A case that talent was primary Issue for recent struggles and should be mostly fixed starting in 2021

poundth3rock

Sophomore
Jul 20, 2007
1,272
301
83
Kansas
I am normally an optimistic person but also would like to believe that I am semi realistic or at least not completely dillusional. In the last 7 years I don’t post much because I haven’t felt much if any optimism about a our chances and honestly Husker football fandom has been more a chore than fun. I believe that will change in 2021 and will attempt to articulate how much I think the roster has improved and why this thing may just turn around in year 4.

Definitions / Background for analysis

High Rated – 5.7 or better

Blue Chip – 5.9 or Better

Stats - Rankings from Rivals which is not perfect but generally is a good approximation at macro level and also consistent with recent lack of conference honorees and draft choices

Assumption it typically takes 2-3 years to derail a good roster if a new coach doesn’t effectively recruit and about same amount of time to build up a poor roster if that is what you inherit

2014-2017 Recruiting (4 years prior Frost)

Landed High Rated– 33

Retained – 14 for 2018

Blue Chips – (Farmer, Gebbia, and Lindsey)

With Lindsey and Gebbia being transition casualties left Frost with 12 total high rated players and 1 Blue Chip from the group as the core of his first two teams. Conclusion is Frost inherited a well below Big Ten average roster from Riley. I personally think there a lot of Husker fans that don't necessarily agree with this. But rankings, lack of drafted players ands conference honorees all point to this opinion being accurate.

2018 to 2021 (Frost Classes)

Landed - High Rated 62

Retained – 44 for 2021

Blue Chips Available - 11 (Martinez, Henrich, Benhardt, Robinson, Gates, Betts Corcoran, Manning, Joseph, Fidone, Prochazka)

1QB, 3OL, 3WR, 1DL, 1LB, 2Sec

Only 1 of the 44 are Seniors or two if you count Cam Talyor Britt which means a vast majority of the high rated players will be around for next 2-3 years.


Scott has landed twice the high rated recruits as previous four years and retained 3 times the number with 5 times the Blue Chips if you remove Gebbia who transferred before 2018 year started and leave Lindsey because his was available that first year.

2014-2017 recruiting ineffectiveness outlined above had massive impacts across the board on the Staffs early lack of success but most notably at offensive line where it killed any chance of fielding a competitive offense in 2019 after Foster/Farmer graduated. Also, likely main cause of Martinez regression from 2018 to 2019 and into 2020.

The 2019 interior o-line of So Hixson, RF 265 Lb converted TE Jurgens and a below Big Ten average and injured Wilson was, in my opinion, the worst interion o-line in the BIG when you factor impact of snaps. Sophomore Farniok was also well below Big Ten average right tackle and LT So James was the only solid player at that point being a Big Ten average left tackle as a Sophmore. This overall offensive line was in bottom 2-3 in league and derailed Martinez who didn’t do himself any favors in 2019 with the extra weight that slowed his running which was really impactful as running for his life was one of our key plays in 2019. The combination of line play and Martinez regressions effectively tied an arm behind Scotts back as a play caller as well. The only good thing that came out of this was the 2019 screen pass post on Rivals about a week ago. After Frost ran 44 times for 98 yards against a bad South Alabama team to start the season, I assume he realized they would need to do other things against big ten teams and I think the number of screens were one of those other things.

While it was only Rutgers in our final game of 2020, with the three Freshman and a sophomore on the oline we put up significantly more yards against them than any other team they played and only OSU averaged more per play against them. I expect the left side with Top 100 Corcoran, Piper and Jurgens to continue to develop over Spring and Fall and to be flat out imposing in the run game in 2021 and more than competitive in pass protection with the right side holding there own or Big Ten average.

To provide perspective on improvement in the Oline room, the only 2019 player I think that would make the two deep in 2021 would be So James as backup to Corcoran. I would even take this a step further and say you could field a second team line from 2021 group with scholarship backups that would significantly outperform that 2019 line which is staggering to think about.


While concerning to some, WR/TE group has 9 high rated players and still has 3 blue chips even without Robinson. Martin, Brown, Flack, Allen, Volkolek along with transfer Touré should ensure this groups floor is competitive (slightly below Big Ten avg.). What I believe will separate this group from competitive to good is the likelihood of 1 or more of Betts, Manning and/or Fidone developing into a “Dude” over Spring and Fall camp. Only the o-line has as many Blue Chip recruits as our WR/TE group and I expect that to show up in 2021 as all but 3 of the 9 are returning players. We also caught a break with Manning on not losing a year of eligibility given that he wasn't physically/mentally ready to help which is one of reasons many schools typically avoid all but highest rated 2 year Jucos. With the extra year, Every one but Toure/Flack will be back in 2022 so this group could develop similarly to o-line moving forward and be something special relative to recent Nebraska standards.


