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Vaccine Progress

IF I read that article correctly, many of the delays were due to regulatory issues. IF that is true, many of those regulatory issues were waived with Operation Warp Speed.
The FDA is a regulatory jungle. People wonder why prescription meds cost so much. Some part of it is the bureaucratic web and testing that a company has to navigate to bring a new treatment to market. I posted on here multiple times months ago that IF this truly were such a dire situation that we needed to shut the country down, that we could produce and deliver a vaccine within a couple of months. This is STILL slower than we should be doing it. The trial vaccines should be going in to nursing home patients and first responders in large numbers by now. In my town, we've had large numbers of cops infected. One woman who knew she was positive lied to the cops when she was arrested on a drug charge. She ended up infecting multiple cops. They haven't released the total infected but I heard that a fourth of the force was in quarantine at one point.
 
Let me go on the record by saying there are some deranged people here who think people would knowingly let hundreds of thousands die for profit. You’ve consumed too much conspiracy content/social media or read too many fiction books.

In order to pull this off, this isn’t a one or even 20 person scheme. This would require hundreds of people knowing about this and not one leak. Improbable at best.
Well China does supply masks, testing reagents and PPE for most of the world and they did in fact mislead the world for it sounds now like months.......so there is that.
 
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edibles, mushrooms and LSD are more my speed
 
I'm glad that a large number of people will refuse the vaccine. That's means it will be easier for the rest of us to go to the front of the line. I suspect though that they will change their mind once it becomes clear you will have to prove you've been vaccinated to go to concerts, sporting events, bars, restaurants, movie theaters, etc. I think you're going to be prevented from doing a lot of things unless you can prove you had a vaccination once vaccination is available.

For example, I doubt you'll be allowed in Memorial Stadium for a Husker game unless you can prove you've been vaccinated.

I predict it's going to be like children being unable to go to school unless they have had certain vaccinations. You can choose to forego vaccination but that choice will keep you out of a lot of activities probably including your job.
Maybe not on the student vaccination deal. I can see all teachers being required to but this will end up like seasonal flu vaccine IMO. There's a vaccine. You've been told the risks. IF you don't get vaccinated and you get sick, too bad for you.
 
I'm glad that a large number of people will refuse the vaccine. That's means it will be easier for the rest of us to go to the front of the line. I suspect though that they will change their mind once it becomes clear you will have to prove you've been vaccinated to go to concerts, sporting events, bars, restaurants, movie theaters, etc. I think you're going to be prevented from doing a lot of things unless you can prove you had a vaccination once vaccination is available.

For example, I doubt you'll be allowed in Memorial Stadium for a Husker game unless you can prove you've been vaccinated.

I predict it's going to be like children being unable to go to school unless they have had certain vaccinations. You can choose to forego vaccination but that choice will keep you out of a lot of activities probably including your job.

The medical passport idea was already floated and the answer was very negative.
 
Let me go on the record by saying there are some deranged people here who think people would knowingly let hundreds of thousands die for profit. You’ve consumed too much conspiracy content/social media or read too many fiction books.

In order to pull this off, this isn’t a one or even 20 person scheme. This would require hundreds of people knowing about this and not one leak. Improbable at best.

Right, I mean it's not like they'd send sick people into nursing homes - only the most susceptible population to this virus. They'd never do that. And if they did the media would totally call them on it.
 
The medical passport idea was already floated and the answer was very negative.
Of course, that's exactly what you'd expect from the general public BUT it won't be up to public opinion in my view. It's the reality of legal liability and government bureaucrats which will mandate what you must do. Do you think the general public agrees with school vaccination rules?
 
Of course, that's exactly what you'd expect from the general public BUT it won't be up to public opinion in my view. It's the reality of legal liability and government bureaucrats which will mandate what you must do. Do you think the general public agrees with school vaccination rules?

Where does this made up legal liability originate?

Is there a legal liability to a virus less deadly than the flu to population under 65?

Going forward as the world builds immunity and the death rate decreases even further does the imaginary legal liability disappear?
 
