frazier left
Eric Crouch

None of these guys had a highly ranked QB come in when they were in their first or second year as a starter except for Crouch who had Newcombe come in the same year and after a short time at QB, switched to receiver permanently. Berringer came in a year before Frazier, but Frazier was way better, not the case for DR and the 2025 kid.

There goes your credibility.

TOMMIE

 

[kakdawg]

Since 2020, Georgia has had 2 seasons where they didn't sign a QB, and their current starter who signed in 2020 (Beck) is only one of two high school QBs to sign with them since 2019 who is still with the team. The other signed this year. Fromm was a 4-star and as a result of going with him, 2- Five Star QBs transferred out.

Ohio State has had MANY significant QBs transfer out recently because of a crowed room, and is relying on Kansas State's QB from last season to play in 2024.

So much for the stockpile QB theory.

OSU has like 4 4 or 5 stars CURRENTLY in their roster AND the guy from KSU. That's AFTER losing Raiola AND the 5 star transfer who we recruited before we got Raiola.

OSU is the definition of STOCK PILING QBs and let it sort itself out.


Holla

 

[kakdawg]

Fact checked, and it has happened only once, 2023, for Georgia. Otherwise, it went Carson Beck (20), Brock Vandagriff (21), Gunner Stockton (22), Ryan Puglisi (24).

And I really don’t care that QBs transferred out as long as some transfer in as well. I just don’t think we should settle for what we have, nor for lesser guys because we THINK they will stick around.

Again, nothing I say will change your mind, and vice versa.

It makes no sense whatsoever but sometimes fans think that way.

I think it's funny when fans don't think we should hire certain coaches because if they do well in X amount of years another school will come calling and you lose them .

I want a team full of coaches that are in high demand. If nobody wants your coaches (or players for that matter) what does that say about them?

Hearing guys where in Fidone's inbox means he's highly thought of. Imagine wanting to have a TE that nobody wants but you because you are scared he will transfer out if he's too good.

Just a horrible way to think while building a team imo


Holla

 

[rgrachek]

OSU has like 4 4 or 5 stars CURRENTLY in their roster AND the guy from KSU. That's AFTER losing Raiola AND the 5 star transfer who we recruited before we got Raiola.

OSU is the definition of STOCK PILING QBs and let it sort itself out.


Holla

I pretty much said what you said. My point is that it’s not necessarily good.

 

[rgrachek]

There goes your credibility.

TOMMIE

Whoops

 

[yunginsNU2]

To me it really doesn't matter what position you play I want players who WANT to be here period..if not just decommit and be done with it

 

[RBigredMax]

You have to take a QB. One injury to Raiola and we’re in a world of hurt. You recruit a top prospect and tell him he could be one injury from being the starter. Competing with Kaelin shouldn’t scare top prospects off.

Feel like DK doesn’t get much love considering he was an Elite 11 4 star as well?

 

[king_kong_]

Feel like DK doesn’t get much love considering he was an Elite 11 4 star as well?

don't shoot the messenger but Elite 11 is extraordinarily watered down these days. more like Elite 110.

DK is a good player to have in the QB room. we'll see what he looks like after he redshirts.

 

[dinglefritz]

Feel like DK doesn’t get much love considering he was an Elite 11 4 star as well?

He’s fine but he didn’t show anything in the spring scrimmage that should scare away competition IMO. He has time.

 

[timnsun]

Feel like DK doesn’t get much love considering he was an Elite 11 4 star as well?

I guess the question should be, because we got both DR and DK, do we not need a QB this 25 cycle? I don’t think people are saying DK isn’t gonna be good, people are saying we need to get as many good QBs as we can and let the best man win. No slight against DK, if he rises, great!

 

[huskersreign]

don't shoot the messenger but Elite 11 is extraordinarily watered down these days. more like Elite 110.

DK is a good player to have in the QB room. we'll see what he looks like after he redshirts.

How so? The Elite 11 is a competition that arrives at the 11 best, through their competitions and metrics at the END of the finals. The Elite 11 finals is not the end. I don't know why people get confused with the finals having 20 QB's in it.. its not the final rankings its the final competition. Being named one of the 11 once the finals has concluded is what makes one an "Elite 11 QB." Also making or winning a regional elite 11 competition doesn't make you an elite 11 qb, just as say winning a regional in college baseball doesn't make you the national champion (or even one of the 8 at the CWS).