I think of the concept of synergy or whole being greater than some of parts for my offensive expectations in 2021. It will start with an effective running game behind this o-line that Allen has assembled along with Martinez and a serviceable RB that I am sure exists within our 6 Scholorship backs. This will put Martinez and Frost in a high percentage of advantageous (run-pass) down and distances which is were he is most effective. There is simply too much talent at WR not to at least be as good as 2018. In that scenario 2018 Freshman Martinez threw for 18 TD and and 7 INT. I think the talent around him in 2021 will be significantly better than 2018 when you factor in O-line. I personally wouldn’t be a bit surprised if Martinez throws something like 22 TD with 8 interceptions and 600 plus rushing yards with the player around him and Frosts ability to better manage play calling with the running game he will be able to use in 2021.

This is an incredibly important year for Scott and for Husker football. Fairly quietly, a solid roster has been built that will return almost everyone in 2022 on offense including what could be a top 2-3 o-line in the big ten. If Frost comes out and demonstrate the offense that many people expected and goes 6-2 in West (likely minimum record to win West) he will be able to maintain or even accelerate what I believe has been West Division leading recruiting into the 2022 class. The 2022 team will also likely start the year ranked, with expectations and a lot of momentum.

IF he cannot win at least 7 games with the talent we have in 2021 I don’t see how he could win much more in 2022 with basically the same players returning. At that point, given the talent, I will probably have to agree with the crowd claiming he cannot coach and that we just playing string out for the next guy. Personally I don't think this will be the case and very excited for 2021.
 

jlb321

Defensive Coordinator
Aug 8, 2014
7,937
8,692
113
My god ... ?? 7 wins

reminder that Kirk Ferentz after being 1-10 and 3-9 in his first 2 years at lowly Iowa, went undefeated in the big ten - went to the orange bowl and finished the season ranked 8th in the nation in year 4

Yet people will be doing cartwheels for 7 wins at a UN
 
Last edited:

poundth3rock

Sophomore
Jul 20, 2007
1,272
301
83
Kansas
My god ... ?? 7 wins

reminder that Kirk Ferentz in year 4 at lowly Iowa, went undefeated in the big ten - went to the orange bowl and finished the season ranked 8th in the nation

Yet people will be doing cartwheels for 7 wins at a UN

I think i said if he cannot win 7 games with this roster he should not be retained. I wouldn't categorize that comment as cartwheels for 7 wins. Basic point was he inherited a bad roster and it is not bad anymore. He has the players to start winning now and if he doesn't I basically agree with the fire the coach crowd. Personally, I think he should and also think he will win the West with this group of players.
 

timnsun

Assistant Head Coach
Jan 25, 2008
10,301
13,005
113
7 wins...in year four? After 3 straight losing seasons? My how the bar has been lowered.

Anything less than a division title his head should be on the chopping block going in to year 5.
You are possibly one of frosts harshest critics… Would it surprise you if Frost won seven games next year? If so, then what gives?
 

jlb321

Defensive Coordinator
Aug 8, 2014
7,937
8,692
113
You are possibly one of frosts harshest critics… Would it surprise you if Frost won seven games next year? If so, then what gives?

no it would not surprise me ..nor would it surprise me that the fan base will delight in this 7 win "achievement" .. I have stated very early on that frost will turn Neb into Iowa and the fans will rejoice
 

TruHusker

Offensive Coordinator
Sep 21, 2001
9,405
4,259
113
!. What about the D?
2. How do we measure player development? Is it occurring at the level many expect?
3. No mention of S&C.
4. On paper, this seems logical and provides hope.
 

timnsun

Assistant Head Coach
Jan 25, 2008
10,301
13,005
113
no it would not surprise me ..nor would it surprise me that the fan base will delight in this 7 win "achievement" .. I have stated very early on that frost will turn Neb into Iowa and the fans will rejoice
Thanks. But I didn’t ask you. I know full well where you stand. My question was for huskerbaseball13.
 

jlb321

Defensive Coordinator
Aug 8, 2014
7,937
8,692
113
You are possibly one of frosts harshest critics… Would it surprise you if Frost won seven games next year? If so, then what gives?


to clarify ... I am not being a harsh critic of frost .. I am being a harsh critic of the Neb coach - whomever that may be, who after 3 years has a < .400 winning percentage and has failed to win more than 3 conference games in any of his first 3 seasons

I simply do not give the Neb coach, who has the worst 3 year record in over 60 years, a pass just because his last name happens to be frost
 
