Is Spencer Petras the worst starting QB in the Big Ten West?

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SWIowahawks

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Ha! I mean, he is still punting from his own 30 at times.

Kirk sort of figured out that the Big Ten kind of sucks and that if you just take care of your business, you will be okay, because the other teams are so lame.
How many coaches wouldn’t punt from their own 30? I’m guessing you meant the opponent 30. When was the last time that happened at Iowa?
 
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BigTimeFan75

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No, you want to win football games. And simply looking at points allowed is a lazy and stupid way to judge a defense. Is this concept really too difficult for you to understand?
So, I coached defense for a very long time. The only defensive goal we ever worried about were points we let up.

If we let up 500 yards and 27 first downs and 75% completions, but only 6 points, I was happy.

I feel like you don't totally understand team defensive goals. You have a goal chart with like 7-10 goals that are listed for each game.

We wanted to let up the least amount of points possible. That was it. I guess I was stupid for not wanting to let up a lot of points but having an awesome 3rd down stop %.
 

SWIowahawks

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So, I coached defense for a very long time. The only defensive goal we ever worried about were points we let up.

If we let up 500 yards and 27 first downs and 75% completions, but only 6 points, I was happy.

We wanted to let up the least amount of points possible. That was it. I guess I was stupid for not wanting to let up a lot of points but having an awesome 3rd down stop %.
You’ve nailed Iowa’s philosophy and why Phil is one of the best. Make kids make 10+ plays in a row to score. Even opponents where Iowa is outmatched. Now a days too many defenses allow scoring drives of under 5 plays. It’s maddening at times how Iowa gives up an easy play for a first down or 8 yards on first down but in Phil we trust.
 
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BigTimeFan75

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You’ve nailed Iowa’s philosophy and why Phil is one of the best. Make kids make 10+ plays in a row to score. Even opponents where Iowa is outmatched. Now a days too many defenses allow scoring drives of under 5 plays. It’s maddening at times how Iowa gives up an easy play for a first down or 8 yards on first down but in Phil we trust.
I have no idea who "phil" is

But this is ever DC's philosophy UNLESS they have a crazy good O and they know they can take chances. Why that other poster doesn't get it is beyond my small brain.

One season, we had a defense so good that I blitzed one time all season. Once, that was it.
 
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bigboxes

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Wait, what? Beathard’s first year as a starter he went 12-2. Stanley went 8-5 and Petras went 6-2 after starting 0-2. I’m still mad at Kirk for playing Stanley a small handful of snaps his freshman year and burning his redshirt. He should have been a senior last year.
You're about the sanest visitor we have to this board.
 

headcard

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So, I coached defense for a very long time. The only defensive goal we ever worried about were points we let up.

If we let up 500 yards and 27 first downs and 75% completions, but only 6 points, I was happy.

I feel like you don't totally understand team defensive goals. You have a goal chart with like 7-10 goals that are listed for each game.

We wanted to let up the least amount of points possible. That was it. I guess I was stupid for not wanting to let up a lot of points but having an awesome 3rd down stop %.
So, I coached defense for a very long time. The only defensive goal we ever worried about were points we let up.

If we let up 500 yards and 27 first downs and 75% completions, but only 6 points, I was happy.

I feel like you don't totally understand team defensive goals. You have a goal chart with like 7-10 goals that are listed for each game.

We wanted to let up the least amount of points possible. That was it. I guess I was stupid for not wanting to let up a lot of points but having an awesome 3rd down stop %.

You are if you can’t understand the simplest of concepts like this. No you don’t want to give up points, but like I have pointed out to you previously, there are a lot of factors. Like how many possessions is the defense forced to be on the field for. What is the field position the offense and the special teams are leaving them with. That’s why things like points per possession, points per play, etc are a much better measure of a good defense.
 

BigTimeFan75

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You are if you can’t understand the simplest of concepts like this. No you don’t want to give up points, but like I have pointed out to you previously, there are a lot of factors. Like how many possessions is the defense forced to be on the field for. What is the field position the offense and the special teams are leaving them with. That’s why things like points per possession, points per play, etc are a much better measure of a good defense.
No. The goal is to give up as few points as possible. Not to make excuses for giving up points.
 
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headcard

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No. The goal is to give up as few points as possible. Not to make excuses for giving up points.

Wow you are a special breed, have fun in your simple, dumbed down world. Make sure not to learn anything along away. Something tells me you won’t.
 
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SWIowahawks

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I have no idea who "phil" is

But this is ever DC's philosophy UNLESS they have a crazy good O and they know they can take chances. Why that other poster doesn't get it is beyond my small brain.

