Do you think these Big Ten teams will be better or worse than they were in 2020?

scarletred

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Cornicator, Purdue non con is much tougher and the only difference in conference play is we play Michigan and the boilers play their intrastate rival..
 

BoilerN

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There seems to be a narrative out there about Northwestern as if they compete for the division championship every year. Fitz is indeed a great coach, but the way they recruit means they have to develop their teams to compete around experienced 3rd, 4th, and even 5th year upperclassmen.

Last season was a prime example as the ESPN SP+ had Northwestern as the most experienced team in the Big Ten and one of top 5 oldest teams in all of college football. 17 of those starters are gone from that team including 6 players on the defensive front 7 who started more than 150 combined games.

REAL history illustrates that Northwestern often has a sub .500 to .500 season anytime they have to rebuild their roster like the present.

See 2019, 2016, 2014, and 2013.


As for Purdue and Phil Steele's rankings:

Phil likes the Pass Pro element of the offensive line. And that function of the unit is actually pretty damn good, especially when you consider how often Purdue throws the football. The problem for Purdue is the ball control spread passing game makes it really damn difficult to sustain a running game. Big Ten teams have now adjusted and started to get really exotic with coverages.

A win is a win, but if Purdue doesn't get the luxury of facing Spencer Petras in his miserable debut or the 4th string QB at Illinois in week 2, then its very possible the Boilers would have lost their last 8 Big Ten games.

The early success for Coach Brohm has tapered off now that teams have had to adjust. Karlaftis is a great football player and future Pro. There is no doubt, but college football teams playing their 3rd scheme in 3 seasons often encounter serious challenges.

Also, I think Purdue's schedule is actually tougher than Nebraska's.
I didn't think NU lost quite that much. I was thinking some of the guys came back for another year. I agree 100% with the NU model you outlined above.

I'm curious to see how run blocking is for Purdue this year. The issue has been size and ability to push around a dline for the run game. Haven't had it because of all the underclassmen, which you don't want on the line. That is slowly changing, but probably still a year away. There is talent on the line though.

Defensive scheme will also be interesting. Seems like they want to adopt year 1 Holt, last year iu defense. Get to the QB. I really like the starting DL. Really like it. After that? Big big ?.
 

BoilerN

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Sure are a lot of chefs in the kitchen on that Purdue defense, 3 Co Defensive coordinators? Lead Co-Defensive Coordinator?
Pretty clear and obvious who the real DC is. The one who is calling plays. Me thinks the other two are titles to help attract the other two coaches to Purdue and give them the money. I guess it doesn't bother me much.
 

Tuco Salamanca

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Purdue could easily win 6. I'm just hear for discussion because what else is there football wise right now? I brought no bias to the party, just facts, yet somehow, I was bias?
List the 6 wins for Purdue in 2021

Oregon St - Toss Up
at UConn - Win
at ND - Loss
Illinois - I'll give you the win
Minnesota - Loss
at Iowa - Loss
Wisconsin - Loss
at Nebraska - Toss up so as not to show bias
Michigan St - Win
at Ohio St - Loss
at Northwestern - Loss
Indiana - Loss

Imho - Purdue has to win all of the toss ups just to reach 5. There just isn't a whole lot of wiggle room to get to 6, and it sure as hell won't be "easily win 6"
 
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Joe M

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Illinois - Marginally better
Michigan State - Better than 2020 Rutgers
Michigan - Better than 2020 PSU
NW - Worse
Minnesota - Better
Purdue - Same
OSU - Worse
WI - Better
Iowa - Worse
Nebraska - Better
 

BoilerN

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List the 6 wins for Purdue in 2021

Oregon St - Toss Up
at UConn - Win
at ND - Loss
Illinois - I'll give you the win
Minnesota - Loss
at Iowa - Loss
Wisconsin - Loss
at Nebraska - Toss up so as not to show bias
Michigan St - Win
at Ohio St - Loss
at Northwestern - Loss
Indiana - Loss