Last edited:

timnsun

Assistant Head Coach
Jan 25, 2008
10,301
13,005
113
to clarify ... I am not being a harsh critic of frost .. I am being a harsh critic and the Neb coach - whomever that may be, who after 3 years has a < .400 winning percentage and has failed to win more than 3 conference games in any of his first 3 seasons

I simply do not give the Neb coach, who has the worst 3 year record in over 60 years, a pass just because his last name happens to be frost
And to clarify... I wasn’t talking to you. I was talking to huskerbaseball13.
 

headcard

Nebraska Legend
Feb 2, 2005
34,528
28,470
113
to clarify ... I am not being a harsh critic of frost .. I am being a harsh critic and the Neb coach - whomever that may be, who after 3 years has a < .400 winning percentage and has failed to win more than 3 conference games in any of his first 3 seasons

I simply do not give the Neb coach, who has the worst 3 year record in over 60 years, a pass just because his last name happens to be frost

Why does it matter what a fan of another team thinks?
 

mgbreis

Blackshirt
Dec 16, 2004
3,467
5,827
113
to clarify ... I am not being a harsh critic of frost .. I am being a harsh critic and the Neb coach - whomever that may be, who after 3 years has a < .400 winning percentage and has failed to win more than 3 conference games in any of his first 3 seasons

I simply do not give the Neb coach, who has the worst 3 year record in over 60 years, a pass just because his last name happens to be frost
This whole "giving him a pass" concept is just you driving your narrative. What does that even mean? I see virtually no one making excuses or saying they're ok with what Frost has done. I think I'm definitely one that bitches about him the least, and I still say unequivocally that he has sucked. If they fired him today I wouldn't complain, but that's not going to happen and we're all going to watch the games.... so what is it exactly that you want from "the fans?" Should we all get a tattoo that says "7 wins sucks!"? Some people will be happy about it, some will be unhappy about it, and you'll be over here pronouncing that "all the fans are celebrating 7 wins!" Like you're the arbiter of how the fan base gets to feel about anything.
 

inWV

Defensive Coordinator
Sep 22, 2007
7,486
5,463
113
To my eyes the talent on the Oline has improved. I’m not worried about WR, there are enough guys in that room such that there should be 4 to 5 guys that can play. I think the wild card is running back. Again there are a lot of guys in that room, but we didn’t see anyone really emerge when Mills was hurt and Wandale had to be the primary guy. Too much pressure was put on the quarterbacks to generate offense with their feet and B1G defenses adjusted accordingly. Having a couple of backs that everyone feels comfortable with playing will be a huge thing.
 
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poundth3rock

Sophomore
Jul 20, 2007
1,272
301
83
Kansas
!. What about the D?
2. How do we measure player development? Is it occurring at the level many expect?
3. No mention of S&C.
4. On paper, this seems logical and provides hope.

1. I think D should be slightly above average. It won't win games but has improved enough it won't lose us any so I didn't focus much as I think offense will make or break this staff. Until there is a legit pass rusher and an all conference D lineman or two they will not be much better than solid and I don't think either of those players are either on the roster are ready for 2021. If you want to be a Kool Aid drinker someone like Nash has to hit like Piper did and someone like Cooper has to do the same as pass rusher. While its possible, probably not likely.

2/3. S&C and Player development should be measured by testing (we don't have access to that) and by on field results for fans. You can put Hixson or Wilson in S&C all you want and they can have good technique. There ceiling is still a below big ten average to poor big ten lineman and they shouldn't have to start for Nebraska or in the Big Ten. On the other hand guys with frames and athleticism like Piper and Corcoran should be 315 and mauling dudes next year. A healthy Jurgen needs to be 300 lbs with his athleticism retained. If there is proper S&C and player development that line will be good. We will find a dude or two at WR between the 9 5.7* and better players. If there not pretty damn good on the left side and a dude at WR doesn't show there is probably a S&C and/or player development problem and Scott is probably in real trouble and we can help JBL pack his bags.

4. Point of post was for those people. Some have made up there mind this staff has no chance of winning. I think there are legitimate reason this rebuild is taking time and that we are close.

In future I will be kind enough to stick to post with less words :)
 

poundth3rock

Sophomore
Jul 20, 2007
1,272
301
83
Kansas
To my eyes the talent on the Oline has improved. I’m not worried about WR, there are enough guys in that room such that there should be 4 to 5 guys that can play. I think the wild card is running back. Again there are a lot of guys in that room, but we didn’t see anyone really emerge when Mills was hurt and Wandale had to be the primary guy. Too much pressure was put on the quarterbacks to generate offense with their feet and B1G defenses adjusted accordingly. Having a couple of backs that everyone feels comfortable with playing will be a huge thing.

