Covid 6.0

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jflores

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Feb 3, 2004
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I think a lot of grief could have been avoided if we didn't have the infamous "this is the flu" tweet.

Imagine if Dubya had stood on the 9/11 rubble and said "well we lose more folks to the flu annually, its not that big a deal". He could have a herculean response after that but that taste is going to be in everyone's mouth for a long time and will color perceptions. (Good thing he said "the folks who knocked down these buildings will hear us all soon!" and he earned like 90% approval because of it).

Trumps twitter feed presently is filled with him sending navy ships to help, and defense authorization act this and quarantine that and a bunch of stuff that's really pretty good. Which is why his numbers on the response presently are pretty good.

But he made sort of the boneheaded error of a being a denialist in the beginning, which makes his later tweets look weird because why would you do all this stuff for "just the flu"? To add insult to injury, on 9/11 it didn't really matter if we attacked now or some time from now (it took like 6 weeks I think), in public health in a pandemic, those were precious days lost that will never be gotten back before non-denialist Trump finally emerged.
 

John_J_Rambo

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For that to be true, then we should have seen a run on ERs in big cities by people with unexplained pneumonia-like symptoms the last couple of months. Has that been the case? Honest question, I don't know. I presume somebody is looking into that.
Good question. Not sure, but would be curious to hear. Certainly a lot of people on this board claimed to have had pneumonia this flu season.
 
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chicolby

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Do any of you really believe any US president could have stopped this from occurring? Ok, maybe Truman would have bombed the virus but that’s about it. Once China hid the severity, there was nothing anyone else could do. That’s why nearly every country in the world is suffering.
But countries are suffering to different levels, right? If not for a “blame” perspective, I hope we all learn from the counties that performed better than the average. Let’s not be ashamed if the US isn’t the best. Learn because with world travel as common as it is, this won’t be our first test.
 
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nwualum

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In fairness, we are probably the most transparent government in releasing actual figures. And when you factor in our enormous population, we are only 27th per capita in number of cases. Many countries can’t be trusted with their numbers, etc.
 

RedMyMind

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But countries are suffering to different levels, right? If not for a “blame” perspective, I hope we all learn from the counties that performed better than the average. Let’s not be ashamed if the US isn’t the best. Learn because with world travel as common as it is, this won’t be our first test.
I doubt anyone knew at the time what the WHO and China were covering up. By the time countries knew that it was gonna be bad, it was too late. China sending defective masks and tests didn't help either.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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Do any of you really believe any US president could have stopped this from occurring? Ok, maybe Truman would have bombed the virus but that’s about it. Once China hid the severity, there was nothing anyone else could do. That’s why nearly every country in the world is suffering.
This statement will be left, no matter what politic. China, wuhan, it will stick in the minds of mankind around the globe for ages.
Regardless of how you want to look at it, china cooked a brew that was deadly, and left us one month behind, think about this.
If we could go back to late February, yet have the ramp ups on PPEs, ventilators and testing for vaccine where it currently is, but a month ago.

There is no longer excuse making, understanding yes, but billions wont be able to forget,or understand.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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So, they roll up needs, is that their only chance of getting them,through the feds? Is that over and above of what they are already getting on their own,plus what theyve asked from the feds?

This is a stupid and blind tweet. What does it really mean? Who is this person? Is truth and real desire to show need in these statements/numbers?

I don't trust a so called purified statement thats so important that lacks in so many things.
 
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NorthwoodHusker

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There seems to be a certain delight from some limiting the rights and enjoyment of others during all of... this.
Well, others burning down rome, watching others burning down rome,isnt wise.

Even my statement could be construed as such, but I myself am pointing it out,because pointing fingers helps no one, yet, whatever side we are on,there appears to be another, but all of us should care more, not attack leadership, not attack each other, but, we all can agree, get those damn people off that beach k, or at least get them to move away from each other by a good bit.
 

mwulf

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Dec 15, 2013
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Thigh Land
True, you don't want a national edict/law/rule coming from Washington, the local leaders need to step up too.
@mwulf , did your friend have special testing before entering the airplane? If so, wonder what our agreements are with these countries.
If not, this needs a change
Here is what she sent me

They weren’t that strict in Madrid since all the people boarding the plane were Americans trying to return back home. No testing of any sort. The only thing they did was use a 300 people plane for 60 people to space everyone out
 

NorthwoodHusker

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Here is what she sent me

They weren’t that strict in Madrid since all the people boarding the plane were Americans trying to return back home. No testing of any sort. The only thing they did was use a 300 people plane for 60 people to space everyone out
This isnt acceptable, especially once theyarrive,but totally irresponsible on spains part.
Lets just cram everyone ina tightconfined space with no PPE requirements.

I think theres several things at play here, there currently are 8 variations of the virus, and its possible we are intentionally building up a herd antibody of each variant.
At some pount, we willneed all variants to test a potential vaccine on, and some herd effect and serum from each as well.

