So Trump wanted to do the following Military Withdrawals on his way out of office

HuskerGuy33

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Donald Trump orders on November 9, 2020 (Days after he lost his re-election bid)

1. Get us out of Afghanistan.

2. Get us out of Iraq and Syria.

3. Complete the withdrawal from Germany.

4. Get us out of Africa.

The one-page memo was delivered by courier to Christopher Miller's office two days later, on the afternoon of Nov. 11. The order arrived seemingly out of nowhere, and its instructions, signed by Trump, were stunning: All U.S. military forces were to be withdrawn from Somalia by Dec. 31, 2020. All U.S. forces were to be withdrawn from Afghanistan by Jan. 15, 2021.


News of the memo spread quickly throughout the Pentagon. Top military brass, including Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Gen. Mark Milley, were appalled. This was not the way to conduct policy — with no consultation, no input, no process for gaming out consequences or offering alternatives.

Source

Talk about chaos.
 

nelsonj22

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Donald Trump orders on November 9, 2020 (Days after he lost his re-election bid)

1. Get us out of Afghanistan.

2. Get us out of Iraq and Syria.

3. Complete the withdrawal from Germany.

4. Get us out of Africa.

The one-page memo was delivered by courier to Christopher Miller's office two days later, on the afternoon of Nov. 11. The order arrived seemingly out of nowhere, and its instructions, signed by Trump, were stunning: All U.S. military forces were to be withdrawn from Somalia by Dec. 31, 2020. All U.S. forces were to be withdrawn from Afghanistan by Jan. 15, 2021.


News of the memo spread quickly throughout the Pentagon. Top military brass, including Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Gen. Mark Milley, were appalled. This was not the way to conduct policy — with no consultation, no input, no process for gaming out consequences or offering alternatives.

Source

Talk about chaos.
The epitome of "dumpster fire" and a little less than half of america wanted #4More
 

sklarbodds

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We shouldn't be in any of those countries anyway. Why is it America's job to babysit the rest of the world? Why are we expected to take on other countries' unwanted citizens? America first, always.
Do you think that's realistic? Like really realistic that we should never have a military presence anywhere but home?

Take that in contrast to what's real today. There are hundreds of military bases (like 800ish?) across the world. We did that so we can launch a force from pretty much any spot of the planet.

Add in that there are now many countries that have quick strike military capabilities, do you see it as realistic to only be on US soil? I know it sounds good in a bite, but how would we really do that?
 

Jaemekon

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Do you think that's realistic? Like really realistic that we should never have a military presence anywhere but home?

Take that in contrast to what's real today. There are hundreds of military bases (like 800ish?) across the world. We did that so we can launch a force from pretty much any spot of the planet.

Add in that there are now many countries that have quick strike military capabilities, do you see it as realistic to only be on US soil? I know it sounds good in a bite, but how would we really do that?

Seems like we are wasting a shit ton of money. We want to be able to intimidate the world? I don't want other countries having bases here, and I don't want other countries to be able to have bases in any other country either.

I don't care about globalization, I don't care about global power. I have a very narrow scope of things I care about. I think it's probably because I'm not a power grubbing politician that I don't get it.

We have spent all this money to put troops all over the world, now the government just wants a return on their "investment".
 
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realbp

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Seems like we are wasting a shit ton of money. We want to be able to intimidate the world? I don't want other countries having bases here, and I don't want other countries to be able to have bases in any other country either.

I don't care about globalization, I don't care about global power. I have a very narrow scope of things I care about. I think it's probably because I'm not a power grubbing politician that I don't get it.

We have spent all this money to put troops all over the world, now the government just wants a return on their "investment".
You aren't living in reality. You cannot go backwards in time and undo technology and history. Do you honestly think WWII gets to the point it gets to if the US would have had a military presence abroad? This is the world we live in because of events that have occurred previously. It's 2021, not 1921.
 

Jaemekon

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You aren't living in reality. You cannot go backwards in time and undo technology and history. Do you honestly think WWII gets to the point it gets to if the US would have had a military presence abroad? This is the world we live in because of events that have occurred previously. It's 2021, not 1921.

So it's exactly as I thought then. We spent the money, and now we can't unspend it, so we just spend more. Brilliant.

I wish Japan wouldn't have bombed us, then we wouldn't have needed to get involved in WW2 at all, but here we are.

It's basically like Nebraska in the big ten at this point, we fvcked up, jumped ship, and now we have to pretend like this is the only way forward. Because money.
 

sklarbodds

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Seems like we are wasting a shit ton of money. We want to be able to intimidate the world? I don't want other countries having bases here, and I don't want other countries to be able to have bases in any other country either.

