Creighton joins Iowa as Midwest pariahs

jmliehr

All-American
Nov 1, 2009
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I guess the other way to look at it is who did he allegedly offend? His own players. If they were the ones offended then they have remedy this way. If they truly think the guy is a racist bigot for that remark then they should not hesitate to ship him off. Seems like you want it both ways, people can be offended but those who are the "victims" are put in too difficult of a position.

Someone needs to define for me what a plantation is. I know the "connection" many are making but it isn't universal or perhaps it now is, shoot I don't know with the politically correct police these days. I thought Dr. Seuss was safe, silly me.

Here’s the words from one of his assistants.

 
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nwualum

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Feb 16, 2011
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Wonder what happens when the season is over? Do the players then realize nothing is going to happen and they decide to make a much bigger stink about this?
 

bigboxes

College Football Hall of Fame
Sep 4, 2004
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There is no other way to look at it.

He put his players in a shitty spot. You know he did, it is okay to admit it. It was a smart move by him. I would have done the same exact thing.

People in power pretend to give away some power at times. It is brilliant. We all do it.

"Okay class, do you want to do the 5 question quiz or the 10 question quiz?" when you intended on giving the 5 question one all along, the one they will vote to take

"Okay guys, you pick the conditioning today, 10 gassers or 6 gassers, what do you guys think you need?"

When you knew they were going to pick 6, BUT it makes them feel in control, like they have the say.

"Guys, we can stay late and finish inventory, or we can leave and come in early, you pick"

"Okay honey, you pick, did you want to blow me or do you want anal?"

You need some counseling. Laughing
 

HuskerO

Recruiting Coordinator
Sep 11, 2006
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What the hell are you babbling about? Someone must have hit he booze really early. Or do you routinely decorate your house with swastikas? That's probably it.
Oh you didn't know... All those terms I provided are now deemed racists. Now that you know that I'm sure you'll do a better job watching what you say.

P.S. My comment to you wasn't about the fylfot. It was about the phrase "spade is a spade".
 

TruHusker

Offensive Coordinator
Sep 21, 2001
9,207
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What are you crying about then? We both agree he put them in a shitty spot.

Well, I am not crying, so you guessed wrong.

My point is we don't always get to make the easy decisions. If they truly think he is racist, they get a voice to call his career over, like it or not. Maybe he respects the decisions of his players. I won't use your word for it but live long enough and work with enough people and you will be in that "s" position sooner or later.
 

Tuco Salamanca

Assistant Head Coach
Aug 18, 2016
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A neighboring subdivision is called Sienna Plantation. It is probably 30% black, 20% Hispanic or Asian and 48% white. I don't think any of the people of color were forced to move into the subdivision. Average household income is about $175k, Median housing cost about $370k, 75% of the houses were built after 2000, 22% of the residents have a graduate degree, 55% have a bachelors.

Did the term mean something different 15 years ago? I would think that if the African American community was that upset and triggered by the term plantation, they would have boycotted the subdivision entirely, not make up 30% of the residents.

I am not saying the word is an appropriate term, just find it interesting that a people that find a particular term so offensive would willingly move into a subdivision with the term in the name of said subdivision.
 

JohnRossEwing

Assistant Head Coach
Jul 4, 2013
10,267
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Well, I am not crying, so you guessed wrong.

My point is we don't always get to make the easy decisions. If they truly think he is racist, they get a voice to call his career over, like it or not. Maybe he respects the decisions of his players. I won't use your word for it but live long enough and work with enough people and you will be in that "s" position sooner or later.

You just keep agreeing with me.

He put them in a shitty spot. I don't think he is a racist, neither do they, but he put them in a shitty spot.

Your point is my point, I just made it better and used better words and examples.
 

JohnRossEwing

Assistant Head Coach
Jul 4, 2013
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A neighboring subdivision is called Sienna Plantation. It is probably 30% black, 20% Hispanic or Asian and 48% white. I don't think any of the people of color were forced to move into the subdivision. Average household income is about $175k, Median housing cost about $370k, 75% of the houses were built after 2000, 22% of the residents have a graduate degree, 55% have a bachelors.

Did the term mean something different 15 years ago? I would think that if the African American community was that upset and triggered by the term plantation, they would have boycotted the subdivision entirely, not make up 30% of the residents.

I am not saying the word is an appropriate term, just find it interesting that a people that find a particular term so offensive would willingly move into a subdivision with the term in the name of said subdivision.

