Chinander Stats: Good Enough?

jlb321

Defensive Coordinator
Aug 8, 2014
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And you are qualified to say that huh?

Another never expert that thinks they know more than a P5 HC! 🤣
these declarations always amuse me

no one here is claiming to know more than our coaching staff

we are merely claiming that the dudes standing on the opposite sidelines, more often than not, know a heck of a lot more
 

Mrs.Jeans15

Redshirt Freshman
May 5, 2018
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I don't think our roster is any better suited for the 3-4 than the 4-3 right now. We might as well switch back. No downside and tons of upside in actually being able to recruit the type of athletes needed to run the system.
Guys can lose weight and play at their natural weight.
 
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Wyldcard

Graduate Assistant
Gold Member
Feb 12, 2018
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these declarations always amuse me

no one here is claiming to know more than our coaching staff

we are merely claiming that the dudes standing on the opposite sidelines, more often than not, know a heck of a lot more
You would never know the difference by the contexts of the posts!
 

newAD

Head Coach
Oct 14, 2007
11,227
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Some of you amaze me how you don’t get how one side of the ball doesn’t effect the other.

Fumbles lost. # 2
Scoring Offense # 84
Total Offense # 87
First Downs # 95
Red Zone Offense # 110

But it’s ALL Chin’s fault! Get a ******* clue!
 

oldjar07

All-American
Oct 25, 2009
4,855
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Some of you amaze me how you don’t get how one side of the ball doesn’t effect the other.

Fumbles lost. # 2
Scoring Offense # 84
Total Offense # 87
First Downs # 95
Red Zone Offense # 110

But it’s ALL Chin’s fault! Get a ******* clue!
They're both terrible. We have a terrible team all around. That's why we're 1-4 and staring down the barrel at 1-6.
 

newAD

Head Coach
Oct 14, 2007
11,227
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They're both terrible. We have a terrible team all around. That's why we're 1-4 and staring down the barrel at 1-6.
And again, WHY ARE WE TERRIBLE? Oh we gave up more points than we scored. That means the DC must suck? Intellectually lazy thinking.

Oh and 1-4? I’m frankly not surprised. I
fail to understand how others aren’t.
 
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Oct 12, 2016
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If we were scoring more, it would probably look like the 17 UCF team, I believe that's Frost's goal...score enough, make teams more one dimensional, get some timely takeaways, and all of a sudden its 49-10.
2017 UCF D had superior talent relative to their opponents, but inferior D coaching, even for a Sunday Belt team.
 

newAD

Head Coach
Oct 14, 2007
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So much improvement though...
Iowa rushing vs Nebraska

2018- 266 yards (averaged 148 a game).
2019- 225 yards (averaged 137 a game).
2020- 129 yards (averaging 172 a game).

We finally have dudes with bodies on the DL to face up against a physical, well coached OL like Iowa & play the 3-4, and you want to scrap the 3-4 & start all over again with another D-coordinator?

Scrap the 3-4 why? Wisconsin runs a 3-4 and is # 2 in total D. Give us their D do you think they still are ranked # 2? Hell no. Wisky is also #3 in time of possession. That is a huge reason their D stats are so good and why ours is not.

Yea I’m sure an established DC is just dying to come to a program that fired the last HC the year after he was hired & fired a DC who was given 2 years, and now (if you get what you want), fires another after 3 years?
 
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oldjar07

All-American
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And again, WHY ARE WE TERRIBLE? Oh we gave up more points than we scored. That means the DC must suck? Intellectually lazy thinking.

Oh and 1-4? I’m frankly not surprised. I
fail to understand how others aren’t.
We're 90th in points given up and 79th in yards given up. Our DC continues to run Jr high level schemes that get exploited over and over again. We have run man coverage on one side of the field and zone coverage on the other side and it gets abused every time. Our players have no idea how to adjust to even the most basic pre-snap motions or even how to adjust their assignments based on our own blitzes and stunts. We continue to try to use mediocre DE's as NT's and get abused against the run. We continue to make terrible personnel decisions on defense. We have no idea how to stop a zone read play. Yes our defensive coordinator sucks.
 
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bshirt73

Senior
Aug 31, 2014
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Look at the statistics, the 3-4 produces a far higher turnover and sack ratio than the 4-3 for one, and because of it's scheme it can operate at a far higher tempo than the 4-3 as well. The thing that bothers me through all of this, ALOT of dilusuional poster's on both boards expected instant glory when Frost arrived and I can go back and pull post after post that I had the misfortune to read and being a 33 year season ticket holder and donor kind of makes me sick to my stomach and while there are some outstanding posters on both boards that have good insights, the rest you have morons that think the sky is falling.

