So whats different this time
- Thread starter SnohomishRed
- Start date
Wasnt really the point of the story. If really good teams can get blown out so can we.
Agree it that its easier to save program face if you've won something in the process.
I edited my post. Pelini would still be here IF he continued his 9-10 wins EVEN with no championships of any kind.
But asking Bo to not be an ass is like asking Carl not to be a womanizer.
I think the other factor though in Pelini’s demise was the realization that his recruiting was slipping and we were facing some huge roster holes.
For sure. With his coaching pedigree and his Nebraska roots there's no question he'll be successful.
Well... I think there is a very high probability he will be successful.
Can the season start already? Damn I am pumped.
Don't get me wrong, I want a good year and feel like we're going to have one (although what most of us is expecting is a Pelini-esque type season, 9ish wins and a Div title).
But people are more or less impacted by "points of light" more than they are sort of long term measurements.
Like, for a lot of seasons on here I've noticed alot of fans wallowing in pity because blah blah coach is getting NU beaten pretty good, but maybe we put up afew scores in the second half or something. We proceed to go "what kid in their right mind would come here" etc.
And then like an hour after the games over, some recruit is on twitter pointing out something like, "NU QB had 250 2nd half yards and 3TD's and a bunch of younger guys got reps" or something and they end up committing some time later. So even though the season wasn't great, they pick out highlights that spoke to them whether it was a gameday experience or watching some sort of mini rally in garbage time or whatver.
Now don't get me wrong, having a Cinderella season would go a long way to putting together a Top 5 type of class, but I don't think Coach is necessarily pinning all his hopes on a Cindarella year jumpstarting his job. He more or less expects to build his program in the manner he knows and knows that at some point, regardless of W/L column, the engine he built will start and take off.
Its eminently clear from his STRATCOM talk that he's a culture over talent kind of guy although he knows he needs his fair share of good football players to have a shot. I just think his "fair share of good players" and our idea of that concept on a recruiting board, differ at certain junctions.
I don't remember being this excited for a season in a long time, last year included. The Riley era almost lost me.
In all likelihood his recruiting would have sabotaged his ability to keep winning 9 games.
I guess what I'm more or less getting at with HuskerO is that for as upset as some folks were with his demeanor and on the field losses, he was still doing good enough if he kept producing at that level.
I think Frost is going to do quite well, well enough to not lose his job for 20 years, so I think alot of that banter is moot, but who knows, there is a possibility the program just falls apart on him however unlikely I judge that.
NU just faces a tough decision if they want to say Frost's 9 wins aren't good enough. Through the last couple of coaching changes I pulled up a list of active coaches in NCAA FB and compared them against fan board wishes, proven winner, championship titles of some level on their resume, etc. And the short answer is, the small handful of those guys in existence coached at Clemson, OU, OSU, Bama, etc and the rest of us were taking some sort of risk on guys who had demonstrated some pieces of the package, but not the entire thing (Zatechka essentially made this same point several times).
I don't see the citizens of the state wanting to throw out Frost and his culture at 9 wins, to go find another guy who is more or less going to be unproven for us but we'd certainly be flushing the Old Nebraska down the toilet to find out if he was a game or two better.
Heard one of the ESPN gambling experts on the radio here in KC the other day - wish I remembered his name. He was talking about the over/under on the local teams (HARD under on KU 3.5, BTW). Mostly talked about KU, KSU, Mizzou. But - he did mention he really liked MSU in the B1G East, and doesn’t trust Michigan at all.
That was the run-up to this. They asked about Nebraska at 8.5. Strong Over. Then he said Frost will have NU at 10 wins from here on out. He also said, that while he doesn’t handicap the Heisman, he thinks Martinez is a likely winner as soon as this year. Frost knows how to maximize his QBs.
That was the run-up to this. They asked about Nebraska at 8.5. Strong Over. Then he said Frost will have NU at 10 wins from here on out. He also said, that while he doesn’t handicap the Heisman, he thinks Martinez is a likely winner as soon as this year. Frost knows how to maximize his QBs.