Where does this made up legal liability originate?

Is there a legal liability to a virus less deadly than the flu to population under 65?

Going forward as the world builds immunity and the death rate decreases even further does the imaginary legal liability disappear?
Well we'll see. Maybe you'll be right but I certainly wouldn't bet my money on that. There are thousands of ambulance chasing lawyers just waiting to do their thing. It doesn't take massive amounts of deaths to cause bad liability lawsuits. And there's already been plenty of concern by businesses wanting immunity from coronavirus liability (strongly being resisted by some politicians in Congress). Right now it's viewed as an "act of God" which nobody can do much about but that will change if there is a preventative vaccine.
 
Let me go on the record by saying there are some deranged people here who think people would knowingly let hundreds of thousands die for profit. You’ve consumed too much conspiracy content/social media or read too many fiction books.

In order to pull this off, this isn’t a one or even 20 person scheme. This would require hundreds of people knowing about this and not one leak. Improbable at best.

Why does it have to be a conspiracy? Do you know what they put in these vaccines? Why am I going to inject all that bullcrap into my body for a virus that kills 0.03% of the population? Why jeopardize my health doubly by testing out their god fantasies? No thanks.
 
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Well we'll see. Maybe you'll be right but I certainly wouldn't bet my money on that. There are thousands of ambulance chasing lawyers just waiting to do their thing. It doesn't take massive amounts of deaths to cause bad liability lawsuits. And there's already been plenty of concern by businesses wanting immunity from coronavirus liability (strongly being resisted by some politicians in Congress). Right now it's viewed as an "act of God" which nobody can do much about but that will change if there is a preventative vaccine.

So how are Jeff Bezos and Elon Musk getting away with packing people into their warehouses and factories with no repercussions?
 
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Why does it have to be a conspiracy? Do you know what they put in these vaccines? Why am I going to inject all that bullcrap into my body for a virus that kills 0.03% of the population? Why jeopardize my health doubly by testing out their god fantasies? No thanks.
Thank you for pushing me to the front of the line. I'm really counting on the no vaccine people to resist which will allow me to get it early because I'm sure the first doses will have limited availability. :Cool:
 
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So how are Jeff Bezos and Elon Musk getting away with packing people into their warehouses and factories with no repercussions?
The point is there is no vaccine right now so they can't require workers to be vaccinated. Once an effective vaccine becomes available that situation changes. Already there are lawsuits because organizations didn't require face masks. I predict this will be the same thing but it can only happen AFTER a vaccine is readily available.

But as I said we'll see. That's my prediction. You're welcome to predict a different scenario.
 
Here's the scenario I predict: you pump all that crap into your body without a clue what it is. Over the course of a few years, all sorts of strange things begin happening to your body. Cancer, other debilitating issues that require extensive medical care start to pop up. The doctors give you all sorts of reasonable explanations that you have heard before. You pay out the ass to try to stop it and then die.

Remember all those side effects they are required to list during medication commercials? I'm sure the rushed vaccine is just a gift from God with no repercussions. I hope your prediction is right.
 
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Where does this made up legal liability originate?

Is there a legal liability to a virus less deadly than the flu to population under 65?

Going forward as the world builds immunity and the death rate decreases even further does the imaginary legal liability disappear?

The true Patriots want to make it the center piece of a fourth covid legislation on the Hill so there's that. But then again Trump's been sued alot so maybe he's just unnecessarily gun-shy in this case.
 
Probably good news for the glimmer of hope that is college football. No vaccines for me. Not a conspiracy/politically influenced choice. Never had a flu shot, never had the flu.

I'm not sure where football stands in the pecking order. They already have been mentioning that with a still limited testing capacity it's probably not a great moral idea to test football players twice a week for a whole season when legitimate sick folks have a hard time getting them.

If this vaccine clears early enough in the year we got some time if the season were to say start in March to get past the 100 million old people who are probably first in line.
 