They don't find it offensive, they find it as something they WANT to be offended about.
 
Nov 14, 2005
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Oh you didn't know... All those terms I provided are now deemed racists. Now that you know that I'm sure you'll do a better job watching what you say.

P.S. My comment to you wasn't about the fylfot. It was about the phrase "spade is a spade".

You obviously haven't lived down south. The phrase "a spade is a spade" has been co-opted down there and is entirely racist. I still remember the time when I lived in North Carolina when a very large White guy used it in the derogatory, negative sense to a very short, wiry Black guy during a pickup basketball game. The White was on his back, out, an instant later. The rest of us playing ball just stood there going "holy shit". But we didn't have much sympathy for the White guy, as everyone playing ball, Black and White, knew that was a pretty bad racial slur. Just like the swastika, just like the battle flags of the Army of Tennessee and of Northern Virginia. Just because you chose not to see it doesn't mean it's not extremely offensive to a large group of people. You don't get to define what is offensive to people.
 
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HuskerO

Recruiting Coordinator
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You obviously haven't lived down south. The phrase "a spade is a spade" has been co-opted down there and is entirely racist. I still remember the time when I lived in North Carolina when a very large White guy used it in the derogatory, negative sense to a very short, wiry Black guy during a pickup basketball game. The White was on his back, out, an instant later. The rest of us playing ball just stood there going "holy shit". But we didn't have much sympathy for the White guy, as everyone playing ball, Black and White, knew that was a pretty bad racial slur. Just like the swastika, just like the battle flags of the Army of Tennessee and of Northern Virginia. Just because you chose not to see it doesn't mean it's not extremely offensive to a large group of people. You don't get to define what is offensive to people.
What was the quote from the white guy to the black guy?
 

Tuco Salamanca

Assistant Head Coach
Aug 18, 2016
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This was the stupidest thing they could have done.

You either fire him (bad idea) or do nothing.

This suspension is trying to give a pound of flesh.
Added to the fact that it is a meaningless game in terms of seecing for the Big East tournament, and Creighton is a lock for the ncaa tournament. That seeding might be affected with a 3rd straight loss but would be quickly made up with a deep run in the conference tourney.

Agree pointless
 

TampaBaySkers

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I don’t think anyone is advocating for tossing out half the English language, the word spade has been used for a century as a term for black people, often with negative intent. I guess some just aren’t willing to adjust vocabulary as they learn and broaden their understanding of the world outside them. And apparently they are content with being viewed as small minded, unadaptable simpletons.

You have the terrible combination of low IQ, lack of street smarts, but high morality complex.
 
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Sep 14, 2019
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Until "they" pay attention and make alterations on what they say in "their" music, I will have no regard for their opinion on what words others choose to use.
 
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jmliehr

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You have the terrible combination of low IQ, lack of street smarts, but high morality complex.

So you’re calling me basically you, but actually caring about people? Or am I just being compared to the average Trump supporter? How do I learn these street smarts? Pretty sure I can’t change my IQ, but it’s got me plenty far in life so I think I’ll be okay.
 

jmliehr

All-American
Nov 1, 2009
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Until "they" pay attention and make alterations on what they say in "their" music, I will have no regard for their opinion on what words others choose to use.

All black people aren’t worthy of feelings or opinions because some people use words? Assuming you are white, shall we dismiss your opinions because of some white supremacists? What races actually do get regard in your world?
 

Dean Pope

Offensive Coordinator
Oct 11, 2001
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I don’t think he should’ve apologized.

He should’ve told everyone ‘F off, I’ve got a conference tourney title to compete for.’

Apologies are the oxygen these clowns need to breathe. No apologies, no more cancellations, at least for those with a tangible, elite skill who did nothing wrong.
Uh yeah, well that works great for politicians who can pander to a certain block of voters and are never really held accountable to actually do anything useful on the job. As a college basketball coach, McDermott has to actually gets judged by wins and losses and an apology should actually help him save his job and reputation.
 

TheBeav815

Nebraska Football Hall of Fame
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An apology is what a grown adult and/or emotionally mature person does when they have been hurtful to somebody else whether they meant to or not. I don't get people who act like apologizing comes at the cost of cutting out one of your balls. It doesn't cost anything to say you're sorry.

What do you do to show good faith and help people believe you aren't trying to be a secret racist and sneak racist stuff in where you can? You apologize and seek to understand how you can avoid doing that in the future.

