I agree with most of this, I feel like in year three we need to see improvement with wins, not stats you can spin. I have lowered my expectations as I think almost everybody has. I do think it is reasonable to expect an 8 win season. I know everybody in the West is improving, we should be too. Group of 5 teams should not be favored to beat Nebraska at home. I would not be fine long term with 9 wins, don't know about expectations for a college football championship. Let's take care of the West, then the BIG and worry about the playoff later.
Redshirt and scholarship numbers...
- Thread starter HBK4life
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I agree with most of this, I feel like in year three we need to see improvement with wins, not stats you can spin. I have lowered my expectations as I think almost everybody has. I do think it is reasonable to expect an 8 win season. I know everybody in the West is improving, we should be too. Group of 5 teams should not be favored to beat Nebraska at home. I would not be fine long term with 9 wins, don't know about expectations for a college football championship. Let's take care of the West, then the BIG and worry about the playoff later.
I agree. No other coach could take the time to build the depth we have,yet maintain the youth we have by redshirting all the players we have redshirted.
Our record no doubt suffered by going this route, and can't continue to do so. But, the reins have been let loose starting this year, and while I dont expect miracles,demand wins etc, I know we will finally see the talent we finally have thats been held in check until and for this next year, and we will see marked improvement, but, complaining about yesterday to get us to today is pointless.
But, there are no excuses, we will be young, if thats an excuse, but we should be much improved, it's time we see it.
all this stuff was surely true before the season started yet here is your quote in August
would you characterize winning 5 games and finishing 6th in the division as "making a major statement"?
this is what I mean when I say the narrative will be bent so that no matter what, the coaches are doing a super awesome job ... or circumstances are such that really 5 wins shouldn't be a surprise or that is just part of the plan
the bar will be continually lowered, and expectations reframed to fit with the results
On offense, consistency comes this year. We beat ourselves last year by penalty, missed assignments and learning the system,with highest impact at qb,and a true frosh who hadnt played but a short period in over a year.
With consistency comes the opposition trying to match us, all the while their defense gets worn down,and our offense has more aggressive opportunities,and slightly more time between possessions.
This year, we will see a better picture of who SF and staff is, and its effects against our competition.
80 NorthwoodHusker, Aug 17, 2019
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here is a rich exchange where you actually agree with me .. of course that was before we took the field this year
↑jlb321
I understand the year one mulligan but elite coaching at elite/blue blood programs win early at elite levels usually year 2-3. Not some crazy 5 year plan.
This is Frost’s team and his record. We should win the west this year.
I can’t remember which coach was quoted as saying “there is a scoreboard in life. We shouldn’t run from it"
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Agreed, just not sure why some are playing chicken little because of attrition from guys mostly that are, to quote Chins, are turds, or were turds,since theyve been flushed.
Some other guy also said, it's my job to go and get better guys than the current guys.
31 NorthwoodHusker, Aug 24, 2019
With consistency comes the opposition trying to match us, all the while their defense gets worn down,and our offense has more aggressive opportunities,and slightly more time between possessions.
This year, we will see a better picture of who SF and staff is, and its effects against our competition.
80 NorthwoodHusker, Aug 17, 2019
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here is a rich exchange where you actually agree with me .. of course that was before we took the field this year
↑jlb321
I understand the year one mulligan but elite coaching at elite/blue blood programs win early at elite levels usually year 2-3. Not some crazy 5 year plan.
This is Frost’s team and his record. We should win the west this year.
I can’t remember which coach was quoted as saying “there is a scoreboard in life. We shouldn’t run from it"
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Agreed, just not sure why some are playing chicken little because of attrition from guys mostly that are, to quote Chins, are turds, or were turds,since theyve been flushed.
Some other guy also said, it's my job to go and get better guys than the current guys.
31 NorthwoodHusker, Aug 24, 2019
Sure, no problem. I'll just repeat what I've been saying, the staff made the decision to redshirt as much as possible.
I know you didn't miss that, ignore the hell out of it? Yes.
