Would Frost survive four losing seasons?

Discussion in 'Husker Board' started by bigboxes, May 23, 2020.

  1. Tuco Salamanca

    Tuco Salamanca Offensive Coordinator
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    So Frost needs to go 6-4-1 or better in 2020 to maintain the Mack Brown at UNC pace. If that happens, the rest of this thread is irrelevant because he won't have 3 losing seasons, let alone 4.
     
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  2. hedonistimpulse

    hedonistimpulse Walk On
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    Frost's already won more games at Nebraska than Brown did through three years at UNC, so for him to "maintain Brown's pace" he'd have to take away a win, lose nine games, and find a tie for an 8-24-1 record. I don't think the odds are in his favor.

    And any notion that a coach with 5-years and $25MM owed is getting fired is irrelevant. Anyone's declaration that he needs to win x-amount of games in 2020 and 2021 is just a ridiculously uniformed statement.
     
    42 hedonistimpulse, May 23, 2020
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
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  3. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    Hopefully so. I'm hoping for better.
     
  4. hedonistimpulse

    hedonistimpulse Walk On
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    Or a bunch of people who can't manage a lemonade stand and think booster money comes in orange, beige, yellow, white, and pink colors from a box with an old guy with a top hat on it will say, "Enough!" and demand change regardless of everything that history and the modern economic situation tells us, right?
     
    44 hedonistimpulse, May 23, 2020
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
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  5. hedonistimpulse

    hedonistimpulse Walk On
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    Surviving the fourth season is rare, but it happens...at Nebraska, too. Bill Jennings was fired after five straight losing seasons preceding the hiring of Bob Devaney.

    Lovie Smith is going into his 5th season at Illinois despite having a losing season in the previous four years.

    Derek Mason is currently entering his seventh season at Vanderbilt following six consecutive losing seasons. Vanderbilt has three other coaches who had at least five straight as well.

    John Jardine had four straight at Wisconsin before going 7-4 in year five.

    Bob Cummings at Iowa had five consecutive losing seasons.

    Jim Wacker had five straight at Minnesota.

    Greg Schiano at Rutgers (the first time they hired him) had four straight before going 7-5 in year four. Terry Shea also had five seasons at Rutgers with a losing record.

    Northwestern's got four coaches who reached at least a fifth season after having a losing record in their first four years, including Dennis Green....yes, that Dennis Green.

    Kevin Wilson, Cam Cameron, Lee Corso, and Bernie Crimmins each had at least five straight at Indiana.

    Jim Colletto had five straight at Purdue.

    Dan McCarney had five consecutive losing seasons at Iowa State before going 9-3 in year six.

    Marvin Bass had four straight at South Carolina before going .500 in his fifth year.

    Phil Cutchin at Oklahoma State had six straight.

    Jack Curtice at Stanford had four straight and then broke even in year five.

    It's not a distinguished list and there are likely more names on it, but it's happened...unlike the amount of money it would take to buyout Frost and Co. in two years being used in a buyout. If that were to happen it would be a list with only one name on it.

    It's actually a long list, Chuck. It consists of coaches doing the thing you didn't know of at 9 of the 14 current B1G institutions. Educate yourself and then consider your thought next time. Don't make me list 24 coaches that you've never heard of - one that coached at our school, three who are active, two such cases involving a coach currently in our conference, and one that even coaches in our division - just to prove a point. I don't know you, but you're better than that. You have to be.
     
    45 hedonistimpulse, May 24, 2020
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
  6. Chuck003

    Chuck003 Redshirt Freshman
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    I might be missing something, but this is Nebraska right?
     
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  7. Chuck003

    Chuck003 Redshirt Freshman
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    Look at the company. That is what our expectations and comparisons are? That is really sad,and why the program is in the current state that it is.
     
  8. hedonistimpulse

    hedonistimpulse Walk On
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    You mean the Nebraska that lost to teams on the list like Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota, Purdue, and Indiana last year and has lost to Northwestern and Illinois in the last few years? The Nebraska that also has a coach on the list? The Nebraska that hasn't won anything of significance since 1999? The Nebraska that's had a losing season four out of the last five years? The Nebraska that just released a statement saying they're tightening the purse strings and need to be financially conservative?

    Yeah, Chuck, that Nebraska. I feel like a troll trying to talk logically with some of you, but I'm unapologetic about it.

    Nebraska will be back. Proud, proud alumnus myself, but our school just doesn't have the discretionary income to consider the additional massive loss associated with a coaching change in the next few years and, even without that, Covid-19's impact will likely minimize the budget for several years giving Frost a great deal of job security (deserved or not).

    I should be more considerate to the alternative, however, which you have the courage to speak of and I don't, but I just can't get there. If it happens, I really don't know how I'll handle that. I still believe everything will work out and we'll all be celebrating together somewhere when this thing starts humming. I fully expect Frost to be mentioned in unison with Devaney and Osborne when we solemnly accept his retirement announcement in a couple of decades. GBR!
     