Agree on RB concern which is why I am hopeful the numbers will take care of it and someone will emerge and be above average. Mills return would have ensured that. Fingers crossed on this one.
 

inWV

Defensive Coordinator
Sep 22, 2007
7,486
5,463
113
The kid coming in
Agree on RB concern which is why I am hopeful the numbers will take care of it and someone will emerge and be above average. Mills return would have ensured that. Fingers crossed on this one.
The kid coming in is on the big side and it looks like he runs really hard. I like that, the lead back needs to bring it in the B1G. He had some injuries and NU probably needs to get his body right. Hopefully Scott can improve for the second year and one of the other kids can give some production. The quarterback run game augments the production of the RBs. It isn’t a substitute unless you want to get your quarterbacks injured.
 

kbowe1sat

Walk On
Aug 7, 2005
324
141
43
I am normally an optimistic person but also would like to believe that I am semi realistic or at least not completely dillusional. In the last 7 years I don’t post much because I haven’t felt much if any optimism about a our chances and honestly Husker football fandom has been more a chore than fun. I believe that will change in 2021 and will attempt to articulate how much I think the roster has improved and why this thing may just turn around in year 4.

Definitions / Background for analysis

High Rated – 5.7 or better

Blue Chip – 5.9 or Better

Stats - Rankings from Rivals which is not perfect but generally is a good approximation at macro level and also consistent with recent lack of conference honorees and draft choices

Assumption it typically takes 2-3 years to derail a good roster if a new coach doesn’t effectively recruit and about same amount of time to build up a poor roster if that is what you inherit

2014-2017 Recruiting (4 years prior Frost)

Landed High Rated– 33

Retained – 14 for 2018

Blue Chips – (Farmer, Gebbia, and Lindsey)

With Lindsey and Gebbia being transition casualties left Frost with 12 total high rated players and 1 Blue Chip from the group as the core of his first two teams. Conclusion is Frost inherited a well below Big Ten average roster from Riley. I personally think there a lot of Husker fans that don't necessarily agree with this. But rankings, lack of drafted players ands conference honorees all point to this opinion being accurate.

2018 to 2021 (Frost Classes)

Landed - High Rated 62

Retained – 44 for 2021

Blue Chips Available - 11 (Martinez, Henrich, Benhardt, Robinson, Gates, Betts Corcoran, Manning, Joseph, Fidone, Prochazka)

1QB, 3OL, 3WR, 1DL, 1LB, 2Sec

Only 1 of the 44 are Seniors or two if you count Cam Talyor Britt which means a vast majority of the high rated players will be around for next 2-3 years.


Scott has landed twice the high rated recruits as previous four years and retained 3 times the number with 5 times the Blue Chips if you remove Gebbia who transferred before 2018 year started and leave Lindsey because his was available that first year.

2014-2017 recruiting ineffectiveness outlined above had massive impacts across the board on the Staffs early lack of success but most notably at offensive line where it killed any chance of fielding a competitive offense in 2019 after Foster/Farmer graduated. Also, likely main cause of Martinez regression from 2018 to 2019 and into 2020.

The 2019 interior o-line of So Hixson, RF 265 Lb converted TE Jurgens and a below Big Ten average and injured Wilson was, in my opinion, the worst interion o-line in the BIG when you factor impact of snaps. Sophomore Farniok was also well below Big Ten average right tackle and LT So James was the only solid player at that point being a Big Ten average left tackle as a Sophmore. This overall offensive line was in bottom 2-3 in league and derailed Martinez who didn’t do himself any favors in 2019 with the extra weight that slowed his running which was really impactful as running for his life was one of our key plays in 2019. The combination of line play and Martinez regressions effectively tied an arm behind Scotts back as a play caller as well. The only good thing that came out of this was the 2019 screen pass post on Rivals about a week ago. After Frost ran 44 times for 98 yards against a bad South Alabama team to start the season, I assume he realized they would need to do other things against big ten teams and I think the number of screens were one of those other things.

While it was only Rutgers in our final game of 2020, with the three Freshman and a sophomore on the oline we put up significantly more yards against them than any other team they played and only OSU averaged more per play against them. I expect the left side with Top 100 Corcoran, Piper and Jurgens to continue to develop over Spring and Fall and to be flat out imposing in the run game in 2021 and more than competitive in pass protection with the right side holding there own or Big Ten average.

To provide perspective on improvement in the Oline room, the only 2019 player I think that would make the two deep in 2021 would be So James as backup to Corcoran. I would even take this a step further and say you could field a second team line from 2021 group with scholarship backups that would significantly outperform that 2019 line which is staggering to think about.