What do you do if you're CU and you want to show you're not giving him a pass just because SPORTS IMPORTANT but also you don't think he's a malicious person who needs to be fired? You issue a statement and you give him a suspension.

If it's not a PATTERN it's not a PROBLEM going forward. If he keeps doing it...now you have an issue.

Saying dumb shit isn't a way of life. I don't know WTF some of you think you're defending.
 

TampaBaySkers

Senior
Oct 30, 2010
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An apology is what a grown adult and/or emotionally mature person does when they have been hurtful to somebody else whether they meant to or not. I don't get people who act like apologizing comes at the cost of cutting out one of your balls. It doesn't cost anything to say you're sorry.

What do you do to show good faith and help people believe you aren't trying to be a secret racist and sneak racist stuff in where you can? You apologize and seek to understand how you can avoid doing that in the future.

What do you do if you're CU and you want to show you're not giving him a pass just because SPORTS IMPORTANT but also you don't think he's a malicious person who needs to be fired? You issue a statement and you give him a suspension.

If it's not a PATTERN it's not a PROBLEM going forward. If he keeps doing it...now you have an issue.

Saying dumb shit isn't a way of life. I don't know WTF some of you think you're defending.

You hurt my feelings. Apologize!
 
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What was the quote from the white guy to the black guy?

The Black guy did something that pissed off the White guy. I want to say that the Black guy called a foul on the White guy but this is more than 2 decades ago. The White guy shrugged and said "well, a spade is a spade." Everyone on that court and sitting waiting for the next game, black and white, knew that it was a racist comment. It just simply was. No one thought "well, initially the phrase came from ancient Greece and was a corollary to the phrase a fig is a fig and was originally meant to indicate the truth, so that's okay." We all cringed that such a blatantly racist phrase would be used. BTW, in my Dictionary of American slang it says that the formerly benign term became used in a racial context in the early 20th century and was used when a Black person did something wrong or perceived to be wrong as a way of saying "well, what else would you expect from a spade (i.e. a Black person)."
 
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Tuco Salamanca

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All black people aren’t worthy of feelings or opinions because some people use words? Assuming you are white, shall we dismiss your opinions because of some white supremacists? What races actually do get regard in your world?

The problem is the faux outrage the ensues with each word that is cancelled.

I demand the word cracker is stricken from the dictionary and never to be used again. It is nothing more than a derogatory word used to belittle the white man. It doesn't matter that the baked bread product of the same name has been used for centuries, the word offends me to no end. I even hate parakeets now because of the term "Polly want a cracker"
 

Tuco Salamanca

Assistant Head Coach
Aug 18, 2016
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The Black guy did something that pissed off the White guy. I want to say that the Black guy called a foul on the White guy but this is more than 2 decades ago. The White guy shrugged and said "well, a spade is a spade." Everyone on that court and sitting waiting for the next game, black and white, knew that it was a racist comment. It just simply was. No one thought "well, initially the phrase came from ancient Greece and was a corollary to the phrase a fig is a fig and was originally meant to indicate the truth, so that's okay." We all cringed that such a blatantly racist phrase would be used. BTW, in my Dictionary of American slang it says that the formerly benign term became used in a racial context in the early 20th century and was used when a Black person did something wrong or perceived to be wrong as a way of saying "well, what else would you expect from a spade (i.e. a Black person)."

Difference between calling someone a spade and saying the term a spade is a spade. The fact that you can't remember specific details from this episode says to me that the white guy may have just been a moron and not used to expression correctly. Because the context you described he was just calling the black guy a spade. He wasn't using it as a figurative expression to call something "as it is" which is what calling a spade a spade means.
 
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HuskerO

Recruiting Coordinator
Sep 11, 2006
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The Black guy did something that pissed off the White guy. I want to say that the Black guy called a foul on the White guy but this is more than 2 decades ago. The White guy shrugged and said "well, a spade is a spade." Everyone on that court and sitting waiting for the next game, black and white, knew that it was a racist comment. It just simply was. No one thought "well, initially the phrase came from ancient Greece and was a corollary to the phrase a fig is a fig and was originally meant to indicate the truth, so that's okay." We all cringed that such a blatantly racist phrase would be used. BTW, in my Dictionary of American slang it says that the formerly benign term became used in a racial context in the early 20th century and was used when a Black person did something wrong or perceived to be wrong as a way of saying "well, what else would you expect from a spade (i.e. a Black person)."
If I could form my thoughts into words as well as @Tuco Salamanca, what he just said would be my response.
 