I'm talking specifically about the Summer Tour Bus they do every year. They go view each team's practice and give their impressions based on live observations. It's hard for anyone to go to 7 straight (well 14 straight, but I don't pay attn to the East) campuses and screw that up. The commentary between Purdue and UW was pretty different, and tonight is Minnesota followed by you guys, Iowa and the 2 Illinois schools.
Count me in this camp. You can have the same drills, same S & C emphasis, same everything but the guy pulling the trigger has to have an eye on the very smallest details. I have heard stories of TO recruiting guys that few people even knew existed. He saw something in them and exactly where they would fit. He was a master at planning and game day execution. It is said he would send in a play and already have the next play ready knowing how many yards he would have to gain before the plan even went off.
How many times have you heard players say that Tom would say something, they didn't always believe it until they kept seeing them come true, then they trusted his every word.
Does Frost have that extra little eye for the unobvious? I have no clue but we will see.
Some things I disagree with as well, while I am here. He needs very good athletes to run this offense. My goodness, look at who we have currently? Highly rated players everywhere. the D has to improve dramatically and I do not buy in to the fact his fast paced offense hampers his D. Get and coach better players. The margin between being a very good program and a great program is very small, but highly important.
I think especially for Frost he wants to restore the Blackshirt D, but I still believe it will lag the offense.
What is probably our most proudest moment as Husker fans? Warren Sapp bent over gasping for air after taking on his 50th bar fight that evening.
Elite athletes get wore out. Frost can recruit Warren Sapp, but if Adrian starts running this O like we think he can, our next Sapp is going to be on the field quite a bit. It will impact the defensive statistics. I don't think its coinicidence that anyone involved with the NU program harps on the whole disruptive and turnover thing when they mention defense, that's one area where NU will have to be better to make the defense work. More TO's is more time off the field, more points for the offense which is more margin for the defense.
There might be some years where the D is just lights out, but I think generally the case will be its carried by the offense.
Chryst is simply painful to listen to - he seems very unsure or wandering in his thoughts. WI is starting to feel the effects of bad decisions, Gary Anderson for one then Chryst hiring a DC with basically no coaching experience. I think what you are seeing is these decisions are starting to have a cumulative effect and then the Dam will break much as it did with our program
If Frost doesn't get over the 9 win threshold within 5 years, I think he will be looking for a way to get out. He is too damn competitive to put up with 4 losses every year. I think he is expecting at least 9 wins this year and 10 or more next year.
This is something that fascinated me about TO. I talked with him one night after he spoke to a church group. He liked to talk about various aspects of coaching if he had the time to delve into the details. That night we talked recruiting. He used Doug Dubose as an example of how they looked at HS players differently than most teams, and evaluated differently. Dubose was only being really recruited by 2 schools other than NU: Syracuse, and they were in a down period, and Connecticut. Both were recruiting him as a DB. Despite that, he was NU's #3 target at RB. When their first 2 targets committed elsewhere, they went after Dubose hard. Other schools suddenly started showing some interest, since NU was really chasing him, but he committed to NU. I got to talk to TO on other issues in some detail 2 other times and I really enjoyed hearing the thought processes (even if he had to dumb it down a bit!).
If you listened to Scott's STRATCOM video someone posted, I think he thinks the uniqueness thing is somewhat overblown. I know several people on here think NU is going to be a unique offensive system but it seems to be kind of a half truth kind of thing.
Like Scott pointed out in the talk, in 1990's it took teams forever to dissect what NU was doing and couldn't really replicate it on an easy timeline. At Oregon, their style of offense went from being unique to something like half the teams in CFB run some version of it really quickly. Or he pointed out he'd script up a neat play, and a week later, three other teams in the conference were pulling it out in a game situation.
I do think Scott will be innovative, and NU's offense is certainly a change up in the West division, but I'm not sure we're going to win a bunch because we're unique or that Scott even thinks we're that unique (again some half or better of CFB runs a spread). We're going to win a lot of football games because unless you have real elite athletes who work well in space, its hard to stop the spread (its how it was designed and built). And he's going to put you in situations where you are mismatched a gross amount of time.