Well we'll see. Maybe you'll be right but I certainly wouldn't bet my money on that. There are thousands of ambulance chasing lawyers just waiting to do their thing. It doesn't take massive amounts of deaths to cause bad liability lawsuits. And there's already been plenty of concern by businesses wanting immunity from coronavirus liability (strongly being resisted by some politicians in Congress). Right now it's viewed as an "act of God" which nobody can do much about but that will change if there is a preventative vaccine.

Where are you getting this information that it will change from being an act of God once there is a preventative vaccine?

Does the flu have a different status since there is a vaccine?

Have you ever heard of the phrase "assumed risk" ?
 
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The point is there is no vaccine right now so they can't require workers to be vaccinated. Once an effective vaccine becomes available that situation changes. Already there are lawsuits because organizations didn't require face masks. I predict this will be the same thing but it can only happen AFTER a vaccine is readily available.

But as I said we'll see. That's my prediction. You're welcome to predict a different scenario.

I'm sure you have a links to these facemask lawsuits right?
 
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As much as I want to believe this is a "moonshot" type of deal, I just cant get past the idea of this being a profit play by big pharma and the government. The whole thing just seems like a fictional narrative to me, where there is an unknown villain from beyond this dimension and a hero that comes in to save us all. It's just way too prepackaged to be real.

Research Bill Gates foundation. This is to go hand in hand with a micro chip
 
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Here's the scenario I predict: you pump all that crap into your body without a clue what it is. Over the course of a few years, all sorts of strange things begin happening to your body. Cancer, other debilitating issues that require extensive medical care start to pop up. The doctors give you all sorts of reasonable explanations that you have heard before. You pay out the ass to try to stop it and then die.

Remember all those side effects they are required to list during medication commercials? I'm sure the rushed vaccine is just a gift from God with no repercussions. I hope your prediction is right.
The "crap" crammed in to this vaccine will only be the same "crap" crammed in to the seasonal flu vaccine. The only difference will be the protein subunit antigens. This will be safe. I've taken the high dose influenza vaccine now for years with no ill effects. This will be no different. IF I had taken flu vaccines earlier in my life I maybe wouldn't be dealing with chronic asthma caused largely by a nasty bout of pneumonia caused by influenza 20 years ago.
 
Research Bill Gates foundation. This is to go hand in hand with a micro chip
Now that's just a little too far out there. The stuff about birth control in vaccines in developing countries I can almost believe. The problem for the public has become that there is so much dishonesty in reporting that you can't tell what is truth and what is fiction. I'm not sure why they would need to insert a chip in your body to control anything. They already largely control information via the media or the internet. They know what your preferences are (or think) by your smart phone or computer. They know where you go by your phone's GPS. In many cases via the huge DNA database being built, they know your genetic makeup. Big Brother is watching.
 
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This is good news.
The other good news breaking tonight is florida is discovering that their positive tests are faulty. Thanks to some reporters doing their homework and can do math, they discovered inconsistencies.

They discovered several hospitals and labs were not reporting negative results, only positive. Not surprisingly it went from 98% positive to 9.6%. Similar results elsewhere. I wonder why?? Guidelines say ALL results must be reported.

Pay attention
El Gato Malo illustrated this fact several days ago. I believe it was a list showing a number of hospitals reportibg 100% positives.
 
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I'm glad that a large number of people will refuse the vaccine. That's means it will be easier for the rest of us to go to the front of the line. I suspect though that they will change their mind once it becomes clear you will have to prove you've been vaccinated to go to concerts, sporting events, bars, restaurants, movie theaters, etc. I think you're going to be prevented from doing a lot of things unless you can prove you had a vaccination once vaccination is available.

For example, I doubt you'll be allowed in Memorial Stadium for a Husker game unless you can prove you've been vaccinated.

I predict it's going to be like children being unable to go to school unless they have had certain vaccinations. You can choose to forego vaccination but that choice will keep you out of a lot of activities probably including your job.

I continue to be amazed and saddened that there are so many people who are willing to take away a person's right to fully participate in society unless they have something injected into their body or the bodies of their children. Especially for a virus that has a fatality rate that is similar to the flu.