There is no stopping this, but having our best response down the road may be why?
 

Solana Beach Husker

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Aug 8, 2008
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But countries are suffering to different levels, right? If not for a “blame” perspective, I hope we all learn from the counties that performed better than the average. Let’s not be ashamed if the US isn’t the best. Learn because with world travel as common as it is, this won’t be our first test.
ChiNA! didn't hide the severity. Their data may not be complete but it is consistent with what we have seen. 80/15/5/2. Trump has no understanding of science, didn't even know the flu killed that many people including his grandfather. The people who voted for him do not care if he knows anything about science, in fact I think he loses the election if he touted science knowledge. But the consequence of having an ignorant and resistant president, albeit a master politician who can be quite charming is thousands, maybe a million lives. We choose our presidents almost solely on how exciting they are compared to other one. The boring one never wins. I really hope this doesn't become what it could become...70 million people over the age of 60...25% infection rate...15% critical care...5-7% death rate...we are looking at a million dead just from that demographic. The one disadvantage we have is Korea, Italy, Spain, Wuhan were one single region...we have at least 5-7 separate epidemics going and no plan to quarantine them.
 
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NorthwoodHusker

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ChiNA! didn't hide the severity. Their data may not be complete but it is consistent with what we have seen. 80/15/5/2. Trump has no understanding of science, didn't even know the flu killed that many people including his grandfather. The people who voted for him do not care if he knows anything about science, in fact I think he loses the election if he touted science knowledge. But the consequence of having an ignorant and resistant president, albeit a master politician who can be quite charming is thousands, maybe a million lives. We choose our presidents almost solely on how exciting they are compared to other one. The boring one never wins. I really hope this doesn't become what it could become...70 million people over the age of 60...25% infection rate...15% critical care...5-7% death rate...we are looking at a million dead just from that demographic. The one disadvantage we have is Korea, Italy, Spain, Wuhan were one single region...we have at least 5-7 separate epidemics going and no plan to quarantine them.
When was our people allowed into ground zero? At what date? We asked, they slow rolled us.
Looking at there numbers didn't help when we first got there, you know, the whole china and numbers thing?

If they denied us our help,it's on them. If they'd put some of our people at ground zero, see the facilities, see actual treatments etc, and let us have our own equipment,or share theirs, but let us have our own time with it using our insights, but, they did not
Did not.

We were holed up in Beijing, look at their numbers for Beijing
 

Lincoln100

Defensive Coordinator
Jun 16, 2010
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I think a lot of grief could have been avoided if we didn't have the infamous "this is the flu" tweet.

Imagine if Dubya had stood on the 9/11 rubble and said "well we lose more folks to the flu annually, its not that big a deal". He could have a herculean response after that but that taste is going to be in everyone's mouth for a long time and will color perceptions. (Good thing he said "the folks who knocked down these buildings will hear us all soon!" and he earned like 90% approval because of it).

Trumps twitter feed presently is filled with him sending navy ships to help, and defense authorization act this and quarantine that and a bunch of stuff that's really pretty good. Which is why his numbers on the response presently are pretty good.

But he made sort of the boneheaded error of a being a denialist in the beginning, which makes his later tweets look weird because why would you do all this stuff for "just the flu"? To add insult to injury, on 9/11 it didn't really matter if we attacked now or some time from now (it took like 6 weeks I think), in public health in a pandemic, those were precious days lost that will never be gotten back before non-denialist Trump finally emerged.
Did he tweet that, or was it reported that he said it? There is a difference. Your comparison to 9/11 and this is a joke; there isn't any possible way to compare the two. You are correct, his business-like approach and overconfidence didn't serve him well in his initial public response to this. Now he should stop talking and let the experts do it.
 

RaisingArizona

Walk On
Mar 30, 2009
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This statement will be left, no matter what politic. China, wuhan, it will stick in the minds of mankind around the globe for ages.
Regardless of how you want to look at it, china cooked a brew that was deadly, and left us one month behind, think about this.
If we could go back to late February, yet have the ramp ups on PPEs, ventilators and testing for vaccine where it currently is, but a month ago.

There is no longer excuse making, understanding yes, but billions wont be able to forget,or understand.
I don’t get this at all. Intelligence agencies were warning of the situation by late January. This administration wasn’t there yet. It is what it is. Mistakes happen. We were slow to adjust but we are coming on strong. We will take some extra lumps bc we wasted time but we will get through this.