    48 hedonistimpulse, May 24, 2020
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
  9. HuskersWay

    HuskersWay Newbie
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    Agreed - for a lot of these schools, it's not surprising that they would roll with multiple losing seasons in a row:

    Vanderbilt/Northwestern/Stanford - very highly regarded private universities with very high admissions standards

    Indiana - a basketball school where the football program was definitely second fiddle (just like KU, Duke, North Carolina, Kentucky, etc)

    Purdue - a program that had only two winning seasons out of the previous 18 when Joe Tiller was hired as HC in 1997
     
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  10. hedonistimpulse

    hedonistimpulse Walk On
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    You should really lump Iowa in with one of those teams. Probably Indiana, I guess, them or whichever school we all agree is the weakest academically.

    Good call on excluding old-school Nebraska, Wisconsin, and Minnesota, though.
     
    50 hedonistimpulse, May 24, 2020
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
  11. ShaggynScooby

    ShaggynScooby Newbie
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    Because Frost has the 5th toughest schedule in the NCAA, he will get a pass this season, but there is no reason not to win at least 6 or 7 games. I've said this before, but Frost needs to field a top 30 defense if he wants to win in the BiG, especially since there are four teams just in the west alone that play top 30 defense.
     
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  12. huskerssalts

    huskerssalts Recruiting Coordinator
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    well, it’s actually not funny. Walters moved on and we brought in Matt Lubick and we also hired a special teams guy from the Auburn Tigers. The last time Lubick and Frost ran an offense together at Oregon, they put up Top 10 offenses in back to back seasons. With Matt Lubick on the staff with Frost, we should see a good jump on the offensive side of the ball. So we actually did focus on fixing the offensive and special teams issues.

    The only issue we haven’t touched yet is the defensive side of the ball (Well we did bring back Dawson which is huge because our OLBs need the help). And my guess, we haven’t yet because Chin did improve our defense over the last 2 years.
     
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  13. huskerssalts

    huskerssalts Recruiting Coordinator
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    agree and disagree, we need to keep improving our defense, that I agree with. But it doesn’t only take defense to win the West. We could do it with a Top 10-20 offense too.

    And I definitely agree about our schedule strength. The overall wins/loses won’t be the main indicator here. It will be the overall progress being made. When you have a young, rebuilding team like we have and you play anywhere from 5-6 Top 25 teams during one season, you cant only go off of number of wins and loses.
     
    53 huskerssalts, May 24, 2020
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
  14. bshirt73

    bshirt73 Senior
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    Well, that sounds about right to me. An improved OLine would surely help a lot is my guess. Special teams....I'm clueless.
     
  15. husker2612

    husker2612 Graduate Assistant
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    Man, I said at the beginning he needs 5 no matter what. However, when I said that and didn't think we could potentially be looking at 4 or 5 losing seasons in that time. I was thinking maybe 6 7 win seasons at worse. So yes 3 losing season he is safe. Although I think he needs to get at min 7 wins this year to take the heat off. If under that his seat will be red hot and there is no way he would survive a 4th losing season. Nor should he. I love Frost and I want him to succeed more than anything. However I love my huskers more and if he can't at the very least have 1 winning season in 4 years he is not the guy for this. There is zero excuses for any top level coach to not get 1 winning season in 4 years. At that points I question if anyone could right this ship it might be time to just accept it is what it is and the Nebraska football program we know and love is gone.
     
  16. husker2612

    husker2612 Graduate Assistant
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    Frost is safe even after 3 losing season. I would have to think Chin would be the next on the chopping block of coaching changes after 3 losing seasons.
     
  17. skull N crossbones

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    I truly believe that Frost thinks he getting 5 years no matter what so he did things differently than other coaches. We seem to be awfully young with a lot of redshirts.
     
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  18. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    I agree that it has to be done with the redshirts. We will appreciate it when our depth has returned and proper training is given.
     
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  19. Jhollenbeck41

    Jhollenbeck41 Sophomore
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    They'll replacement all assistants before letting Frost go. He's who they want as the face of the program because he is "Nebraska Football". Odds are he's already been guaranteed 5-7 years at minimum by Moos because of what they both believe in. Sure seems like Moos wants to stay on Osborne's good side too which will require giving Frost his full contract at minimum because of what Frost and Osborne both believe in....continuity. Redshirting basically every everyone significant freshman last year should have been the clue that everyone needed. Too many people on here choose not to use their opinions and what if scenarios instead of using logic. So that's what I bring to the table, logic.
     
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  20. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    So... I'm going to put you down for 7 losing seasons.That is well outside the norm. [​IMG]
     
  21. Red I 73

    Red I 73 Senior
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    "Frost as the face of the program" that's what I was told before he was hired by a large donor. He said "he gets five years and if he can't bring us back to where we were in that time no one can. We have to have someone who knows Nebraska leading the program."
     
