Just another one of those schools that can't ever get a basketball team together because they are in the Midwest.
Kansas St
- Thread starter RedSea
- Start date
Sure but let’s not pretend that Nebraska and Kansas State are remotely the same school basketball wise. How about the list of former Kansas State coaches:
Tex Winter
Jack Hartman
Lon Kruger
Bob Huggins
Dana Altman
Frank Martin
Bruce Weber
At some point you have to recognize that this isn’t just some program located in the Midwest as you plainly pointed out. What makes NU’s football program is built in tradition/competency and standards for excellence that our basketball program has lacked. Clearly KSU has it and it’s not just as offhand as you make it out to be
Edit: now included previously omitted Hartman, Kruger
Tex Winter
Jack Hartman
Lon Kruger
Bob Huggins
Dana Altman
Frank Martin
Bruce Weber
At some point you have to recognize that this isn’t just some program located in the Midwest as you plainly pointed out. What makes NU’s football program is built in tradition/competency and standards for excellence that our basketball program has lacked. Clearly KSU has it and it’s not just as offhand as you make it out to be
Edit: now included previously omitted Hartman, Kruger
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And Jack Hartman, who won three Big 8 titles and went to the Elite Eight a few times. Not as many rounds to get though back then, obviously, to get to the Elite Eight. But Hartman did a lot of winning.
Comparing the history of the Nebraska Men's Basketball Program to the K-State program is laughable.
Awesome game to watch. The K-State Men beat the Kentucky Young Men with heart, desire, and yes...coaching. It was great to see Coach Calipari lose his first game in the Sweet Sixteen in his coaching career. I hope to see K-State in the Final Four!!
Awesome game to watch. The K-State Men beat the Kentucky Young Men with heart, desire, and yes...coaching. It was great to see Coach Calipari lose his first game in the Sweet Sixteen in his coaching career. I hope to see K-State in the Final Four!!
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I believe in an earlier thread the fact was cited that if Bruce Weber was able to have a team in 4th place in a conference said conference had to be grossly overrated.
Of course there was liberal application of the eye ball test as well as to why NU should be in the tourney
Of course there was liberal application of the eye ball test as well as to why NU should be in the tourney
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K-State Men's Basketball:
30 Tournament Appearances including this year
17 Sweet Sixteen Appearances, ITY
13 Elite 8's, ITY
4 Final 4's, last one in 1964
They even hired Bob Huggins!
Nebraska has a lot of catching up to get to K-State's level of BB.
30 Tournament Appearances including this year
17 Sweet Sixteen Appearances, ITY
13 Elite 8's, ITY
4 Final 4's, last one in 1964
They even hired Bob Huggins!
Nebraska has a lot of catching up to get to K-State's level of BB.
KSU has some history. Sucks seeing schools like Gonzaga, Loyola of Chicago, Texas Tech, Wichita St all have success in hoops. Meanwhile Nebraska keeps on sputtering along. Heck even Texas A&M used to be comparable to us in basketball! Just mind boggling how this program can't get over the hump and start winning games that matter in March! Miles time is a ticking.
I don’t think the point was to compare histories of KSU and NU. The point was if KSU can field successful basketball teams and even occasionally make a run in the tournament, then NU ought to be able to do the same. Instead, NU hoops is the least successful franchise in all major college or professional sports.
Oh, and NU probably could have hired Bruce Webber 6 years ago instead of the dude we are stuck with now.
Oh, and NU probably could have hired Bruce Webber 6 years ago instead of the dude we are stuck with now.
Re: basketball, Devaney didn't know bball and who to hire. The list of ADs who don't know bball is extensive including TO. Probably only Pederson knew it to an average degree amongst ADs.
And all of those coaches before Weber left Kansas State for other jobs. And not powerhouse jobs, they left for places like South Carolina and Creighton and West Virginia. So it's not like K-State is a destination job for coaches. Their facilities are dumpy, and they have to compete with one of the best programs in the country an hour down the road. They haven't won a conference tournament in almost 40 years. I doubt many recruits these days care that they made some Final Fours in the 1950s and 60s.
Yes I have my limits, being born in the 80's, I had no knowledge of those guys. Thanks for the additions Schuele, TFraz, and WestCoast.
My point is that, with successful programs, it's rare that things just happen without program builders (coaches that are program builders). Those guys on the list have built programs at multiple stops. Harry Caray is dismissive of that fact, that they left for other "not powerhouse" jobs. They left for jobs better than Nebraska, that's for certain. And Nebraska isn't getting built without a guy like an Altman, a Weber, Martin, etc.