I don't care about globalization, I don't care about global power. I have a very narrow scope of things I care about. I think it's probably because I'm not a power grubbing politician that I don't get it.

We have spent all this money to put troops all over the world, now the government just wants a return on their "investment".

You aren't living in reality. You cannot go backwards in time and undo technology and history. Do you honestly think WWII gets to the point it gets to if the US would have had a military presence abroad? This is the world we live in because of events that have occurred previously. It's 2021, not 1921.

So it's exactly as I thought then. We spent the money, and now we can't unspend it, so we just spend more. Brilliant.

I wish Japan wouldn't have bombed us, then we wouldn't have needed to get involved in WW2 at all, but here we are.

It's basically like Nebraska in the big ten at this point, we fvcked up, jumped ship, and now we have to pretend like this is the only way forward. Because money.
Yeah, basically. That's what I was getting at. I think if we tried to un-ring the bell at this point we'd be f*cked.
 
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Red_Hack

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We shouldn't be in any of those countries anyway. Why is it America's job to babysit the rest of the world? Why are we expected to take on other countries' unwanted citizens? America first, always.
Because we are District 1.
 

Grumpysker

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So it's exactly as I thought then. We spent the money, and now we can't unspend it, so we just spend more. Brilliant.

I wish Japan wouldn't have bombed us, then we wouldn't have needed to get involved in WW2 at all, but here we are.

It's basically like Nebraska in the big ten at this point, we fvcked up, jumped ship, and now we have to pretend like this is the only way forward. Because money.
So, we would have just abandoned all of our allies as they fought Germany, Japan and Italy? You my friend lack foresight, and now your historical revisionism is idiotic.

I too wish Japan wouldn't have bombed Pearl Harbor, however there was no way for the US to stay out of WWII, otherwise we would all likely be speaking German today1
 

Jaemekon

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So, we would have just abandoned all of our allies as they fought Germany, Japan and Italy? You my friend lack foresight, and now your historical revisionism is idiotic.

I too wish Japan wouldn't have bombed Pearl Harbor, however there was no way for the US to stay out of WWII, otherwise we would all likely be speaking German today1

I'm saying I wish we were more of a reclusive country. The need to have allies and bullshit all over the world is what I have a problem with.

Politicians from around the globe are what I have a problem with. The human desire for power, and their incessant "need" to control those who disagree with them, or who they disagree with, is what I hate.

Money and power hungry humans destroy the world. This is what politicians are. They are the reason for war, for poverty, for suffering, they are the problem.

But yea, money and pricks to put it simply.
 

HuskerGuy33

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We shouldn't be in any of those countries anyway. Why is it America's job to babysit the rest of the world? Why are we expected to take on other countries' unwanted citizens? America first, always.
I keep hearing Freedom isn't Free as one of the reasons we spend so much on the military, and have our military located all over the world
 

Jaemekon

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I keep hearing Freedom isn't Free as one of the reasons we spend so much on the military, and have our military located all over the world

Freedom through oppression is not freedom though. Weak humans giving in to pride, greed, wrath, and envy. It's really simple.

The depths of hell are great, one can not escape but with one life.

08oz-disinformation-1-mobileMasterAt3x.jpg
 

steinek11

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I'm saying I wish we were more of a reclusive country. The need to have allies and bullshit all over the world is what I have a problem with.

Politicians from around the globe are what I have a problem with. The human desire for power, and their incessant "need" to control those who disagree with them, or who they disagree with, is what I hate.

Money and power hungry humans destroy the world. This is what politicians are. They are the reason for war, for poverty, for suffering, they are the problem.

But yea, money and pricks to put it simply.
I wish we could dose the entire planet with lsd and be done with all this violence and greed bullshit.


Need major ego death
 

Oldschool1964

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This is actually pretty interesting. We have “war monger” conservatives agreeing with Trump to pull out of all these conflicts, and we have “bleeding heart” liberals arguing to keep our troops in these war zones till infinity just because they need to disagree with every Trump policy. Maybe we should start talking about the big switch again?!
 

lolwat

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We shouldn't be in any of those countries anyway. Why is it America's job to babysit the rest of the world? Why are we expected to take on other countries' unwanted citizens? America first, always.

Generally speaking, I am not too far off of this line of thinking. However it needs to be done with some critical thinking, planning, coordination with allies, and a whole host of other things. To sign that on the way out is just reckless and foolish and the potential expense of our national security. It is just yet another example that illustrates the type of man he is.