Also note that all the recruiting services will arrive at who their 11 is after watching the finals... which may add to the confusion, but their 11 doesn't make an Elite 11 QB. Only "Elite 11" can decide who makes the final 11 since it is their competition.

 

[rgrachek]

I guess the question should be, because we got both DR and DK, do we not need a QB this 25 cycle? I don’t think people are saying DK isn’t gonna be good, people are saying we need to get as many good QBs as we can and let the best man win. No slight against DK, if he rises, great!

Get as many good QBs as we can and let the best man win? As many as we can? How about we bring in 20 three star QBs because at least one will end up being an NFL level player, right?

All absurdity aside, there actually is an optimal number that you need to have on a team to balance your needs for depth and future development against your ability to manage and evaluate players and not cause dissension on the team. What we seem to be arguing is what that number is, but to be sure, it's NOT "as many good QBs as we can".

When I coached select baseball teams here in Georgia, I learned really quick that the best teams were crafted not by having the best 18 kids in the area on the same team, but rather having 9 elite position players (including 2 catchers who would get equal playing time and could DH when they were not catching) and 3-4 really good pitchers, some of which could play another position from time to time while relying on some of the position players to pitch also. That's 13 players. The remainder of the roster (around 5) would be made up with players who while being decent players, were happy to play part time on a great team and would help the team in other ways. Adding super elite players as the remaining 5 would only cause problems because these kinds of kids and their parents want them to play almost all of the time and splitting time (except for catcher) just wasn't going to work.

In reality, it kind of like how the position players on a major league roster are determined, where you might have young players in the high minors better than the reserves on the major league roster, but these players need to play every day where mid-level vets can serve the reserve role.

Same dynamic in Football. For a team to function properly, you need to have everyone comfortable in their role, otherwise there are problems that effect preparation and ultimately play on Saturday (or Friday). Having a log jam at QB or RB can be very damaging to a team.

 

[rgrachek]

Feel like DK doesn’t get much love considering he was an Elite 11 4 star as well?

DK was a 5.6 3-star on Rivals

 

[timnsun]

Get as many good QBs as we can and let the best man win? As many as we can? How about we bring in 20 three star QBs because at least one will end up being an NFL level player, right?

All absurdity aside, there actually is an optimal number that you need to have on a team to balance your needs for depth and future development against your ability to manage and evaluate players and not cause dissension on the team. What we seem to be arguing is what that number is, but to be sure, it's NOT "as many good QBs as we can".

When I coached select baseball teams here in Georgia, I learned really quick that the best teams were crafted not by having the best 18 kids in the area on the same team, but rather having 9 elite position players (including 2 catchers who would get equal playing time and could DH when they were not catching) and 3-4 really good pitchers, some of which could play another position from time to time while relying on some of the position players to pitch also. That's 13 players. The remainder of the roster (around 5) would be made up with players who while being decent players, were happy to play part time on a great team and would help the team in other ways. Adding super elite players as the remaining 5 would only cause problems because these kinds of kids and their parents want them to play almost all of the time and splitting time (except for catcher) just wasn't going to work.

In reality, it kind of like how the position players on a major league roster are determined, where you might have young players in the high minors better than the reserves on the major league roster, but these players need to play every day where mid-level vets can serve the reserve role.

Same dynamic in Football. For a team to function properly, you need to have everyone comfortable in their role, otherwise there are problems that effect preparation and ultimately play on Saturday (or Friday). Having a log jam at QB or RB can be very damaging to a team.

I know I said “as many as we can” but I hope you understand I wasn’t to be taken literally. I meant take one every year, best available you can get, and let competition sort the field.

I do believe iron sharpens iron. AM didn’t improve in part because he didn’t have any competition. He even said as much when he knew the starting job was his and he didn’t work as hard as he could have in the offseason prior to his sophomore season. That’s not a recipe for good in my opinion.

The baseball analogy is apt. 3-4 really good pitchers. 4 really good QBs. Why limit yourself to a really good starter and then backups who won’t leave?

 

[rgrachek]

I know I said “as many as we can” but I hope you understand I wasn’t to be taken literally. I meant take one every year, best available you can get, and let competition sort the field.