So again, a regular coach would get run out of town with our record the last two years, but SF isn't that guy, even if he was another coach of the year winner.
So, taking advantage of that, he decided to restock the shelves.
Just look around, some are saying if our O line doesn't stay healthy this year, we're doomed. Do you actually believe that too? Or, do we finally have depth?
My favorite is, we need Luke M to be a reciever, a thing Bo did several times, recruit qbs, use them as wrs.
So, do you beleve this staff doesn't have real qb coaching, and real ability to discern qb talent coming out of high school and to coach em up, or, are you at where we fell to,get qbs, make them wide recievers ala Bo?
This is being done right,and yes, we all wanted more wins, but we are currently sitting on more numbers in much much higher talent levels that are just now, this coming year,making an impact on this team.
No more qbs to wrs,no more who to put in at O line, and if a O lineman does start as a true frosh, it wont be out of necessity because we have no depth, but it'll be because we may have a potential 5* monster coming in earning every snap.
I like our future, and to tie our immediate past directly into our future isn't so easily seen, certainly not like how you're approaching it.
Look, we could have played Benhart, Johnson, all the new wrs etc, we most likely would have won another couple games.
They didn't, the coaches made the call. Theres other guys, NPG, who got hurt,Henrich too, several guys I thought who might end up contributing to starting, but that wasn't the call.
Go ahead and blame SF for redshirting those guys, that's ok, but you can't convince me what we saw this year will be exactly what we see next year.
NU canned a coach who was went 58-19. then canned a coach who had two 5-7 seasons, but also made a conference title game. Then NU canned a coach who went 67-27 and made three CCGs. NU then hired a career .500 coach who had 2 losing seasons out of three, with the last one being a real doozy. The drop in level of play was apparent to all. And now some of you are beginning to bitch about the present coach who signed on to clean up the mess. Keep in mind that Frost did this by choice, he had other options, including staying at UCF and maybe winning another 12-13 games. None of us are satisfied with the level of progress, but as a friend of mine says, this is a process, not an event.
What NU needs is a little luck, especially wrt player injuries. Frost gets a chance to play with even more of the kids he recruited.
What NU needs is a little luck, especially wrt player injuries. Frost gets a chance to play with even more of the kids he recruited.
As to penalties, we did quite well,went from 117th to 18th. Getting rid of guys worked too,except at LB, a few left to play with old coaches and fellow players,one we could have used, but, were still waiting for one to leave, even at db,wouldnt mind one there leaving either.
His management of the roster has been done quite well compared to his starting point and inherited culture.
His recruiting is the best weve had this century, just have enough patience to let the guys at least get on the field to prove it.
I seriously think you all confuse understanding with expectations... for like the millionth time we all have the same expectations... no the last two years did not meet what our ULTIMATE expectation is... but progress is being made, yes progress is going slow, and not as fast as we’d like... so then you have to ask what all plays a part in slowing this process down, and the answer does not just start and end with the coaches... good lord that’s broken down Barney style for you... I can’t break it down any further
I think we will see a better team,regardless of schedule,with a better record, still on record for seven games.
Wish I could say nine, but thats being very hopeful, unless the young guys really make an impact.
I really don't get this line of thought. You're not ok with 9 win seasons and playing respectable football, but you are ok with 4 or 5 win seasons playing downright bad football? We're not on track to getting to above 9 wins when we can't even finish with a winning season. I do think it's great that Frost is trying to make some changes in the coaching staff in an attempt to make improvements, but the coaches he hires need to end up being capable as well.
Frost isn't getting paid $5 million a year for fans to try to understand why he's failing to meet expectations. He's getting paid $5 million a year to meet and exceed expectations regardless of circumstance. That should be the expectation for anyone making that kind of yearly salary. Also progress is a dangerous word. Nothing ever just keeps progressing. Things usually go in cycles where you could be up one year and down the next.
Are you stuck in 2014? Has anything happened since then? Was our team getting better or worse under Bo from when he started to when he left?
Did the team get better or worse under MR? Name eight potential O linemen who could have started year three under MR? How about ten?