While concerning to some, WR/TE group has 9 high rated players and still has 3 blue chips even without Robinson. Martin, Brown, Flack, Allen, Volkolek along with transfer Touré should ensure this groups floor is competitive (slightly below Big Ten avg.). What I believe will separate this group from competitive to good is the likelihood of 1 or more of Betts, Manning and/or Fidone developing into a “Dude” over Spring and Fall camp. Only the o-line has as many Blue Chip recruits as our WR/TE group and I expect that to show up in 2021 as all but 3 of the 9 are returning players. We also caught a break with Manning on not losing a year of eligibility given that he wasn't physically/mentally ready to help which is one of reasons many schools typically avoid all but highest rated 2 year Jucos. With the extra year, Every one but Toure/Flack will be back in 2022 so this group could develop similarly to o-line moving forward and be something special relative to recent Nebraska standards.


I think of the concept of synergy or whole being greater than some of parts for my offensive expectations in 2021. It will start with an effective running game behind this o-line that Allen has assembled along with Martinez and a serviceable RB that I am sure exists within our 6 Scholorship backs. This will put Martinez and Frost in a high percentage of advantageous (run-pass) down and distances which is were he is most effective. There is simply too much talent at WR not to at least be as good as 2018. In that scenario 2018 Freshman Martinez threw for 18 TD and and 7 INT. I think the talent around him in 2021 will be significantly better than 2018 when you factor in O-line. I personally wouldn’t be a bit surprised if Martinez throws something like 22 TD with 8 interceptions and 600 plus rushing yards with the player around him and Frosts ability to better manage play calling with the running game he will be able to use in 2021.

This is an incredibly important year for Scott and for Husker football. Fairly quietly, a solid roster has been built that will return almost everyone in 2022 on offense including what could be a top 2-3 o-line in the big ten. If Frost comes out and demonstrate the offense that many people expected and goes 6-2 in West (likely minimum record to win West) he will be able to maintain or even accelerate what I believe has been West Division leading recruiting into the 2022 class. The 2022 team will also likely start the year ranked, with expectations and a lot of momentum.

IF he cannot win at least 7 games with the talent we have in 2021 I don’t see how he could win much more in 2022 with basically the same players returning. At that point, given the talent, I will probably have to agree with the crowd claiming he cannot coach and that we just playing string out for the next guy. Personally I don't think this will be the case and very excited for 2021.
Still have to have coaches who can coach !
 

jawbreakingsafetyplay

Athletic Director
Sep 23, 2006
16,088
361
83
Miami
Bottom line, the ceiling for 2021 is 4 wins. It’s really is sad state of affairs when fans will accept this sustained mediocrity because the guy calling the plays is a legacy hire to a bygone era. With no strong changes to the coaching staff and no improvement in the QB room, there will be many Saturdays next fall where watching is optional.
 

bshirt73

Senior
Aug 31, 2014
2,694
1,651
113
I am normally an optimistic person but also would like to believe that I am semi realistic or at least not completely dillusional. In the last 7 years I don’t post much because I haven’t felt much if any optimism about a our chances and honestly Husker football fandom has been more a chore than fun. I believe that will change in 2021 and will attempt to articulate how much I think the roster has improved and why this thing may just turn around in year 4.

Definitions / Background for analysis

High Rated – 5.7 or better

Blue Chip – 5.9 or Better

Stats - Rankings from Rivals which is not perfect but generally is a good approximation at macro level and also consistent with recent lack of conference honorees and draft choices

Assumption it typically takes 2-3 years to derail a good roster if a new coach doesn’t effectively recruit and about same amount of time to build up a poor roster if that is what you inherit

2014-2017 Recruiting (4 years prior Frost)

Landed High Rated– 33

Retained – 14 for 2018

Blue Chips – (Farmer, Gebbia, and Lindsey)

With Lindsey and Gebbia being transition casualties left Frost with 12 total high rated players and 1 Blue Chip from the group as the core of his first two teams. Conclusion is Frost inherited a well below Big Ten average roster from Riley. I personally think there a lot of Husker fans that don't necessarily agree with this. But rankings, lack of drafted players ands conference honorees all point to this opinion being accurate.

2018 to 2021 (Frost Classes)

Landed - High Rated 62

Retained – 44 for 2021

Blue Chips Available - 11 (Martinez, Henrich, Benhardt, Robinson, Gates, Betts Corcoran, Manning, Joseph, Fidone, Prochazka)

1QB, 3OL, 3WR, 1DL, 1LB, 2Sec

Only 1 of the 44 are Seniors or two if you count Cam Talyor Britt which means a vast majority of the high rated players will be around for next 2-3 years.


Scott has landed twice the high rated recruits as previous four years and retained 3 times the number with 5 times the Blue Chips if you remove Gebbia who transferred before 2018 year started and leave Lindsey because his was available that first year.