That Abbott Labs test is a huge breakthrough btw
 

NorthwoodHusker

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Jun 20, 2019
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ChiNA! didn't hide the severity. Their data may not be complete but it is consistent with what we have seen. 80/15/5/2. Trump has no understanding of science, didn't even know the flu killed that many people including his grandfather. The people who voted for him do not care if he knows anything about science, in fact I think he loses the election if he touted science knowledge. But the consequence of having an ignorant and resistant president, albeit a master politician who can be quite charming is thousands, maybe a million lives. We choose our presidents almost solely on how exciting they are compared to other one. The boring one never wins. I really hope this doesn't become what it could become...70 million people over the age of 60...25% infection rate...15% critical care...5-7% death rate...we are looking at a million dead just from that demographic. The one disadvantage we have is Korea, Italy, Spain, Wuhan were one single region...we have at least 5-7 separate epidemics going and no plan to quarantine them.
So, Fauci is a liar? You don't like science either, saying Fauci is a Liar? And why has Birx had to dunk on the main stream media? These people are defending Trump, jamming idiots in the press down doing so.

The press spends not one second to explain what Fauci painfully tried to do.
One, the president has to have a positive outlook regardless of the facts, any president.
Two, Fauci needs to clean it up some too, his hard facts have to be given out in little bights over time too.
So, ones too sunshine pumping, the other, too gloom n doom.

Both are right in their needs and mostly approaches, but both are rough around the edges st this, and the media only try to pull them apart, to work them against each other,shame on the blame game!
 
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Lincoln100

Defensive Coordinator
Jun 16, 2010
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ChiNA! didn't hide the severity. Their data may not be complete but it is consistent with what we have seen. 80/15/5/2. Trump has no understanding of science, didn't even know the flu killed that many people including his grandfather. The people who voted for him do not care if he knows anything about science, in fact I think he loses the election if he touted science knowledge. But the consequence of having an ignorant and resistant president, albeit a master politician who can be quite charming is thousands, maybe a million lives. We choose our presidents almost solely on how exciting they are compared to other one. The boring one never wins. I really hope this doesn't become what it could become...70 million people over the age of 60...25% infection rate...15% critical care...5-7% death rate...we are looking at a million dead just from that demographic. The one disadvantage we have is Korea, Italy, Spain, Wuhan were one single region...we have at least 5-7 separate epidemics going and no plan to quarantine them.
Trump is a "master politician" and "quite charming?" You are either the world's greatest troll, or completely off your rocker.
 
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NorthwoodHusker

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I don’t get this at all. Intelligence agencies were warning of the situation by late January. This administration wasn’t there yet. It is what it is. Mistakes happen. We were slow to adjust but we are coming on strong. We will take some extra lumps bc we wasted time but we will get through this.

That Abbott Labs test is a huge breakthrough btw
End of January,china was closed.Ok, maybe three weeks to be sure, but thats a cycle and a half too
 

RaisingArizona

Walk On
Mar 30, 2009
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End of January,china was closed.Ok, maybe three weeks to be sure, but thats a cycle and a half too
but you were talking about PPE, etc. We had some forewarning and did little besides the travel ban. That surely helped but there were many missed opportunities. That’s always going to be the case of course but the fact that we’re not as far along as we would like is not only because of China. We made (or failed to make) some decisions as well.
 

jflores

Offensive Coordinator
Feb 3, 2004
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Did he tweet that, or was it reported that he said it? There is a difference. Your comparison to 9/11 and this is a joke; there isn't any possible way to compare the two. You are correct, his business-like approach and overconfidence didn't serve him well in his initial public response to this. Now he should stop talking and let the experts do it.
It was meant to be over the top
 

NorthwoodHusker

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Jun 20, 2019
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but you were talking about PPE, etc. We had some forewarning and did little besides the travel ban. That surely helped but there were many missed opportunities. That’s always going to be the case of course but the fact that we’re not as far along as we would like is not only because of China. We made (or failed to make) some decisions as well.
Intellegence often has to wait to protect itself too.
Exposing too early, which then becomes more specific, as less people know, makes it easier to track.
Others, like china, have their spies too, watching for our activities, and they put two and two together.

Our intellegence took a huge hit in china not long ago as well.
It's a catch 22
 

RaisingArizona

Walk On
Mar 30, 2009
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Intellegence often has to wait to protect itself too.
Exposing too early, which then becomes more specific, as less people know, makes it easier to track.
Others, like china, have their spies too, watching for our activities, and they put two and two together.

Our intellegence took a huge hit in china not long ago as well.
It's a catch 22
that could be true. I know zero about espionage. I only know the little bit that I do about Coronavirus bc I am trying to get up to speed to the extent I’m able to.
 
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NorthwoodHusker

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And it’s a super challenging situation and many western countries have underperformed. I just think that given our resources it’s fair to feel disappointed with where we are at right now.
Since we haven't had this scenario since 1941, much worse than 911, this hasn't obviouly ended, it's like being in the movie tora tora tora, but it's lasting months, not just one day.

I agree, but this slow rolling monster, seeing it slowly roll over the top of nations, including own, we all tend to think we can, should have done, better.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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On the intel thing, just like the fbi agents reporting on the saudis not wanting to learn to land in flight training,which they paid good money for, info from china has to have other sources as well, and often too late, or, you can't react too early either. You can't show your hand, but is the hand strong enough to just say screw it.

This isn't a blame game, a path of no return,no reward.
 
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