Since this is reality, Bo slowly degraded the numbers of talented players at Nebraska, check recruiting, check players to the nfl.
It got worse under MR, while he looked like he recruited better, much of that recruitment left with him.
So,SF says its time to clear the yard, dig, pour the cement, build the foundation, and few of his guys have played yet. So just wait or tell us not that Bo won, or that MR even tied Bo in wins before it all came crashing down,but explain how much longer we could keep doing the same with less and less.
look you can hate him and judge him for making millions of dollars all you want, but at the end of the day what he makes has nothing to do with a lot of circumstances that happen... he got paid that much to lure him here over Florida, he was brought here to get us back on track, he was given a 7 year contract to do so, not a 3 year contract to do so...
I swear this gets old trying to explain that expectations are ultimately to win the CFP, realistically how many power 5 programs have you ever seen that went from 4-8 to champion in 3 years? You won’t find any examples of it because it don’t happen... group of 5 teams can make quicker turn arounds due to you know not facing stiff competition during conference play... yes I fully expect to see us doing better next year, I expect to see more progression and sorry not sorry that I choose to look for the silver lining on things...because great things take time... building correctly takes time... you’ve heard the expression Rome wasn’t built in a day right? Well the same is true here...
If people talked about the team, not just say the word team, if people talked about scheme, not just say it etc.
If you don't like the way SF is rebuilding the team, fine, but it comes with costs, which most are now paid for.
The staff blew it by reaching their first recruiting class, they had little time and its showing. So, the first class,which should have had several contributors this year was very minimized.
See how easy that was? I criticized this staff,but using actual events, which will continue to hurt this team, because those guys from that first class that didnt make it are still not here.
Now, last years recruiting class is coming in to compete,23 rs frosh, or rs juco. None were starters, some were hurt, etc, but thats an entire class in numbers that have spent a whole year in SnC, practices, most got live action, been eating right etc.
7 of them are four stars, beyond what we usually get or have been getting,its been eight years I believe since weve had that many 4* guys coming in, and even longer all as redshirts.
We currently have at least two starters in this years class as well, with several others as high contributors or starters themselves.
So, we have the potential of almost half a team of new starters, and replacements for our graduated guys from this year without touching the guys I mentioned.
So, thats depth,potential,higher talent with some experience and all with a year in the system.
Anyone who grunts out but money,or,but wins is lacking either in true football knowledge at the basics, or are excuse makers or, those who make excuses so they can b1tch.
If you don't like the way SF is rebuilding the team, fine, but it comes with costs, which most are now paid for.
The staff blew it by reaching their first recruiting class, they had little time and its showing. So, the first class,which should have had several contributors this year was very minimized.
See how easy that was? I criticized this staff,but using actual events, which will continue to hurt this team, because those guys from that first class that didnt make it are still not here.
Now, last years recruiting class is coming in to compete,23 rs frosh, or rs juco. None were starters, some were hurt, etc, but thats an entire class in numbers that have spent a whole year in SnC, practices, most got live action, been eating right etc.
7 of them are four stars, beyond what we usually get or have been getting,its been eight years I believe since weve had that many 4* guys coming in, and even longer all as redshirts.
We currently have at least two starters in this years class as well, with several others as high contributors or starters themselves.
So, we have the potential of almost half a team of new starters, and replacements for our graduated guys from this year without touching the guys I mentioned.
So, thats depth,potential,higher talent with some experience and all with a year in the system.
Anyone who grunts out but money,or,but wins is lacking either in true football knowledge at the basics, or are excuse makers or, those who make excuses so they can b1tch.
I don't hate Frost. I don't know how many times I have to explain that. I actually like him a lot, and was as excited as anybody when he was hired. I think he's a smart young coach and has the potential to be a very good coach. He's also a Husker through and through.
That being said, over the last 2 years Frost has not been on the path to get us any closer to a championship. He wasn't even on the path to get us to a 9 win season. Now it does appear that he realizes there were in fact problems on his staff, and now it appears he's trying to fix those problems. Letting go of poor performing coaches is only half the battle. You also have to hire good assistants to replace them and it appears Frost is doing that, according to the rumors anyway.