Joe Biden has obviously not been perfect on the border and with Israel but... trading personal political favors for tax payer defense money, signing withdrawals on the way out trying to F the next guy in on the job, it goes on and on. Not counting the paying porn ladies with campaign money, or the foundation with his name having to get shut down for scamming people, its really endless list of douchebaggery.

That said Joe Biden still has a lot of work to do for my vote in 2024 if he lives that long and/or runs again. Same would go for Harris.
 
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lolwat

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This is actually pretty interesting. We have “war monger” conservatives agreeing with Trump to pull out of all these conflicts, and we have “bleeding heart” liberals arguing to keep our troops in these war zones till infinity just because they need to disagree with every Trump policy. Maybe we should start talking about the big switch again?!

In typical conservative fashion.. take something really hard, narrow it to a basic straw man, then knock it down. I am for leaving those places, but not just randomly with no strategy or plan, including a plan to return if things smolder out of control.. and also letting them know we'll be back if they want to be idiots.
 

EriktheRed

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Donald Trump orders on November 9, 2020 (Days after he lost his re-election bid)

1. Get us out of Afghanistan.

2. Get us out of Iraq and Syria.

3. Complete the withdrawal from Germany.

4. Get us out of Africa.

The one-page memo was delivered by courier to Christopher Miller's office two days later, on the afternoon of Nov. 11. The order arrived seemingly out of nowhere, and its instructions, signed by Trump, were stunning: All U.S. military forces were to be withdrawn from Somalia by Dec. 31, 2020. All U.S. forces were to be withdrawn from Afghanistan by Jan. 15, 2021.


News of the memo spread quickly throughout the Pentagon. Top military brass, including Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Gen. Mark Milley, were appalled. This was not the way to conduct policy — with no consultation, no input, no process for gaming out consequences or offering alternatives.

Source

Talk about chaos.
Oh I love the complete fake information added in there about how ISIS came about. They arrived due to a power vaccuum? Uhhh that's like the third and much smaller factor. If you completely forget the Arab Spring and training the "good rebels" then yes that is the reason for ISIS.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jun/03/us-isis-syria-iraq
 

Jaemekon

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Generally speaking, I am not too far off of this line of thinking. However it needs to be done with some critical thinking, planning, coordination with allies, and a whole host of other things. To sign that on the way out is just reckless and foolish and the potential expense of our national security. It is just yet another example that illustrates the type of man he is.

Joe Biden has obviously not been perfect on the border and with Israel but... trading personal political favors for tax payer defense money, signing withdrawals on the way out trying to F the next guy in on the job, it goes on and on. Not counting the paying porn ladies with campaign money, or the foundation with his name having to get shut down for scamming people, its really endless list of douchebaggery.

That said Joe Biden still has a lot of work to do for my vote in 2024 if he lives that long and/or runs again. Same would go for Harris.

I hear you, I'm speaking more in general.

Obviously trump is an as$hole, and biden is more of the same old politician that I have come to expect.

But I do not believe in wasting so much money to have a global "presence".
 

Grumpysker

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I'm saying I wish we were more of a reclusive country. The need to have allies and bullshit all over the world is what I have a problem with.

Politicians from around the globe are what I have a problem with. The human desire for power, and their incessant "need" to control those who disagree with them, or who they disagree with, is what I hate.

Money and power hungry humans destroy the world. This is what politicians are. They are the reason for war, for poverty, for suffering, they are the problem.

But yea, money and pricks to put it simply.
We are currently the largest global economy, we are the largest global democracy, we are the beacon of light for many, many oppressed people around the world and you want us to be more reclusive. Grow up man, the genie has been out of the bottle for many decades, it isn't going back in. Besides the fact that this country was founded on being a melting pot, now you would like us to basically close up.

In case you aren't aware, our reclusiveness had a large part in the coming about of WWI.

What do you tell all of the American companies who operate internationally? What do you tell all of our citizens that are currently employed by international companies? How is the US expected to access the necessary products/resources for our economy to operate, when those products/resources aren't available in our own country.

This is not a topic someone as naïve as yourself should be involved in.
 

Soda Popinski

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We are currently the largest global economy, we are the largest global democracy, we are the beacon of light for many, many oppressed people around the world and you want us to be more reclusive. Grow up man, the genie has been out of the bottle for many decades, it isn't going back in. Besides the fact that this country was founded on being a melting pot, now you would like us to basically close up.

In case you aren't aware, our reclusiveness had a large part in the coming about of WWI.