2014-2017 recruiting ineffectiveness outlined above had massive impacts across the board on the Staffs early lack of success but most notably at offensive line where it killed any chance of fielding a competitive offense in 2019 after Foster/Farmer graduated. Also, likely main cause of Martinez regression from 2018 to 2019 and into 2020.

The 2019 interior o-line of So Hixson, RF 265 Lb converted TE Jurgens and a below Big Ten average and injured Wilson was, in my opinion, the worst interion o-line in the BIG when you factor impact of snaps. Sophomore Farniok was also well below Big Ten average right tackle and LT So James was the only solid player at that point being a Big Ten average left tackle as a Sophmore. This overall offensive line was in bottom 2-3 in league and derailed Martinez who didn’t do himself any favors in 2019 with the extra weight that slowed his running which was really impactful as running for his life was one of our key plays in 2019. The combination of line play and Martinez regressions effectively tied an arm behind Scotts back as a play caller as well. The only good thing that came out of this was the 2019 screen pass post on Rivals about a week ago. After Frost ran 44 times for 98 yards against a bad South Alabama team to start the season, I assume he realized they would need to do other things against big ten teams and I think the number of screens were one of those other things.

While it was only Rutgers in our final game of 2020, with the three Freshman and a sophomore on the oline we put up significantly more yards against them than any other team they played and only OSU averaged more per play against them. I expect the left side with Top 100 Corcoran, Piper and Jurgens to continue to develop over Spring and Fall and to be flat out imposing in the run game in 2021 and more than competitive in pass protection with the right side holding there own or Big Ten average.

To provide perspective on improvement in the Oline room, the only 2019 player I think that would make the two deep in 2021 would be So James as backup to Corcoran. I would even take this a step further and say you could field a second team line from 2021 group with scholarship backups that would significantly outperform that 2019 line which is staggering to think about.


While concerning to some, WR/TE group has 9 high rated players and still has 3 blue chips even without Robinson. Martin, Brown, Flack, Allen, Volkolek along with transfer Touré should ensure this groups floor is competitive (slightly below Big Ten avg.). What I believe will separate this group from competitive to good is the likelihood of 1 or more of Betts, Manning and/or Fidone developing into a “Dude” over Spring and Fall camp. Only the o-line has as many Blue Chip recruits as our WR/TE group and I expect that to show up in 2021 as all but 3 of the 9 are returning players. We also caught a break with Manning on not losing a year of eligibility given that he wasn't physically/mentally ready to help which is one of reasons many schools typically avoid all but highest rated 2 year Jucos. With the extra year, Every one but Toure/Flack will be back in 2022 so this group could develop similarly to o-line moving forward and be something special relative to recent Nebraska standards.


I think of the concept of synergy or whole being greater than some of parts for my offensive expectations in 2021. It will start with an effective running game behind this o-line that Allen has assembled along with Martinez and a serviceable RB that I am sure exists within our 6 Scholorship backs. This will put Martinez and Frost in a high percentage of advantageous (run-pass) down and distances which is were he is most effective. There is simply too much talent at WR not to at least be as good as 2018. In that scenario 2018 Freshman Martinez threw for 18 TD and and 7 INT. I think the talent around him in 2021 will be significantly better than 2018 when you factor in O-line. I personally wouldn’t be a bit surprised if Martinez throws something like 22 TD with 8 interceptions and 600 plus rushing yards with the player around him and Frosts ability to better manage play calling with the running game he will be able to use in 2021.

This is an incredibly important year for Scott and for Husker football. Fairly quietly, a solid roster has been built that will return almost everyone in 2022 on offense including what could be a top 2-3 o-line in the big ten. If Frost comes out and demonstrate the offense that many people expected and goes 6-2 in West (likely minimum record to win West) he will be able to maintain or even accelerate what I believe has been West Division leading recruiting into the 2022 class. The 2022 team will also likely start the year ranked, with expectations and a lot of momentum.

IF he cannot win at least 7 games with the talent we have in 2021 I don’t see how he could win much more in 2022 with basically the same players returning. At that point, given the talent, I will probably have to agree with the crowd claiming he cannot coach and that we just playing string out for the next guy. Personally I don't think this will be the case and very excited for 2021.

A very good post sir. Thank you!! I too have a desperate hope of seeing a MASSIVE OLine improvement. I fully agree that should be our #1 priority and what we need so very, very badly. As you mentioned, decent center hikes would help a lot too.

Yep, again I agree next year we "really", really need some improvement and results. I'm also hoping the endless horizontal passes are highly reduced.

Special teams? God help us.
 