Let me ask you how many coaches won a championship that started out with 2 losing seasons? My guess is zero. Championship coaches usually start winning right away. If not their first year, it'll generally happen by the 2nd year. And usually championships happen pretty fast after a coaching change too. I'm guessing the median is year 3 or 4 that championship coaches have won a title after taking over. Frost very well may be the coach to buck this trend and I wouldn't count him out. He's also the only coach who's ever taken a team from 0-12 to 12-0 in only 2 years.
Sweeny had a losing season year two at clemson.
You could call it year three, since Bowden stepped down
You could call it year three, since Bowden stepped down
well I’d guess that you’d have to explain that you don’t hate Frost for about as long as you make post that continue to make the impression that you hate him...
Now onto the rest of your post, you kind of contradict yourself there from the end of your first paragraph and then basically through to the end of your post. There are things that I agree with and, just as you feel frustrated that you have to keep reiterating that you don’t hate Frost, I’m frustrated that I have to keep reiterating that that just because I point out progress, it doesn’t mean I settle for the crap I’ve seen on the field. Now you and I agree that HCSF is a BRIGHT YOUNG COACH there are two keys in those three capitalized words, those are bright and young, but we over look something that comes along with being young, and that’s experience.
As for the last two years I’d argue if we’ve been on the right path or not, and I’d argue that because we ultimately don’t know what the right path looks like because no two paths are the same. I would agree that the last two years were not up to what anyone wanted to see, and that creates doubts and questions, other wise we wouldn’t be here having this debate right now. Now here in lies the objective views and the difference in thinking, since HCSF is a BRIGHT YOUNG COACH, then why do we have many poster here basically wanting to can HCSF and start all over yet again? You’d think that since he is a bright young coach that there are bigger issues at play that are out of his control, so despite how much he is getting paid he can only control the things he can control.
I define progress as
1.) identifying current issues within the system/ process
2.) recognizing what issues/ problems are within my control
3.) identifying solutions for problems within my control
4.) implementing solutions that will build towards further success.
Year one we seen HCSF try to play his brand of football with the players he had, and that ended with a 4 win season. HCSF noticed that NU was seriously lacking depth from attrition, so he noticed he can only have so much say in players wanting to transfer out, yes he can try to recruit them or keep them in the system, but at the end of the day the kid will do what is best for them. What was within HCSF’s control was how to manage redshirts, so you seen HCSF make that choice to redshirt as much of his class as he could. That did two things that helped build a more physically ready depth chart and helped give the kids a year to fully learn the system. After implementing the decision to redshirt as many as possible we seen one more win this year against a more demanding schedule, no it’s not a major success but it is a very small step in the right direction.
Now after the second year where we seen very minimal progress, we are now seeing a shake up in the staff, and if rumors are to be believed then the shake ups are due to frost saying he didn’t think those coaches would cut it, and decided that it was within his control to help them move on, ( which it obviously is within his control to do that)...
Now I’m getting tired of typing this long ass message on my iPhone so I’m going to cut it short and try to sum it up (sorry). I think we are on the right path, just not the ideal trajectory. That doesn’t mean we made a bad hire, or that HCSF is a bad coach, it means our climb is going to take longer than expected... I see HCSF pin pointing what is within his control and attempting to make changes, to make us better, and that is what he gets paid 5 mil to do... All I say is give this bright young coach some time and pull for him to succeed which ultimately I think we all do... I just think some on here are not looking at the big picture realizing that there is more to this and we can’t just snap our fingers and be back to the good old days. They look at the win column and make ALL assessments off of that....
And how did Sweeney turn it around? He spared no expense and hired the very best staff in college football. We're going to have to do something similar if we want to achieve similar results.
You and others are putting words in my mouth. Nowhere did I say or imply I hated Frost. There aren't several posters who want Frost gone. Few if any on here actually want him to be fired at this point. I think nearly everybody here wants to see him succeed and are willing to give him time in order to do so.