What do you tell all of the American companies who operate internationally? What do you tell all of our citizens that are currently employed by international companies? How is the US expected to access the necessary products/resources for our economy to operate, when those products/resources aren't available in our own country.

This is not a topic someone as naïve as yourself should be involved in.
Please, explain how our reclusiveness played a large part in the coming about of WW1.
 

Jaemekon

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We are currently the largest global economy, we are the largest global democracy, we are the beacon of light for many, many oppressed people around the world and you want us to be more reclusive. Grow up man, the genie has been out of the bottle for many decades, it isn't going back in. Besides the fact that this country was founded on being a melting pot, now you would like us to basically close up.

In case you aren't aware, our reclusiveness had a large part in the coming about of WWI.

What do you tell all of the American companies who operate internationally? What do you tell all of our citizens that are currently employed by international companies? How is the US expected to access the necessary products/resources for our economy to operate, when those products/resources aren't available in our own country.

This is not a topic someone as naïve as yourself should be involved in.

You must have mistaken me for someone else.

3UuM.gif
 

Grumpysker

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Please, explain how our reclusiveness played a large part in the coming about of WW1.
I likely didn't state that correctly. WWI was very responsible for bringing the US out of our isolationist ideals and policies. This helped lead the way to the significant growth in our economy over the coming decades.

@Jaemekon would like us to go back to the 1900's because he is terrified of our place in world politics!
 
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Soda Popinski

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I likely didn't state that correctly. WWI was very responsible for bringing the US out of our isolationist ideals and policies. This helped lead the way to the significant growth in our economy over the coming decades.

@Jaemekon would like us to go back to the 1900's because he is terrified of our place in world politics!
Ok, that makes more sense. For the record, I think we should allow the rest of the world to defend themselves going forward. This doesn’t mean we can’t be involved, but it means dialing back spending, and letting Europe play police for a change.
 
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Jaemekon

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I likely didn't state that correctly. WWI was very responsible for bringing the US out of our isolationist ideals and policies. This helped lead the way to the significant growth in our economy over the coming decades.

@Jaemekon would like us to go back to the 1900's because he is terrified of our place in world politics!

It's ok that you don't understand me. I wouldn't expect you to.

babadook.jpg
 

Grumpysker

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It's ok that you don't understand me. I wouldn't expect you to.

babadook.jpg
No problem, I am just glad you are in the very vast minority of this country, with your viewpoints, however I don't want you to keep spreading it because Trumplicans may actually start to believe it and it will be on Trump's next platform.
 

Grumpysker

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Ok, that makes more sense. For the record, I think we should allow the rest of the world to defend themselves going forward. This doesn’t mean we can’t be involved, but it means dialing back spending, and letting Europe play police for a change.
That point of view is valid, however not likely very realistic. My issue was completely about the point that was made that @Jaemekon wants the US to be more reclusive.
 

Jaemekon

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No problem, I am just glad you are in the very vast minority of this country, with your viewpoints, however I don't want you to keep spreading it because Trumplicans may actually start to believe it and it will be on Trump's next platform.

Oh boy. Do you take me for a trump person sir?

I know I've not seen you around here before today. I'm going to assume again that you don't know what I'm about.

I will take your remarks as a compliment though, to be able to enslave the minds of the weak isn't too terribly complicated. But for someone to say "Hey, you could lead a cult!", I take that as a compliment.

jonestown_gallery_01.jpg
 

lolwat

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I hear you, I'm speaking more in general.

Obviously trump is an as$hole, and biden is more of the same old politician that I have come to expect.

But I do not believe in wasting so much money to have a global "presence".

Concur. Now I think what we need is a willingness to have a multi-administration approach to scaling all this back. We can't break the dam we built without putting something in front of it first and that will take time. Allies cooperating, helping some places get where they need to be (hopefully not many of those istances, as most fail), and most importantly working with our adversaries. Talking to china, russia, north korea, iran, and something to the effect of.. we'll stop pushing here if you don't push there. Compromise and all that jazz.

aka impossible, probably.
 

Grumpysker

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Oh boy. Do you take me for a trump person sir?

I know I've not seen you around here before today. I'm going to assume again that you don't know what I'm about.

I will take your remarks as a compliment though, to be able to enslave the minds of the weak isn't too terribly complicated. But for someone to say "Hey, you could lead a cult!", I take that as a compliment.

jonestown_gallery_01.jpg
Last post, complete sarcasm. It was a shot at Trumplican's ability to believe any conspiracy theory ever invented.