One season, we had a defense so good that I blitzed one time all season. Once, that was it.
I honestly don’t think it’s every DCs goal. There are way too many bad defenses out there to think that. Unless a lot of them are just terrible coaches.
 

SWIowahawks

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You are if you can’t understand the simplest of concepts like this. No you don’t want to give up points, but like I have pointed out to you previously, there are a lot of factors. Like how many possessions is the defense forced to be on the field for. What is the field position the offense and the special teams are leaving them with. That’s why things like points per possession, points per play, etc are a much better measure of a good defense.
I don’t agree that it’s “much better” to look at those stats only. You can say the same thing offensively. Are teams playing from behind? Did their defense allow a TD on 3 plays? Etc.

The bottom line is that you don’t automatically lose games because you gave up more points per possession in a game.
 

headcard

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I don’t agree that it’s “much better” to look at those stats only. You can say the same thing offensively. Are teams playing from behind? Did their defense allow a TD on 3 plays? Etc.

The bottom line is that you don’t automatically lose games because you gave up more points per possession in a game.

I really can’t see how points per play, points per possession aren’t a more accurate way to judge a defense. What’s the argument here? It’s one thing to tell a bunch of teenagers “we aren’t giving up anything” or “we’ll never lose, because we are never giving up a point”. It’s another thing altogether not to grasp these simple concepts as an adult, with a fully functioning brain.
 
The book on Petras is still open, he did break every HS record of Jared Goff, the potential is there, and he did get better as the season rolled on. However, he did not set the world on fire with the tools he had around him, so I guess we will have our answer in a few weeks.

From The Athletic article by Scott Dochterman on the State of Program covering Iowa. The Athletic is doing a piece on all the P5 programs and the best Group of 5 programs.

“Was (Petras) at the level of Nate Stanley? No, but that was kind of Nate Stanley at the end of the thing,” said a Big Ten defensive assistant. “The kid (Petras) is big. I think he’s got arm strength. I watched the Penn State game, and I thought he looked night-and-day better in that game, in terms of making throws, than what he did in our game. So what am I saying? I’m saying I expect to see that kid make a huge jump this year. I think he’s got good arm strength. He’s got size. I think he’s in a quarterback-friendly offense, and I think he’s got a really good position coach. I think you’ll see a big jump out of him this year.”

We shall see how it plays out. He got off to a 0-2 start. Iowa won the final 6 games, and the only one possession win was against Nebraska.


Petras didn't get a spring practice. He was a first year starter and during the separation of contact, due to the pandemic, QB coach Ken O'Keefe compared his bad habits to common bad habits Division 3 QBs often bring to fall drills, since they don't have a formal spring.

Ironically, O'Keefe was Fordham's head coach for one season before joining Kirk Ferentz's first staff at Iowa in 1999.

He was a champion head coach in Division III prior to taking Fordham job.
 

headcard

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From The Athletic article by Scott Dochterman on the State of Program covering Iowa. The Athletic is doing a piece on all the P5 programs and the best Group of 5 programs.

“Was (Petras) at the level of Nate Stanley? No, but that was kind of Nate Stanley at the end of the thing,” said a Big Ten defensive assistant. “The kid (Petras) is big. I think he’s got arm strength. I watched the Penn State game, and I thought he looked night-and-day better in that game, in terms of making throws, than what he did in our game. So what am I saying? I’m saying I expect to see that kid make a huge jump this year. I think he’s got good arm strength. He’s got size. I think he’s in a quarterback-friendly offense, and I think he’s got a really good position coach. I think you’ll see a big jump out of him this year.”

We shall see how it plays out. He got off to a 0-2 start. Iowa won the final 6 games, and the only one possession win was against Nebraska.



Petras didn't get a spring practice. He was a first year starter and during the separation of contact, due to the pandemic, QB coach Ken O'Keefe compared his bad habits to common bad habits Division 3 QBs often bring to fall drills, since they don't have a formal spring.

Ironically, O'Keefe was Fordham's head coach for one season before joining Kirk Ferentz's first staff at Iowa in 1999.

He was a champion head coach in Division III prior to taking Fordham job.

Do Iowa fans like Scott Dochterman? He seems like the worst sports “journalist” on the face of the Earth.
 