I do believe iron sharpens iron. AM didn’t improve in part because he didn’t have any competition. He even said as much when he knew the starting job was his and he didn’t work as hard as he could have in the offseason prior to his sophomore season. That’s not a recipe for good in my opinion.

The baseball analogy is apt. 3-4 really good pitchers. 4 really good QBs. Why limit yourself to a really good starter and then backups who won’t leave?

Respectfully, 3-4 really good pitchers is not the same thing as 4 really good QBs, because the 3-4 pitchers all have equivalent roles. 4 really good QBs means that 3 really good QBs never play except in mop up. This leads to frustration that both pollutes the culture of the team and ultimately results in them leaving.

AM didn't work hard because of the culture instilled by Frost. Tommie Frazier had the starting QB job locked up for 3 years and still worked hard. Same can be said for David Humm, Tom Sorley, Turner Gill, Steve Taylor, Eric Crouch (he had a little competition before his sophomore year), and Zack Taylor. Taylor Martinez worked his butt off and when healthy, he was always our best option. Same for Tommy Armstrong.

 

[timnsun]

Respectfully, 3-4 really good pitchers is not the same thing as 4 really good QBs, because the 3-4 pitchers all have equivalent roles. 4 really good QBs means that 3 really good QBs never play except in mop up. This leads to frustration that both pollutes the culture of the team and ultimately results in them leaving.

AM didn't work hard because of the culture instilled by Frost. Tommie Frazier had the starting QB job locked up for 3 years and still worked hard. Same can be said for David Humm, Tom Sorley, Turner Gill, Steve Taylor, Eric Crouch (he had a little competition before his sophomore year), and Zack Taylor. Taylor Martinez worked his butt off and when healthy, he was always our best option. Same for Tommy Armstrong.

Look, we are gonna have to agree to disagree. I totally get the culture thing, absolutely true, but it wasn’t just because AM had it locked up. He had no competition. Gebbia was supposed to be that and he left. I know this supports your argument. But who else did we bring in after that? Luke McCaffrey? Not a QB, maybe a little better version of HH, maybe.

The guys you named were longtime starters because of the culture, you are right. But TO went with other QBs when necessary. 1990-91 show that pretty clearly. Last year we didn’t have anybody to go to. They all stunk up the joint mostly. I don’t want a starter and then a bunch of guys that other teams aren’t trying to pry away.

If the culture is right, the guys that leave really didn’t fit the culture and we will bring in someone else who does. Ultimately, if the culture is solid, guys will stick around longer.

Nice back and forth here, we don’t agree on method necessarily, but we both want to see a winning program. We will see how it all works out.

 

[rgrachek]

Look, we are gonna have to agree to disagree. I totally get the culture thing, absolutely true, but it wasn’t just because AM had it locked up. He had no competition. Gebbia was supposed to be that and he left. I know this supports your argument. But who else did we bring in after that? Luke McCaffrey? Not a QB, maybe a little better version of HH, maybe.

The guys you named were longtime starters because of the culture, you are right. But TO went with other QBs when necessary. 1990-91 show that pretty clearly. Last year we didn’t have anybody to go to. They all stunk up the joint mostly. I don’t want a starter and then a bunch of guys that other teams aren’t trying to pry away.

If the culture is right, the guys that leave really didn’t fit the culture and we will bring in someone else who does. Ultimately, if the culture is solid, guys will stick around longer.

Nice back and forth here, we don’t agree on method necessarily, but we both want to see a winning program. We will see how it all works out.

To be clear, I don't want a good starter and then a bunch of mediocre other guys either. I just think that after bringing in 2 legit freshman in 2024, we should wait and get a really solid guy in 2026, then maybe in 2028. If we have some defections, we can get one in 2027 too.

I would feel differently if we had brought in 2 three star guys in 2024, but with DR, things are kind of different. None of us saw that coming.

 

[GBRforLife1]

Name me one team in college football who had a 3rd year player like say Caleb Williams being backed up by another 3rd to 4th year player like say Jayden Daniels. It NEVER happens anymore.

4 of the 6 QBs drafted in the first round of the NFL draft in 2024 were players who transferred.

What you said above does not happen all of the time in college football, it almost never happens.

Jalen hurts was backed up by Tua.