Nov 14, 2005
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Difference between calling someone a spade and saying the term a spade is a spade. The fact that you can't remember specific details from this episode says to me that the white guy may have just been a moron and not used to expression correctly. Because the context you described he was just calling the black guy a spade. He wasn't using it as a figurative expression to call something "as it is" which is what calling a spade a spade means.

No, you simply are wrong. The phrase "I'm calling a spade is a spade" down south means exactly what the American Dictionary of Slang says it means. It is a racial insult, and apparently has been since the early 20th century. Everyone there instantly knew it was intended as a racial insult. Because the White guy was probably 6'4" and 230-240 pounds and the young man he was talking to was 5'10 at most and about 160 pounds the White guy may have thought he could get away with an obvious racial insult. I remember the incident very well, but not what set it off. Once the ball stopped, everyone focused on the two people facing off. No one could have possibly believed that the White guy was saying "I'm going to be saying the unvarnished truth." It was the White guy saying in response to whatever the Black guy called to stop the game, being it a foul call or a double dribble or whatever, "well I'm saying you can't expect anything else but this bullshit from a spade", intending it to be racially derogatory. It's true, growing up in Nebraska and Wisconsin I had never heard the phrase used in a racially negative way, but you learn pretty quick down south a whole new range of phrases and words used to insult and denigrate Blacks.
 
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Tuco Salamanca

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No, you simply are wrong. The phrase "I'm calling a spade is a spade" down south means exactly what the American Dictionary of Slang says it means. It is a racial insult, and apparently has been since the early 20th century. Everyone there instantly knew it was intended as a racial insult. Because the White guy was probably 6'4" and 230-240 pounds and the young man he was talking to was 5'10 at most and about 160 pounds the White guy may have thought he could get away with an obvious racial insult. I remember the incident very well, but not what set it off. Once the ball stopped, everyone focused on the two people facing off. No one could have possibly believed that the White guy was saying "I'm going to be saying the unvarnished truth." It was the White guy saying in response to whatever the Black guy called to stop the game, being it a foul call or a double dribble or whatever, "well I'm saying you can't expect anything else but this bullshit from a spade", intending it to be racially derogatory. It's true, growing up in Nebraska and Wisconsin I had never heard the phrase used in a racially negative way, but you learn pretty quick down south a whole new range of phrases and words used to insult and denigrate Blacks.
It is virtually impossible to keep up with things that are derogatory or mean something different on a regional basis. Sorry no one can keep up with that. The fact that you admit that in Nebraska and Wisconsin it didn’t mean anything derogatory then you moved to the south and it has a different meaning, how am I or anyone else supposed to keep up with that? It’s almost like the Spanish dialects. A word in Mexico has a different meaning and connotation than a word, the same word, in Puerto Rico or the Dominican or Columbia. Do you expect someone from Chile to know all the derogatory terms and idiomatic expressions that someone from Honduras might use? That’s asinine
 
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Tuco Salamanca

Assistant Head Coach
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An apology is what a grown adult and/or emotionally mature person does when they have been hurtful to somebody else whether they meant to or not. I don't get people who act like apologizing comes at the cost of cutting out one of your balls. It doesn't cost anything to say you're sorry.

What do you do to show good faith and help people believe you aren't trying to be a secret racist and sneak racist stuff in where you can? You apologize and seek to understand how you can avoid doing that in the future.

What do you do if you're CU and you want to show you're not giving him a pass just because SPORTS IMPORTANT but also you don't think he's a malicious person who needs to be fired? You issue a statement and you give him a suspension.

If it's not a PATTERN it's not a PROBLEM going forward. If he keeps doing it...now you have an issue.

Saying dumb shit isn't a way of life. I don't know WTF some of you think you're defending.

Here is the issue. No one is upset that he had to apologize. As you say an apology is what a grown adult or emotionally mature person does when they have hurt someones feelings. The problem is that the apology is never enough. Sadly, the last part of your post is where the disconnect is. To many, it doesn't matter if it is a pattern or not. In the case of McDermott, there has not been a single documented instance of McDermott making racist comments in the past. Yet there are/ were people calling for him to be fired, an assistant coach felt the need, after the apology, to further state how upset he was about what McDermott said. If an apology was enough, why was it not enough????

The fact is, to some the apology will never be enough. McDermott did or started the process of doing all of the things you believe he should do almost immediately after the comment was made. Yet here we are days later.......and it isn't enough.