Imho - Purdue has to win all of the toss ups just to reach 5. There just isn't a whole lot of wiggle room to get to 6, and it sure as hell won't be "easily win 6"
Why is minny, iowa, NU, and iu losses? To me, they are toss-ups. Brohm also plays Wisconsin tough. Should have won last time they played. Not calling it a toss-up, but its my spoilermaker pick. Doubt Purdue gets osu because they will be great and they usually go back and forth. Sometimes a couple wins in a row for osu. Not dominate in the last 15 years though. Curious to see the ND game. Not saying it's a win. Don't expect it, put Purdue has always played them tough. Being at ND sucks. Just glad the series is back.
 

Cornicator

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Cornicator, Purdue non con is much tougher and the only difference in conference play is we play Michigan and the boilers play their intrastate rival..

Much tougher? Tougher for sure

Buffalo, Fordham, Oklahoma
UConn, Oregon St, Notre Dame


Oregon State will be better than Buffalo in 2021
UCONN is pretty awful but they're still better than Fordham
Oklahoma is obviously better than Notre Dame, but its still a tough opponent for Purdue.

And Indiana will be better than Michigan in 2021... IMO.
 
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BoilerN

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Oregon State will be better than Buffalo in 2021
UCONN is pretty awful but they're still better than Fordham
Oklahoma is obviously better than Notre Dame, but its still a tough opponent for Purdue.

And Indiana will be better than Michigan in 2021... IMO.
I need another year to buy the hype of iu. A year to A. See if it was real or some lucky bounces and B. Covid. If Penix stays healthy, I might tend to agree with you. That's a big if though. They lost some depth on the Dline as well. To Purdue actually.
 

Tuco Salamanca

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Why is minny, iowa, NU, and iu losses? To me, they are toss-ups. Brohm also plays Wisconsin tough. Should have won last time they played. Not calling it a toss-up, but its my spoilermaker pick. Doubt Purdue gets osu because they will be great and they usually go back and forth. Sometimes a couple wins in a row for osu. Not dominate in the last 15 years though. Curious to see the ND game. Not saying it's a win. Don't expect it, put Purdue has always played them tough. Being at ND sucks. Just glad the series is back.
Wisconsin is 10 - 0 last 10 against Purdue
Minnesota is 7-3 last 10 against Purdue
Iowa is 6-4 in the last against Purdue - even though Purdue has won 3 of 4. Game is in Iowa City and isn't the first game of the year against a 1st time starting QB.
Indiana is just a better team under Allen and is still 6-4 over the last 10 against Purdue.

Playing teams tough is not a precursor to a victory. Close losses are still just losses.


Edit - I get that you are all geeked up because it is the preseason and everyone is undefeated and there is a smell of hope in the air. But Purdue has had only four 6 win seasons in the last 12 years (2 winning 7-6 and 2 6-6), Brohm changes defensive coaches like underwear, you are taking transfers from teams where they were probably no going to play for the team they left.

To say that Purdue will easily win 6 games in 2021 with the schedule they play is bold and probably a bit delusional.
 
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BoilerN

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Wisconsin is 10 - 0 last 10 against Purdue
Minnesota is 7-3 last 10 against Purdue
Iowa is 6-4 in the last against Purdue - even though Purdue has won 3 of 4. Game is in Iowa City and isn't the first game of the year against a 1st time starting QB.
Indiana is just a better team under Allen and is still 6-4 over the last 10 against Purdue.

Playing teams tough is not a precursor to a victory. Close losses are still just losses.


Edit - I get that you are all geeked up because it is the preseason and everyone is undefeated and there is a smell of hope in the air. But Purdue has had only four 6 win seasons in the last 12 years (2 winning 7-6 and 2 6-6), Brohm changes defensive coaches like underwear, you are taking transfers from teams where they were probably no going to play for the team they left.

To say that Purdue will easily win 6 games in 2021 with the schedule they play is bold and probably a bit delusional.
Use 10 year records for the last two years of Hope and Hazell like they apply. Lol Iowa and Wisconsin are better teams than Purdue. But brohm has Iowa's number and plays Wisconsin tough. Iu is a rivalry game and the only loss is OT.