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Flick2.0

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3. True Freshmen Arland Bruce and Keagan Johnson are already pencilled in to be #2 receivers for Iowa. Kirk Ferentz rarely plays true freshmen, and he's even less likely to play freshman on an offensive skill position. You can look all around the Big Ten West, and neither of those two would be factors in the WR 2-Deep at any other West program.
Gotta stop you on this one. KF always says the further you are from the ball, the easier it is to start as a freshmen, ie linemen typically take a few years to be game ready while receivers and skill guys can be plugged in. Tyler Goodson started as a true freshman, Tyrone Tracy played three games as a true freshman and started as a redshirt freshman, Sam LaPorta started as a true freshmen and Smith-Marsette and Brandon Smith both started as true freshman. KF plays a lot of true freshmen if they can help.

I know everyone here wants to believe Keagan Johnson won’t be any good because he spurned the home team, but dude was a 4 star and he’s been on campus since January with a spring under his belt. Guys like that start in the Big Ten all the time.

Petras left a lot to be desired last year. Lots willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, though. He didn’t get any spring ball as the number one guy. He never got his feet wet against the Northern Illinois or Ball States of the world, rather faced only Big Ten opponents. He got better as the season went on, throwing 5 TDs and no picks his last two games.

But he still looked mediocre in the two open practices this spring. Is it because the defense essentially knows the offense they’ve been going against every day in camp, or has he hit his ceiling? And Iowa’s back seven will be the best in the Big Ten this year. That might explain it as well. Petras is the biggest question mark on Iowa’s team this year, though. No one can deny that. And he’s getting thrown to the wolves right out of the gates this season with IU at home and ISU in Ames the first two games. He was a four star kid though, and has a Big Ten season and will have a full spring and summer under his belt going into the season. We’ll see.
 
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SWIowahawks

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I really can’t see how points per play, points per possession aren’t a more accurate way to judge a defense. What’s the argument here? It’s one thing to tell a bunch of teenagers “we aren’t giving up anything” or “we’ll never lose, because we are never giving up a point”. It’s another thing altogether not to grasp these simple concepts as an adult, with a fully functioning brain.
I think you can definitely take a peek at them to help form an opinion, sure. But those numbers can be skewed from team to team more than PPG, IMO.

Maybe I’m off base but it seems like you want to dismiss PPG because it’s a number Iowa excels at. I’ll have to look at numbers again but I looked before last season because we had discussions about how Iowa’s defense was on the field way less than Nebraska, which led to Iowa having skewed PPG stats. It wasn’t the case at all.
 

Cornicator

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I think you can definitely take a peek at them to help form an opinion, sure. But those numbers can be skewed from team to team more than PPG, IMO.

Maybe I’m off base but it seems like you want to dismiss PPG because it’s a number Iowa excels at. I’ll have to look at numbers again but I looked before last season because we had discussions about how Iowa’s defense was on the field way less than Nebraska, which led to Iowa having skewed PPG stats. It wasn’t the case at all.


Scoring defense is also aided by special teams and field position. I would argue Iowa has dominated opponents in that facet of the game more than any other team in college football for most of the last 5 seasons.
 

headcard

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I think you can definitely take a peek at them to help form an opinion, sure. But those numbers can be skewed from team to team more than PPG, IMO.

Maybe I’m off base but it seems like you want to dismiss PPG because it’s a number Iowa excels at. I’ll have to look at numbers again but I looked before last season because we had discussions about how Iowa’s defense was on the field way less than Nebraska, which led to Iowa having skewed PPG stats. It wasn’t the case at all.

I wasn’t really discussing Iowa, I was responding to the guy that said PPG is all that matters. I tried to explain that their is a little more to it, which I feel is common sense, but that concept was just beyond him.

As for Iowa. I do think their style of play on offense can lead to their defense looking better in terms of PPG, which really should be common sense. It doesn’t mean they haven’t fielded some great defenses, I just think it can be wise to look at the entire picture and use more and better data. Iowa’s defense, or any good defense, should hold up using something like points per play.
 

Cornicator

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I know everyone here wants to believe Keagan Johnson won’t be any good because he spurned the home team, but dude was a 4 star and he’s been on campus since January with a spring under his belt. Guys like that start in the Big Ten all the time.


I don't have any disdain for Keagan. I believe he will indeed be a great player for Iowa. But in the past when Iowa was able to incorporate some freshman receivers, it was more of an added bonus instead of a necessity like the situation in 2021.

In 2017, Iowa had a true #1 with years of experience in Vandenburg. Ferentz and company also had an Ace up their sleeve with Noah Fant, while also seeing a big addition in JUCO all-american Nick Easley. Wadley was also one of the best pass catching running backs in the country.