Clemke32

Redshirt Freshman
Sep 29, 2017
729
960
93
My god ... ?? 7 wins

reminder that Kirk Ferentz after being 1-10 and 3-9 in his first 2 years at lowly Iowa, went undefeated in the big ten - went to the orange bowl and finished the season ranked 8th in the nation in year 4

Yet people will be doing cartwheels for 7 wins at a UN
🙄 I don’t think I can roll my eyes any harder. Every time some one even mentions 6 or 7 wins we hear the some ol crap from the same crowd. You all seriously have to take a lesson in reading comprehension. I did not at any point see where he said he would be doing cart wheels, not have I seen people say that we’d be content with perennial 6 or 7 win teams.

the reasonable expectation with any team that has been as crappy as we have been, would be to progressively get better, would I be happy with a 7 win season next year, 🤷🏻‍♂️ Meh not really happy but I’d sure as hell take it compared to what we’ve had! The bar is not changed it is not lower, we all expect to win championships (eventually) we want to be there again. The difference is most of us realize that you have to progress there, it’s not going to happen overnight...let’s go from having 4 crap seasons to a 7 win season, alright, let’s add to that the next year to 8 or 9 wins... right now NO I hate to break it to anyone in here we are not the Huskers of the 90s we have flat out sucked. We now have to build this thing back, and yes that means slowly, and no that don’t mean we are ok with the Iowa way, constantly having 9 wins a year with no signs of winning a championship here won’t cut it, if you don’t believe me go ask Bo.
 

poundth3rock

Sophomore
Jul 20, 2007
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^^ This. We have a JV Offensive staff trying to learn on the job. Always trying so hard to dazzle the world to get a mere yard when running it up the gut would suffice. smh

So Frost coordinated multiple top 10 offenses at Oregon, lead the nation at UCF where he was coach of the year and then overnight become so inept he couldn't move the ball against South Alabama in 2019. Those offenses would have hung 600 on South Alabama but the he become bumbling fool against team like South Alabama and the guantlet that is the Big Ten west.

Yep, that is probably what happened. Or there was massive drop in talent form those two teams that he is doing his best to rectify.

Frost and this staff have their Wartz, but they aren't bumbling fools or JV coaches as you put it
 

poundth3rock

Sophomore
Jul 20, 2007
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A very good post sir. Thank you!! I too have a desperate hope of seeing a MASSIVE OLine improvement. I fully agree that should be our #1 priority and what we need so very, very badly. As you mentioned, decent center hikes would help a lot too.

Yep, again I agree next year we "really", really need some improvement and results. I'm also hoping the endless horizontal passes are highly reduced.

Special teams? God help us.

Punt/Kick returns and coverage were a real problem against all the well coached teams of the West. Probably multiple games with 100 yards of hidden lost yardage.
 

schuele

Athletic Director
Apr 17, 2005
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I hope the OP is correct about vastly improved offensive line play. Seems like that's the refrain every offseason, but come September Jaimes was the only one you could even call average, and some guys had a penchant for taking plays off. Hopefully the young players coming up will change all that.
 

poundth3rock

Sophomore
Jul 20, 2007
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Yep all of our players sucked over the last 6 years. If that makes you feel better than the coaches sucked, I don't see a difference.

You can say suck, i wouldnt.

The talent was absolutely below big ten average as a whole as a result of the two coaching transitions and really high miss rates from previous two staffs over that times as shown. This opinion is backed up by rivals ratings, the drafts and lack of any conference player recognition.

The offensive line needed a converted TE and Walkon to get to 8 scholorships in 2019 and was absolutely Big Ten poor. That is not debateable and that cannot be coached around.

Frost absolutely did not maximize that talent he had and you could easily make the same argument that relative to Ferentz, Fitz, Chryst and Fleck he coached below big ten average in that time frame. Those guys are also in much more stable situations where they have had continuity and success at those schools for some time. Even Fleck was in a much better spot taking over a 10 win team from Kill the year before frost .

The situation was simply way worse than dudes like you will acknowledge and I would argue that most agree with this and also respect that fact that Scott was a coordinator of top ten offenses, national coach of the year for a UCF team that lead the nation in total offense and won a national championship. He will get every opportunity ot succeed

Honestly, the real point I was trying to emphasize was talent for 2021 will be well above Big Ten average which is good enough to compete for and win the West. With the experience he has gained and the players he should be held accountable to that.
 

TruHusker

Offensive Coordinator
Sep 21, 2001
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This assumes B1G talent level + B1G coaching level.

You have pointed out Frost's resume a couple of times but also use the B1G as a reference to the ability of our athletes so a more fair comparison would be how he performs in this league. PAC 12 and the American are not the B1G. Not saying he won't but making one comparision and applying to a different league may not be applicable.
 

poundth3rock

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Jul 20, 2007
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you can have all the talent in the world on signing day. Doesnt mean a damn thing if they all keep leaving

As posted, he currently has 44 5.7 rated or above players on the roster for spring ball and 11 that are 5.9 or better compared to basically 12-2 from the previous four years. This factors in attrition which at roughly 35% to date for that group is actually more than doing fine. He has had some high profile departures but the remaining roster is actually very talented on paper relative to West for 2021

I think it was Tom Osbourne that said if you hit on 50% of your recruits you are doing pretty well.
 