It feels like Miles is hitting his head on the ceiling of what he can do. That he can "almost" or just barely make the tourney in this conference. I haven't seen him reinvent himself yet. Why the offense is so bad is baffling... Watching Loyola's play yesterday was fun to watch. Porter Moser and company can coach circles around Miles offense wise. Did anybody see their guard play against a very athletic Nevada team? Fundamentals, ball movement, skilled guard play, shooting. Those things have been lacking on offense at NU for too long. Miles and company have no damn clue what their offense is, I have yet to see any semblance of what they want to be offensively since he arrived at NU.
Yeah because Nebraska had absolutely no shot at landing guys like Huggins, Altman, Martin, Weber....right? Kudos for KSU for taking a chance on Huggins, it ended up very well for them. They have done a good job hiring the right coaches....Nebraska...not so much.
Never said that they didn't have a shot. The OP flippantly posted about KSU basketball; your post is asking the why and it points towards the administration which WestCoast mentioned in post 12. Now we are getting somewhere discussion wise as to the "why" Nebraska basketball is where it is today. Hopefully Moos retooling the NU athletics administration along with his discussions with Miles recently will trigger some kind of positive change. Identifying the guy is most of the battle. Like many have said, KSU has done more with less. Tim Miles gets equal pay to Bruce Weber but doesn't produce results. Bruce Weber's salary is 2.25 million just like Miles if I'm not mistaken
http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/
http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/
Don't forget Lon Kruger and Jack Hartman. Jack won roughly 66% of his games while head coach at K State.
I saw Jack Hartman's Wildcats take on Bobby Knight's Indiana Hoosiers at Ahearn Field House a few times.
I grew up watching Phillips 66 Big 8 game of the week every Saturday. It seemed like it was Hank Iba vs Jack Hartman every week.I saw Jack Hartman's Wildcats take on Bobby Knight's Indiana Hoosiers at Ahearn Field House a few times.
With Jay Randolph and former Big-8 All-American Gary Thompson calling all the action. That was back when you really looked forward to watching a game on TV.
Altman bailed before he got fired. And Frank Martin left because he and the AD got along about as well as BO and Eichorst. Neither was really leaving for a better job. In fact, Creighton was pretty abysmal before Altman took over. He did fairly well at K-State, but not good enough for the fans.
yes, you are right ...Nebraska can do much much better than a coach who has taken a power conference school to a final 4, multiple elite 8s and sweet 16s, has 3 power conference regular season championships and has been a near unanimous national coach of the year winner
coaches with that resume don't even pick up the phone if Nebraska is on the other line
Apparently you don’t follow him personally... what a twit. Do we need another coach? Probably... do we need this whining, normally underachieving Banty rooster who managed to catch lightning in a bottle?
Don’t be confused... once Self’s players left Illinois they went downhill in a hurry... and until two days ago, the vast majority of KSU fans would kick him to the curb in a heartbeat... but keep thinking he’s elite... he ain’t
Don’t be confused... once Self’s players left Illinois they went downhill in a hurry... and until two days ago, the vast majority of KSU fans would kick him to the curb in a heartbeat... but keep thinking he’s elite... he ain’t
he is not elite .... we aren't even going to sniff elite .... he is better than Miles by quite a stretch
I don't know all that much about Porter Moser, but if the Ramblers hang on to win this game he's going to give the average salary of Creighton graduates a nice bump. Someone will come calling with a nice offer, if they haven't already..
Moser's had a long career of mediocrity before this season. They're having a great run, but a major program would be foolish to throw a lot of money at him without looking at his entire body of work.
I wasn't really going there, I just think he's going to be a very hot commodity if Loyola advances - sort of like the Shaka Smart Sweepstakes from a few years ago.
And it will probably be harder for Missouri Valley schools to keep their coaches, since the conference has taken its lumps recently with Creighton and then Wichita State departing.
Ok, was driving for about five hours and could not respond but a couple of things....
Miles is not elite ... not even close
In fact I’m not sure he SHOULD be our coach
But your last statement is just plain wrong and numbers bear it out... taking their last jobs....Weber is 55-53 in the Big 12, Miles is 46-62 in the Big 10... call the leagues somewhat of a wash.
Weber had his best records with Frank Martins players14-4 first year)... miles had his WORST record with Sadlers players ( 5-13)...
Adjusted those seasons... pretty similar.
Miles is NOT far and away worse than Weber.
Simple.
That depends on whether you prefer Barney Fife or Mr. Haney from Green Acres.
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