Like Scott pointed out in the talk, in 1990's it took teams forever to dissect what NU was doing and couldn't really replicate it on an easy timeline. At Oregon, their style of offense went from being unique to something like half the teams in CFB run some version of it really quickly. Or he pointed out he'd script up a neat play, and a week later, three other teams in the conference were pulling it out in a game situation.
I do think Scott will be innovative, and NU's offense is certainly a change up in the West division, but I'm not sure we're going to win a bunch because we're unique or that Scott even thinks we're that unique (again some half or better of CFB runs a spread). We're going to win a lot of football games because unless you have real elite athletes who work well in space, its hard to stop the spread (its how it was designed and built). And he's going to put you in situations where you are mismatched a gross amount of time.
No one has addressed this when I bring it up so maybe you can. IF the O is producing at such a high clip them the opposing team is always playing catch up and this out of their comfort zone. That should force them to play from behind and do things they do not want to do. It actually should help the D, not hurt them. If our O scores in 3 minute drives and they score in 6 minute drives, nothing is gained. The D has to be good enough to get some stops! Ours was not last year. Get a couple stops combined with everyone's thoughts we will.score at will and you have a recipe for making the opposition one dimensional.
I also believe the opposing teams will catch up to the Frost and Day run O's that are very similar. Frost noted what kind of teams would beat the best Oregon had to offer.
I disagree, there were way to many behind the scene and getting blown out of top games still would have been bos undoing.
There are generally on the order of 0 teams that field a Two minute fast strike offense and a 3 and out level of defense. If one is good the other is on the field more. There are probably exceptions in certain years in certain dynasties, but as a general rule nobody puts a team on the field where the O and D are only exerting themselves for a couple of minutes at a time because they are so good. One unit or the other has to be on the field.
The other side of that "not doing what they want to do making it easier for the D", if you get too far ahead, the opponent will generally just waive a white flag and run out the clock to the best of their ability. And perhaps the team up 60 points will do the same. But then any stats are basically garbage time stats for the D and not indicative of a real opponents effort.
We should know, several of our coaches in the last 20 years have had to run the "just get this over with" clock offense.
Agreed, but like I said there have been at least 3 years that they rave about NU and we are terrible and the same for other schools. I’m not knocking Wisky just don’t give a shit have BTN has to say because they are horrible at evaluation. At least that ex Illinois lb isn’t on the tour adding the stupidest commentary possible
Yeah I really don't care either. A loss is a loss. It doesn't really matter if it's by 7 points or 35 points. In today's game, blowouts are going to happen once in awhile.
I'm not satisfied at all with those "close losses". Ohio State's defense was relatively weak and we were able to move the ball on them. Their offense also had a ton of drops by their receivers. We had a few blown coverages where we didn't have a guy within 15 yards of their receiver and they were able to capitalize on it. You can't have that if you want to win against a team like that.
For the Iowa game, we got physically dominated on the defensive side of the ball. That shouldn't be happening at the end of the year. The game really wasn't as close as the score suggested, Iowa had control of the game pretty much the entire time.
I would say that it does require superior athletes. What it does not require is the big body guys that are predominantly 5 stars. He can take smaller guys, as long as they are great athletes, do I suppose he can use more “diamonds in the rough.”
Alabama and Clemson did it last year. I hope we get to the point where we're running our ball control offense with our backups and it still looks like we're trying to run up the score. That's pretty much what our offense was like in the 90's and regularly putting up 60+ points a game.
I think that's what we're talking about too. I don't pay that much attention to what they say about other teams, but they've been laughably wrong about us most of the time on those Summer Bus Tours. I remember how positive they were about us in 2015 and 2017(when we had losing records) and how comparatively negative they were in 2016(when we won 9 games). I remember Gerry DiNardo that year saying that just getting to a bowl game should be the goal for that team. I find those interesting just to see them report on us, but I don't really put much stock in their analysis.
Yes, because he’s not a douchebag...
Agree. I don't think his 9 win streak was going to last much longer.
The roster management is very different this time. They have brought in big classes and moved on from a lot of guys who didn't have a future in the program already in a year and a half.
Frost gets the number crunch. You're no longer going to see a team sprinkled with guys starting and backing up who couldn't get a scholarship to another blue blood school.