There are some distinct differences this time:

1. Petras is clearly not Nate Stanley. That's obvious.
2. LaPorta is a good player, but nowhere close to the talent of Fant.
3. Tracy and Raigaini are solid players, but don't have the size matchup or the pedigree of Vandeburg
4. Charlie Jones is not on par with Nick Easley

Its one thing to play a true freshman, its another thing to need significant impact from true Freshmen.
 

SuperBigFan

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I wasn’t really discussing Iowa, I was responding to the guy that said PPG is all that matters. I tried to explain that their is a little more to it, which I feel is common sense, but that concept was just beyond him.

As for Iowa. I do think their style of play on offense can lead to their defense looking better in terms of PPG, which really should be common sense. It doesn’t mean they haven’t fielded some great defenses, I just think it can be wise to look at the entire picture and use more and better data. Iowa’s defense, or any good defense, should hold up using something like points per play.
So you do or don't think that PPG is the most important measure for a defense?

Cause you sort of mention that it is the most important thing a few times but then you sort of argue with yourself about it as well.
 

Rubrum_Magnus_Virtus

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The stars aligned perfectly for iowa in 2015 and they couldn’t get it done.

Ideally they would lose every game, but barring that unlikely scenario, it’s likely they finish somewhere between 7-5 and 8-4 before the bowl game.

Here’s to hoping they start 0-2 again. I wish nothing but disappointment on their fan base and hope K Johnson has a healthy, but uneventful career and quietly moves into working for Principal Financial in Des Moines….
 

SuperBigFan

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The stars aligned perfectly for iowa in 2015 and they couldn’t get it done.

Ideally they would lose every game, but barring that unlikely scenario, it’s likely they finish somewhere between 7-5 and 8-4 before the bowl game.

Here’s to hoping they start 0-2 again. I wish nothing but disappointment on their fan base and hope K Johnson has a healthy, but uneventful career and quietly moves into working for Principal Financial in Des Moines….
Hahaha!

No kidding, they are such an annoying fan base.
 
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headcard

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So you do or don't think that PPG is the most important measure for a defense?

Cause you sort of mention that it is the most important thing a few times but then you sort of argue with yourself about it as well.

PPG alone is not the best way to measure a defense. I never said it was, at all. I have said stats like points per play or points per possession are much better indicators. Look at someone like the service academies. Because of their style of offense the opponent may only get 4 possessions a game, if they are giving up 20 PPG they are not a good defense, but that would still rank in the Top 20 in scoring defense.
 

scarletred

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The stars aligned perfectly for iowa in 2015 and they couldn’t get it done.

Ideally they would lose every game, but barring that unlikely scenario, it’s likely they finish somewhere between 7-5 and 8-4 before the bowl game.

Here’s to hoping they start 0-2 again. I wish nothing but disappointment on their fan base and hope K Johnson has a healthy, but uneventful career and quietly moves into working for Principal Financial in Des Moines….
We’ll definitely see how good that back 7 is in their first 2 games.. Ioway isn’t use to starting out of the gate with two rated teams to start the season, quite often the Cyclones are their second or third game of the season but this ISU team will be the best in it’s history…
 

Rubrum_Magnus_Virtus

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We’ll definitely see how good that back 7 is in their first 2 games.. Ioway isn’t use to starting out of the gate with two rated teams to start the season, quite often the Cyclones are their second or third game of the season but this ISU team will be the best in it’s history…
If the cyclones beat iowa, I’ll start believing in the cyclones a little. If the cyclones lose to iowa, then they are just another preseason over hyped team. It’ll be interesting to see if the clones wilt or rise under the pressure….
 

keilwitzg

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Any thread having to do w iowa belongs right alongside every person ever born in that state

dead, decaying and forgotten

OP is the biggest cuck going. Deflections like this are embarrassing & pathetic
Ehhh, I think the OP knew what he was doing…
tenor.gif
 
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headcard

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If the cyclones beat iowa, I’ll start believing in the cyclones a little. If the cyclones lose to iowa, then they are just another preseason over hyped team. It’ll be interesting to see if the clones wilt or rise under the pressure….

They have played in bigger games than this one the last couple years. I think it’s pretty safe to say ISU is solid. I think that game tells us more about Iowa. If Iowa beats ISU, they are probably pretty good, maybe even as good as their fans on here think they are.
 

Cornicator

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If the cyclones beat iowa, I’ll start believing in the cyclones a little. If the cyclones lose to iowa, then they are just another preseason over hyped team. It’ll be interesting to see if the clones wilt or rise under the pressure….

They may be overrated to an extent, but they return 20 starters from an 9 win football team including future NFL players at RB, QB, TE, DE, LB and CB.