NebChicago

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Oct 14, 2009
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As posted, he currently has 44 5.7 rated or above players on the roster for spring ball and 11 that are 5.9 or better compared to basically 12-2 from the previous four years. This factors in attrition which at roughly 35% to date for that group is actually more than doing fine. He has had some high profile departures but the remaining roster is actually very talented on paper relative to West for 2021

I think it was Tom Osbourne that said if you hit on 50% of your recruits you are doing pretty well.
Are there places where you can find comparative data about program attrition? It would be interesting to see if our rate is normal? It always feels like we are losing more than others
 
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poundth3rock

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This assumes B1G talent level + B1G coaching level.

You have pointed out Frost's resume a couple of times but also use the B1G as a reference to the ability of our athletes so a more fair comparison would be how he performs in this league. PAC 12 and the American are not the B1G. Not saying he won't but making one comparision and applying to a different league may not be applicable.

Spot on with this critic

However, I cross referenced this against same issues he had with teams like South Alabama and Northern Illinois. I think it is fair to say his Oregon and last UCF team would have ran circles around those team yet his 2019 Nebraska teams had the same struggles against those bad teams as has had against most of the big ten teams.

Anyone who watched that South Alabama game and knew the numbers issues for scholarships lineman along with Jurgens size and offseason injury should have immediately know what 44 carries for 98 yards was going to mean in conference play. I was still drinking enough Kool-Aid to think Martinez might be good enough to carry to the team to 7 wins. Obvoiusly, we know how that worked out.

I don't think the offensive problems are a Big Ten issue like some of snobby conference bretheren would lead us to believe nor do I think he became a crappy coordinator overnight. The evidence to me points to massive drop in talent compared to what he had at Oregon and UCF his final year.
 
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FargoNDHusker

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Dec 22, 2020
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For a while I do think talent was big issue for the teams struggles but agree it has improved quite a bit recently. There is talent on this roster, the defense should be where this teams leans and I believe they will improve on pretty good season, the o-line should be a strength, there is talent in the wr room, I would like to think there is talent at rb that we just haven't seen yet. The problem I feel is that this team has looked best and most competent when it's game plan is heavy run based attack but the coaches rarely seem to lean on our running game. The way the roster is currently constructed I don't it matters who we have a wr because I don't think we have a quarterback capable of utilizing receiving weapons. Neither qb can hit necessary throws and they both turn it over at alarmingly high rates. The talent is improving and getting more guys to early enroll certainly helps, but until the turnovers, penalties and qb play improve I'm not sure this team is capable of even .500.
 

poundth3rock

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Are there places where you can find comparative data about program attrition? It would be interesting to see if our rate is normal? It always feels like we are losing more than others

As you can imagine, getting the recruited plus attrition numbers for even 1 school is a lot of work even if you know the schools players fairly as well.

I will try to post a summary of number of what i refer to as high level prospects compared to the West and I can already tell we will much larger numbers of these players recruited and thus available regardless of attrition with our recent attrition being reasonable. That being said, I think it is fair to say that Iowa, Northwestern and Wisconson have had incredible continuity over last 15 years and outperform rankings. They are good at what they do, know what they are looking for in players, develop guys, there developed teams are very physical and they win close games with coaching.

These are not great teams but they are hard to beat. I would argue Scott will have more game ready talent than all three of these teams as we move to 2021. Can Frost coach well enough to beat these guys on game day. The talent will make the task easier, but you cannot have the special team issues, pre snap penalties, snapping issues and turnovers and beat these teams with any consistency even with superior talent.
 

Cornicator

Nebraska Legend
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Talent at RB and WR is still an issue.

Frost has dramatically improved talent at QB, TE, OL, DL, LB x1000, and in the secondary.


But the RB room is still stagnant. I think Stepp is a stepp up (pun intended) from Mills, but he must stay healthy. And we haven't seen Morrison yet due to injury.

The WR room has just been devastated by the 17, 18, and 19 recruiting classes. The 17 class was maybe an all time blunder. The 18 class was a transition class and always a crap shoot. But the 19 class was an absolute mess for Walters and Frost. I do believe Lubick is a much better Power 5 recruiter at the WR position.


This offense, and the QB is so dependent on the skill talent. Frost has not lived up to his end of the bargain there. 2021 is all about finding legit viable options at WR and TE. Without it, Nebraska will have very little reason for optimism in 2022.