Which transfers did Brohm take that wouldn't have played at their school? You not like the new defensive staff? 6-6 isn't optimistic, it's reasonable. 8-4 is optimistic.
 

leodisflowers

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Use 10 year records for the last two years of Hope and Hazell like they apply. Lol Iowa and Wisconsin are better teams than Purdue. But brohm has Iowa's number and plays Wisconsin tough. Iu is a rivalry game and the only loss is OT.

Which transfers did Brohm take that wouldn't have played at their school? You not like the new defensive staff? 6-6 isn't optimistic, it's reasonable. 8-4 is optimistic.
Easy there Palsie. Let me refresh you:

7-6
6-7
4-8
2-4

I'd say at this point 6-6 is optimistic as hell 4-8 is a more likely scenario. 8-4 would be the best you've ever done under Brohm and your roster is not that good.... Like mentioned, yes you have a few studs, but not a team full of them. You can't run the ball and your QB is very mediocre. Hard to win 8 games with a bad-to ok QB and no run game. Also, your D has no depth and outside the DL, there is nothing there to say you will be able to stop anyone. Like Aaron Rodgers would say R-E-L-A-X. It's Purdue. You should be happy if you win 4-5 games a year.

Since 2000 your average is a 5-6 ball club.
 

Tuco Salamanca

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Use 10 year records for the last two years of Hope and Hazell like they apply. Lol Iowa and Wisconsin are better teams than Purdue. But brohm has Iowa's number and plays Wisconsin tough. Iu is a rivalry game and the only loss is OT.

Which transfers did Brohm take that wouldn't have played at their school? You not like the new defensive staff? 6-6 isn't optimistic, it's reasonable. 8-4 is optimistic.
I used 10 meeting records because it is a round number, easily accessible, and provides for trends. When you only play Ohio St once every 4 years, so I am not going to look at the 10 year record to show Purdue is 1-2 vs Ohio St.

You keep telling yourself that 6 is reasonable. Last I checked vegas had Purdue win total at 5 1/2 (+115) you could make a little bit of coin on betting that over.

I also believe you were also on here last year, at this time, telling us how Disco Bob was going to work out at Purdue. Other than beating an Iowa team in their first game with a new QB, Purdue was Purdue in 2020, and 2019, 2018, 2017, 2016 and so on.
 
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Cornicator

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I need another year to buy the hype of iu. A year to A. See if it was real or some lucky bounces and B. Covid. If Penix stays healthy, I might tend to agree with you. That's a big if though. They lost some depth on the Dline as well. To Purdue actually.


That's fair. But my opinion of the two teams is is more a reflection of a Wolverines team that is shifting into a brand new 3-4 defense without a true Nose Tackle and an offense with a brand new QB vs. a very difficult front loaded schedule.

Nebraska gets them in Lincoln, a week after their QB makes his first ever road start at Wisconsin.

And Indiana brought in a ringer with Stephen Carr. I'm not sure people realize how good that kid will be for the Hoosiers.
 
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rcnut223

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List the 6 wins for Purdue in 2021

Oregon St - Toss Up
at UConn - Win
at ND - Loss
Illinois - I'll give you the win
Minnesota - Loss
at Iowa - Loss
Wisconsin - Loss
at Nebraska - Toss up so as not to show bias
Michigan St - Win
at Ohio St - Loss
at Northwestern - Loss
Indiana - Loss

Imho - Purdue has to win all of the toss ups just to reach 5. There just isn't a whole lot of wiggle room to get to 6, and it sure as hell won't be "easily win 6"
Purdue will beat Oregon ST
 

BoilerN

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Easy there Palsie. Let me refresh you:

7-6
6-7
4-8
2-4

I'd say at this point 6-6 is optimistic as hell 4-8 is a more likely scenario. 8-4 would be the best you've ever done under Brohm and your roster is not that good.... Like mentioned, yes you have a few studs, but not a team full of them. You can't run the ball and your QB is very mediocre. Hard to win 8 games with a bad-to ok QB and no run game. Also, your D has no depth and outside the DL, there is nothing there to say you will be able to stop anyone. Like Aaron Rodgers would say R-E-L-A-X. It's Purdue. You should be happy if you win 4-5 games a year.