Freedom isn't taken all at once. It's taken a little bit at a time until it is gone. If one doesn't have the freedom even to determine what is injected into his own body, what freedom does he really have? And don't tell me he doesn't have to get the vaccine, but if he doesn't, he can't do all the things you mention in this post. That's essentially taking away his choice because it's completely coercive.
 
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I continue to be amazed and saddened that there are so many people who are willing to take away a person's right to fully participate in society unless they have something injected into their body or the bodies of their children. Especially for a virus that has a fatality rate that is similar to the flu.

Freedom isn't taken all at once. It's taken a little bit at a time until it is gone. If one doesn't have the freedom even to determine what is injected into his own body, what freedom does he really have? And don't tell me he doesn't have to get the vaccine, but if he doesn't, he can't do all the things you mention in this post. That's essentially taking away his choice because it's completely coercive.

what if insurance companies decide that no vaccination = big upcharge in your insurance premiums - similar to smoking
I believe some employers can mandate vaccination

people might be free not to get vaccinated - but freedom isn't necessarily free
 
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what if insurance companies decide that no vaccination = big upcharge in your insurance premiums - similar to smoking
I believe some employers can mandate vaccination

people might be free not to get vaccinated - but freedom isn't necessarily free

The government itself wouldn't be able to do much, but private businesses can do whatever they want in this regard.
 
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As much as I want to believe this is a "moonshot" type of deal, I just cant get past the idea of this being a profit play by big pharma and the government. The whole thing just seems like a fictional narrative to me, where there is an unknown villain from beyond this dimension and a hero that comes in to save us all. It's just way too prepackaged to be real.
if this first one even makes it to market it might still be years before all of society gets access to it. i know some of the top vaccine companies in the world are behind Moderna in terms of a timeline but they believe they will actually have the best vaccine if they come to fruition. some of these first ones may require multiple booster shots which will not be ideal. others in the back of line are working to make a 1 shot and done deal
 
Improbable? Whats improbable is the idea that we can develop a vaccine for a coronavirus in 6 months when there has never been one developed in history in spite of our attempts. If we are able to take on such a task in such a short period of time and have 6-20 companies all close to attaining that goal, why have we been dealing with the thousands of other viruses out there that kill or affect our quality of life? Why no HIV vaccine? No herpes vaccine? No hepatitis vaccine? They are incurable after decades but this one that destroyed the world's economy can be solved in 6 months? Sorry, that doesn't stand to reason.
this is why the Merck CEO maker of a lot of the childhood vaccines in the world came out and said the media and some of these early candidate companies are doing the american citizens a disservice by pumping optimistic headlines all the time. despite what the media says there are a lot of things that can still go wrong which means something probably will. thats why there are so many companies and candidates. i think the smart companies know there will be issues come along. its not going to be the first to market to win. its going to be the best to market. the best one might not be until early 2022
 
Regardless of your point of view, this is an interesting article on the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine candidate. Warning: It is a very long article and contains background on Sarah Gilbert, the name behind this vaccine development.

Article

As an aside, I found it fascinating that one possibility is that the people vaccinated with this vaccine could still get Covid 19 but not suffer any of the ill effects. They could however still infect others who have not been vaccinated who could then suffer the ill effects. It's only a possibility so definitely NOT a certainty at this point. Just never read about that possibility before. I'd guess it's kind of like the asymptomatic cases now.
 
this is why the Merck CEO maker of a lot of the childhood vaccines in the world came out and said the media and some of these early candidate companies are doing the american citizens a disservice by pumping optimistic headlines all the time. despite what the media says there are a lot of things that can still go wrong which means something probably will. thats why there are so many companies and candidates. i think the smart companies know there will be issues come along. its not going to be the first to market to win. its going to be the best to market. the best one might not be until early 2022

Yep! I think even if the best candidate developed were to make it to the public (I think the Oxford vaccine trials are looking to be the best?) it would be in 2021 sometime. Not only do they have to test a bunch, but then they have to manufacture hundreds of millions of these things.
 
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