  22. cidsports

    cidsports Redshirt Freshman
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    A lot of awful situations illustrated. The 9-3 season by Dan McCarney was a good year. His college coach wasn't a good hire.

    Some poor coaches and down programs illustrated.
     
  23. Tuco Salamanca

    Tuco Salamanca Offensive Coordinator
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    Oh where to begin. So if total wins is the barometer, Frost needs to win 10 games just to keep pace with Mike Riley.

    Riley 19-19
    Scott Frost 9-15

    So there is that to start.

    Brown went 1-10, 1-10 then then won 6 games in his 3rd year. So Mack Brown can turn a P5 program from 1-10 to 6-4-1 in 3 years but expecting Scott Frost to have a winning season in his 3rd year is asking too much? Brown can have a 5 game improvement from year two to year three but expecting frost to have a 1 game improvement is somehow absurd?

    OK>......
     
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  24. Jhollenbeck41

    Jhollenbeck41 Sophomore
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    Exactly. 5 is a little quick in my opinion but I get it. I don't have a time frame in mind for "back to where we were". I did 2 years ago but we're behind schedule. Still think he'll get it done though. Realistically as long as he shows progress starting in 2020, he'll get another year added to his contract and it'll be made official whenever they feel like it. Get us to the Rose Bowl and he'll get a Dabo like extension.
     
  25. Jhollenbeck41

    Jhollenbeck41 Sophomore
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    Don't care for norms, I tend to rebel a little bit. Just to let you know exactly where I stand, I'd rather win and/or lose with Scott Frost than anyone else. He's Tom Osborne in my eyes. Agree or disagree, is what it is.
     
  26. Charlie Marlow

    Charlie Marlow Assistant Head Coach
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    Haven't you ever heard the expression 'it's not what you say, but how you say it?' If we have four straight losing seasons, he would be on the hot seat for sure. But how those losses look, the perceived momentum, etc etc would also impact the final decision.
     
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  27. schuele

    schuele Athletic Director
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    Who's arguing otherwise? Hell if Frost can get NU to the Rose Bowl, he'd not only get a huge extension, a Scott Frost statue would replace The Sower atop the state capitol and boosters of substance would pave Highway 30 from Wood River to Grand Island in solid gold and rename it the Scott Frost Expressway.

    But this thread isn't asking what will happen if Frost takes the Huskers to the Rose Bowl. It's asking what will happen if, in the next two years, he can't get them to the Redbox or Pinstripe Bowls.
     
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  28. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    Thank you.
     
  29. Sodakred

    Sodakred Redshirt Freshman
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    The schedules for the next two years are about as tough as we have ever faced. On that basis alone I don’t see us having more than a .500 record. I also can’t imagine Frost getting fired. We wanted the local hero and we got him, for better or worse.
     
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  30. Jhollenbeck41

    Jhollenbeck41 Sophomore
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    Then his seat will start to get warm, sure. That’s basically saying we get 0% better over the next 2 years. That’s ridiculous
     
  31. HuskerHackFraud

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    If Frost losses to Purdue (first year Bob Diaco defense, going from a 4-3 to 3-4) he should be fired on the field
     
  32. red scowl

    red scowl Senior
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    I think he should. Think of all the things wrong with the program. He only controls a few. Let him learn.
     
  33. phoenix4nu

    phoenix4nu First Team All-Big Ten
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    Why don't you do us all a favor and go back to your own team's board, whichever team that is.
     
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  34. Smokinthereiff

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    Isn’t there already a SF day/comic book? I say do the statue and road now show the same faith as the day/comic release.
     
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  35. HuskerHackFraud

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    Nebraska is my team. That's why I would be pissed. There is absolutely no reason Nebraska should lose to Purdue. Just because I'm not all in on Frost doesn't mean I'm not a Nebraska fan.
     
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  36. scarletred

    scarletred Nebraska Legend
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    Your screen name pretty much tells me other wise, not that your not backing Frost..
     
  37. Red I 73

    Red I 73 Senior
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    "Let him learn." I would have loved my boss pay me $5 million and then say just go out there and learn on the job.
     
  38. HuskersWay

    HuskersWay Newbie
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    Well, Tom Osborne has made clear that he never had any illusions in the 1970s that he had a lifetime contract and that NU would be happy with whatever results he produced. I saw Tom Osborne speak at a dinner and he told a story about talking to someone in power (who went unnamed) about the upcoming 1976 Bluebonnet Bowl and he was told "It would be good if you won that" - Osborne got a warning shot like that when NU had a relatively disappointing season (they started the season ranked #1, but then went 8-3-1 in the regular season ending it ranked #13)
     
  39. PeliniTheCrutch

    PeliniTheCrutch First Team All-Big Ten
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    I would disagree that he only controls a few of all the things wrong with the program, but I am interested to hear what I could be missing.
     
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  40. HuskerHackFraud

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    I'm a husker fan and a redlettermedia fan. Born and raised in Nebraska
     

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