Since 2000 your average is a 5-6 ball club.
A below average QB? Stats say otherwise. FYI. 6-6 isn't optimistic as hell. It's reasonable. DL is solid and with transfers, should have depth. LB and DB has potential. They don't have to be great tho, just keep teams under 30.
 

BoilerN

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I used 10 meeting records because it is a round number, easily accessible, and provides for trends. When you only play Ohio St once every 4 years, so I am not going to look at the 10 year record to show Purdue is 1-2 vs Ohio St.

You keep telling yourself that 6 is reasonable. Last I checked vegas had Purdue win total at 5 1/2 (+115) you could make a little bit of coin on betting that over.

I also believe you were also on here last year, at this time, telling us how Disco Bob was going to work out at Purdue. Other than beating an Iowa team in their first game with a new QB, Purdue was Purdue in 2020, and 2019, 2018, 2017, 2016 and so on.
Hate to say this, but 2-2 vs osu in the last 10. 3-3 in the last 12 (osu vacated one, but still counting it).

Diaco's drama was bad. Defense was middle of the pack big ten in ppg. So his D wasn't the worst.
 
Northwestern has improved recruiting, since 2014. Also, throwing out 2016 falls flat.

2016, Pat Fitzgerald was 7-6.

Frankly, many of the teams in the Big Ten don't reach that consistency.

@Cornicator 2019 was an outlier.

QB and WR were issues, much like how PFF College is pointing to Nebraska for 2021.

Transfer from Kansas should help Northwestern in 2021. Defense and recruiting are two positives Northwestern can likely rely on in 2021.

A season like 2016 is a far cry from sub-500 seasons Purdue, Rutgers, Maryland and others have been battling lately.

Pat Fitzgerald has two of the Big Ten's better sophomores at LT and safety. Looking at the best of the position series, Northwestern has some players to build around.

QB is always a key. The win in 2018 at Purdue was huge, despite an awful September start overall by Northwestern.

The Northwestern-Nebraska series has been a good one the past 10 years in the Big Ten. Some outstanding games.

7-6 would be huge for Scott Frost in 2021. It is a likely mark for Northwestern this season.
 
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Tuco Salamanca

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Hate to say this, but 2-2 vs osu in the last 10. 3-3 in the last 12 (osu vacated one, but still counting it).

Diaco's drama was bad. Defense was middle of the pack big ten in ppg. So his D wasn't the worst.
No in the last 10 meetings you are 4-6, shocker Purdue with a losing record against a Big Ten team the last 10 meetings. 15-40 overall against Ohio St.
 
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BoilerN

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No in the last 10 meetings you are 4-6, shocker Purdue with a losing record against a Big Ten team the last 10 meetings. 15-40 overall against Ohio St.
Clearly you have zero desire to learn about Nebraska's opponents, so. Or know more than me about Purdue. I'm done arguing about Purdue next season. I'll gladly discuss. It's beyond that though. Have fun blocking George.

Most people who live in this great state are more reasonable.
 

John_J_Rambo

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Clearly you have zero desire to learn about Nebraska's opponents, so. Or know more than me about Purdue. I'm done arguing about Purdue next season. I'll gladly discuss. It's beyond that though. Have fun blocking George.

Most people who live in this great state are more reasonable.
you're right. there is not a single person interested in learning anything about an afterthought like purdue

the lion's share of Husker fans wish we weren't forced to play them every year because they are such a throwaway, uninteresting, shoulder-shruggingly lame opponent
 
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BoilerN

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you're right. there is not a single person interested in learning anything about an afterthought like purdue

the lion's share of Husker fans wish we weren't forced to play them every year because they are such a throwaway, uninteresting, shoulder-shruggingly lame opponent
Yet, Nebraska is basically the same program as them right now and is showing no signs of jumping ahead.
 