They will beat Iowa rather easily this season. This is a rebuilding season for the Hawks.
 

SuperBigFan

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PPG alone is not the best way to measure a defense. I never said it was, at all. I have said stats like points per play or points per possession are much better indicators. Look at someone like the service academies. Because of their style of offense the opponent may only get 4 possessions a game, if they are giving up 20 PPG they are not a good defense, but that would still rank in the Top 20 in scoring defense.
Ahhhh, I see what you are getting at.
 
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The Athletic is well worth it, as what another Rivals poster mentioned.


Yes, Scott Dochterman is a good voice and writer in the Big Ten. Mitch Sherman and Dochterman are often on The Athletic B1G Football podcast together. The Athletic is outstanding sports.


In the B1G West:

Wisconsin is the team to beat annually in the B1G West. The Badgers have won four previous division titles, since the West arrived in 2014, bringing to the end to the Legends division, which Nebraska won, then Wisconsin hammered the Huskers in Indy in 2012.

Iowa and Nebraska each have one visit to Indy. Iowa in the West, the Huskers in the Legends. Only the Badgers have won in Indy, dating back to when the Huskers arrived and the Title Game was born.

Look at schedule:

Wisconsin also hosts Penn State, Michigan, Iowa, Northwestern and Nebraska in Camp Randall this year.

Iowa and Nebraska have to also deal with Northwestern, who have won two of the last three division titles.

Does Pat Fitzgerald have the key parts this year?

Two sophomores, LT Peter Skoronski and S Brandon Joseph, will be NFL first round picks, if they continue on track. Fitzgerald is one of the best coaches around the College game.

Many are buying Minnesota again, but QB Tanner Morgan isn't outstanding and the WR room is unproven.

The Golden Gophers open the season with #1 B1G Ohio State, so are they this year's Iowa State or Indiana?

The Hoosiers opened last year with key home win over Penn State?

Illinois and Purdue return to their role as spoilers for another season.

Iowa has had issues with the Boilers, not the Illini of late. Purdue won 31-27 last time Nebraska played in West Lafayette too!

Illinois beat Wisconsin in 2019.

The Illini open 2021 hosting Nebraska, where returning QB Brandon Peters and the Illini won 41-23 in Lincoln last year. Coach Bret Bielema is back in the Big Ten and he has plenty starters back from the roster Lovie Smith provided in Champaign.

Wisconsin and Iowa are the two most common teams mentioned in West. Minnesota and Nebraska are the two sleepers talked about.

Then, Northwestern, who finished 5-7 in 2014, but beat the West winner, Wisconsin. Pat Fitzgerald's teams are 4-3 over Badgers, since B1G West was born.


Iowa beat Wisconsin 28-7 in on 12/12/2020, so it is 4 wins for Northwestern, Iowa (2) and one each for Illinois and Minnesota.

Another reason Wisconsin and Northwestern are two teams standing in the way of any other teams in the B1G West.
 
They may be overrated to an extent, but they return 20 starters from an 9 win football team including future NFL players at RB, QB, TE, DE, LB and CB.

They will beat Iowa rather easily this season. This is a rebuilding season for the Hawks.

Will Iowa State achieve double digit wins for the first time in football history?

Kansas State beat OU last year in Norman. Third year coach Chris Klieman is going for third straight. They are likely picked 9th again?

Matt Campbell is 3-2 in season openers. The Cyclones did win in 2019 against UNI in OT 29-26, as the Panthers ran out of gas. In 2020, Louisiana beat Iowa State 31-14. The Cyclones were scoreless in second half at Jack Trice.

Iowa is seeking 6th straight win over Iowa State in 2021, like trophy games against Minnesota and Nebraska that they achieved in 2020 playing them.

 
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tpmcg

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So, I coached defense for a very long time. The only defensive goal we ever worried about were points we let up.

If we let up 500 yards and 27 first downs and 75% completions, but only 6 points, I was happy.

I feel like you don't totally understand team defensive goals. You have a goal chart with like 7-10 goals that are listed for each game.

We wanted to let up the least amount of points possible. That was it. I guess I was stupid for not wanting to let up a lot of points but having an awesome 3rd down stop %.
we’ve pooped all over some wins in the past 20+ years, because of stats.
stats!
how petulant have we become?!
nowadays, i’ll take a win anyway, anyhow…
 

HuskerHusaria

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Iotucky has always had a hardon for us, ever since their beloved savior Fry got waxed by TO. Brought em down to earth and then some. They still haven't figured out that post season hug ribbons aren't trophy case material.
 
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