We won't see charts showing how our starting talent is dead even or worse than a conference doormat team after several years of his tenure. He has already shown that he will move those guys on and go after HS, JUCO, and grad transfers to upgrade the roster.
He is getting top-tier dual threat QBs in to run a unique offense. The breakdowns on the UCF offense are fascinating, it's a nightmare to defend. Now consider that was only year two for Milton.
The eye deception and wrinkles to that offense they can have by the time they're starting guys who have 3-5 years in the system are exciting.
The question is the defense. They get a huge DL talent upgrade this year and probably secondary as well. He needs to prove they can be an asset not a liability.
Frost gets the number crunch. You're no longer going to see a team sprinkled with guys starting and backing up who couldn't get a scholarship to another blue blood school.
We won't see charts showing how our starting talent is dead even or worse than a conference doormat team after several years of his tenure. He has already shown that he will move those guys on and go after HS, JUCO, and grad transfers to upgrade the roster.
He is getting top-tier dual threat QBs in to run a unique offense. The breakdowns on the UCF offense are fascinating, it's a nightmare to defend. Now consider that was only year two for Milton.
The eye deception and wrinkles to that offense they can have by the time they're starting guys who have 3-5 years in the system are exciting.
The question is the defense. They get a huge DL talent upgrade this year and probably secondary as well. He needs to prove they can be an asset not a liability.
I disagree....Nebraska is the only only blue-blood in an 800 mile radius around Lincoln. That means there are about 40 million people to pick a 25 man roster every year if you just recruit Colorado, Kansas, Missouri, Iowa, Dakotas, Wyoming, Minnesota, Nebraska...the fact we couldn't pull the top recruits from these areas that are devoid of top programs, when Nebraska has by far the best facilities, success, support is an indictment on Bo's laziness in recruiting. The fact that he pulled so many kids from Ohio instead of just locking down Kansas...a state that happened to have a number of 5 stars is pathetic. Bo was fired because he couldn't hold on to his position coaches...he couldn't recruit at a high enough level, and he couldn't gameplan against decent teams. And then he flipped his shiite. Bobby Petrino got a new job after basically being the worst human ever, Mike Leach locked a kid in closet, and is now respected member of the coaching community. Bo pelini will never get a D1 job because he sucks as a coach. And Riley was even worse somehow. I fully expect us to be back in the top 10 for a long time because we don't have ANY regional competition...missouri screwed the pooch by going SEC, and Iowa, colorado missed their opportunity while we were weak and literally hired the worst possible candidates for 20 straight years. That window has now shut.
1. We have an administration and a chancellor who understands the athletics department matters and is actively working for the athletic department and not against it. Had not been that way for a long while.
2. We have an AD who isn't more concerned about their own legacy than they are about making their decisions based on the history of what has been successful at Nebraska historically.
3. We have an actual plan in place on and off the field and a fairly unified vision for what the program is, should and can be from the fans, the boosters, the players, the coaches and the administration as a whole. Over the past 20 years we were lucky when 2 or 3 of those lined up let alone 4 or 5.
2. We have an AD who isn't more concerned about their own legacy than they are about making their decisions based on the history of what has been successful at Nebraska historically.
3. We have an actual plan in place on and off the field and a fairly unified vision for what the program is, should and can be from the fans, the boosters, the players, the coaches and the administration as a whole. Over the past 20 years we were lucky when 2 or 3 of those lined up let alone 4 or 5.
Easy...Scott Frost...that’s the biggest difference. And Mike Riley should have never been hired. Those are the obvious ones.
On offense, consistency comes this year. We beat ourselves last year by penalty, missed assignments and learning the system,with highest impact at qb,and a true frosh who hadnt played but a short period in over a year.
With consistency comes the opposition trying to match us, all the while their defense gets worn down,and our offense has more aggressive opportunities,and slightly more time between possessions.
This year, we will see a better picture of who SF and staff is, and its effects against our competition.
With consistency comes the opposition trying to match us, all the while their defense gets worn down,and our offense has more aggressive opportunities,and slightly more time between possessions.
This year, we will see a better picture of who SF and staff is, and its effects against our competition.