Tuco Salamanca

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Clearly you have zero desire to learn about Nebraska's opponents, so. Or know more than me about Purdue. I'm done arguing about Purdue next season. I'll gladly discuss. It's beyond that though. Have fun blocking George.

Most people who live in this great state are more reasonable.
You are only interested in getting people to agree with your opinion on Purdue. I guess I am sorry?? that you haven’t convinced me that your team is anything more than a 3-5 win team.

I am familiar enough with the teams in the Big Ten West for my purposes on this forum. Thank you for your concern.
 

antirowboat

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Going into 2021, do you believe the following Big Ten teams on Nebraska's schedule, will be worse or better than what they were in 2020? And yes, I'm replacing Rutgers with Michigan State and Penn State with Michigan.

Illinois
Michigan State- ( Will MSU be better or worse than Rutgers in 2020?)
Michigan - ( Will Michigan be better or worse than Penn State in 2020?)
Northwestern
Minnesota
Purdue
Ohio State
Wisconsin
Iowa


And then finally, do you think Nebraska will have a better team or worse team than their 2020 squad?
Illinois - worse. Learning everything new.

Michigan State- better. Massive roster turnover. How could they be worse?

Michigan - worse.

Northwestern - Worse. They are at the bottom of the country in returning production.

Minnesota - better.

Purdue - about the same

Ohio State - better

Wisconsin - better since they couldn't be any worse on offense.

Iowa - about the same
 

John_J_Rambo

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Yet, Nebraska is basically the same program as them right now and is showing no signs of jumping ahead.
you circle the Nebraska game every year.

we will never, ever return that level of respect.

simple as that. we've always been ahead, and will always be ahead, no matter how far we fall.
 

BoilerN

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You are only interested in getting people to agree with your opinion on Purdue. I guess I am sorry?? that you haven’t convinced me that your team is anything more than a 3-5 win team.

I am familiar enough with the teams in the Big Ten West for my purposes on this forum. Thank you for your concern.
So what makes you think Nebraska will be better? Honest question?
 

BoilerN

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you circle the Nebraska game every year.

we will never, ever return that level of respect.

simple as that.
Purdue fans circle it as a very winnable game yes. We don't circle it as a "this is a huge game.". Because Purdue fans could care less. We circle osu, iu (rivalry), Notre Dame (before they cancelled the series for a few years, and Minnesota because it's fun to see fleck lose.

Most fans don't know crap about Nebraska. Only reason I do is because I've lived here for years.
 
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John_J_Rambo

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Purdue fans circle it as a very winnable game yes. We don't circle it as a "this is a huge game.". Because Purdue fans could care less. We circle osu, iu (rivalry), Notre Dame (before they cancelled the series for a few years, and Minnesota because it's fun to see fleck lose.

Most fans don't know crap about Nebraska. Only reason I do is because I've lived here for years.
purdue, like its tiny faction of fans, is a zero

little man syndrome may be the only thing more prevalent than pedophilia in the b1g
 

Tuco Salamanca

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So what makes you think Nebraska will be better? Honest question?
First of all I am not sure I have stated that Nebraska will be better. but since you asked,

Nebraska returns similar number of starters, will be able to run the ball better than Purdue will, and Nebraska was 10 points better than Purdue last year in West Lafayette. This game is in Lincoln, Nebraska will be coming off a bye and Purdue will be coming off a game against Wisconsin. Simple
 
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dinglefritz

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our most effective offensive player (Mills) left
and I think he's being replaced with guys with more talent than him. In addition I believe our WR corp will be much more talented as well. I watched a little bit of a 2017 game Riley was coaching on the B1G network. Good heavens we had DPE, Spielman AND Morgan. Unfortunately Tanner Lee was being pummeled and trying to throw them the ball.
 

BoilerN

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First of all I am not sure I have stated that Nebraska will be better. but since you asked,

Nebraska returns similar number of starters, will be able to run the ball better than Purdue will, and Nebraska was 10 points better than Purdue last year in West Lafayette. This game is in Lincoln, Nebraska will be coming off a bye and Purdue will be coming off a game against Wisconsin. Simple
If only last years Purdue team was similar to this year's... we shall see. Should be a good game.
 

nu2u

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The consensus seems to be that Illinois will be worse this year, I disagree.

As sure as the Earth revolves around the Sun, you can count on Bret Bielema to install a power run, ball control offense at Illinois. The key here is that Lovey Smith left Bielema with the talent and raw ingredients to probably make it work reasonably well this year. Will it work right away? I expect that there will be a learning curve and adjustments early.

Four OL starters return - this could be the best unit on the team. Running behind them will be Chase Brown, the single biggest beneficiary of the coaching change IMO. Bielema likes work horse RBs; Brown will be that player. If he stays healthy, do not be surprised if Brown challenges for B10 rushing leader this year. Mike Epstein is a capable back up but is injury prone. Both players averaged more than 5 ypc last year. Reggie Love was a 4-star recruit that didn't see much action as a freshman last year.

6th year ex-Michigan QB Brandon Peters returns. WR unit is almost a build from scratch with a couple of transfers (from ND and Miami) and 5-star QB recruit moving to WR all competing to start. They also have a couple of decent TEs. Bret like to use his TEs. Peters is serviceable QB, nothing more. Expect more play-action pass plays to compliment the run first offense.

Don't know much about their defense other than they return a couple All-Big Ten players and that Bielema was impressed with DL play MLB performance this Spring.

Looking at their schedule, I see 5-7 as the most probable finish.
 
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Cornicator

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The consensus seems to be that Illinois will be worse this year, I disagree.

As sure as the Earth revolves around the Sun, you can count on Bret Bielema to install a power run, ball control offense at Illinois. The key here is that Lovey Smith left Bielema with the talent and raw ingredients to probably make it work reasonably well this year. Will it work right away? I expect that there will be a learning curve and adjustments early.

Four OL starters return - this could be the best unit on the team. Running behind them will be Chase Brown, the single biggest beneficiary of the coaching change IMO. Bielema likes work horse RBs; Brown will be that player. If he stays healthy, do not be surprised if Brown challenges for B10 rushing leader this year. Mike Epstein is a capable back up but is injury prone. Both players averaged more than 5 ypc last year. Reggie Love was a 4-star recruit that didn't see much action last year.

6th year ex-Michigan QB Brandon Peters returns. WR unit is almost a build from scratch with a couple of transfers (from ND and Miami) and 5-star QB recruit moving to WR all competing to start. They also have a couple of decent TEs. Bret like to use his TEs. Peters is serviceable QB, nothing more. Expect more play-action pass plays to compliment the run first offense.

Don't know much about their defense other than they return a couple All-Big Ten players and that Bielema was impressed with DL play MLB performance this Spring.

Looking at their schedule, I see 5-7 as the most probable finish.



This is my reaction every time I read comments from someone who thinks Brett Bielema is an offensive coach "instilling an offense":

c0PvpF.gif



Illinois will be running the Pistol. They hired the OC from Appalachian State.

They're also shifting to the 3-4 without a true Nose and an absence of depth up front. Their linebackers are good though.
 

SWIowahawks

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I see improvement from Minnesota, Wisconsin, Nebraska, and Illinois. Iowa should hold steady and be around the 8-9 win mark. Start 2-0 and 10 wins would be the floor.

NW will take a step back. Someone else pointed it out but they have down years before their surprise seasons.

The loser of the Illinois/Purdue game Sept 25 with finish the division in last.

Nebraska is on the verge of being good. The season hinges on Adrian Martinez’ health, IMO.

I’m not on the Wisconsin hype train. They will be better than last year but they aren’t unbeatable by anyone in the division. They don’t have that stud RB that beats teams on his own.