I wouldn't be surprised one bit if this took 7-10 years to rebuild after all of the damage that has been done to since Osborne left, and yes I'm including Solich in it. No one wants to have patience, we are still not quite there yet as far as the culture goes and that part of the reason we've been seeing all of the depatures we have as the departures can't handle this culture plus other things like distance and weather for examples. It will eventually get there, but will take a bit of time to do so. The culture has an awful lot to do on how the team operates and plays.

We can't keep changing HC's and Staffs every 4-5 years as only tenure is what will get it done and Frost is building this thing for the long haul. Even though Osborne at first inherited everything from Devaney, it took a number of years to build what he wanted and was almost fired and the ship finally eded up getting righted with the longest tenured staff in DIV 1. People need to just back and support what's going on right now. Yes, right now it looks like a total shitshow and just as Osborne had to grow into the roll so does Frost.

This a learning stage for not only the team, but Frost and the staff as well. Difference is Osborne inherited Devaney's coaching staff that had a plethora of experience as opposed to Frost's staff with very little experience. Let that little reality set in as Frost's total rebuild job that agreed take is way harder than what Devaney, Osborne and Solich had to undertake as when Devaney got here the cupboard was full of talent as Jennings could recruit his ass off but couldn't coach worth shit and down the line Osborne inherited talent from Devaney to get him started same with Solich, now look at what Frost stepped into. Patience is needed by everyone.
Excellent post sir. Well said!

It's simply not a five minute rebound for HCSF. Especially after three years of Smiling Mike.....a career losing machine.
 
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oldjar07

All-American
Oct 25, 2009
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Iowa rushing vs Nebraska

2018- 266 yards (averaged 148 a game).
2019- 225 yards (averaged 137 a game).
2020- 129 yards (averaging 172 a game).

We finally have dudes with bodies on the DL to face up against a physical, well coached OL like Iowa & play the 3-4, and you want to scrap the 3-4 & start all over again with another D-coordinator?

Scrap the 3-4 why? Wisconsin runs a 3-4 and is # 2 in total D. Give us their D do you think they still are ranked # 2? Hell no. Wisky is also #3 in time of possession. That is a huge reason their D stats are so good and why ours is not.

Yea I’m sure an established DC is just dying to come to a program that fired the last HC the year after he was hired & fired a DC who was given 2 years, and now (if you get what you want), fires another after 3 years?
It only took Chinander 5 games to figure out his best defensive lineman was on the bench. We can't find an OLB to replace Tannor and you still want to run the 3-4? He may be the worst Division I player I've ever seen.
 
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red scowl

Senior
May 19, 2018
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Some of you amaze me how you don’t get how one side of the ball doesn’t effect the other.

Fumbles lost. # 2
Scoring Offense # 84
Total Offense # 87
First Downs # 95
Red Zone Offense # 110

But it’s ALL Chin’s fault! Get a ******* clue!
That is true, but the defense is ultimately responsible for how long they stay on the field. I have seen Frost manage and build an explosive offense. I haven't seen Chins head a stout defense. It doesn't seem like he trusts his back seven in 3rd and long situations. The passive coverage isn't working. The zone coverage doesn't work. The bend and break defense doesn't work. Get off the field.
 
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Iroh2

Walk On
Nov 9, 2019
317
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Look at the statistics, the 3-4 produces a far higher turnover and sack ratio than the 4-3 for one, and because of it's scheme it can operate at a far higher tempo than the 4-3 as well. The thing that bothers me through all of this, ALOT of dilusuional poster's on both boards expected instant glory when Frost arrived and I can go back and pull post after post that I had the misfortune to read and being a 33 year season ticket holder and donor kind of makes me sick to my stomach and while there are some outstanding posters on both boards that have good insights, the rest you have morons that think the sky is falling.

I wouldn't be surprised one bit if this took 7-10 years to rebuild after all of the damage that has been done to since Osborne left, and yes I'm including Solich in it. No one wants to have patience, we are still not quite there yet as far as the culture goes and that part of the reason we've been seeing all of the depatures we have as the departures can't handle this culture plus other things like distance and weather for examples. It will eventually get there, but will take a bit of time to do so. The culture has an awful lot to do on how the team operates and plays.

We can't keep changing HC's and Staffs every 4-5 years as only tenure is what will get it done and Frost is building this thing for the long haul. Even though Osborne at first inherited everything from Devaney, it took a number of years to build what he wanted and was almost fired and the ship finally eded up getting righted with the longest tenured staff in DIV 1. People need to just back and support what's going on right now. Yes, right now it looks like a total shitshow and just as Osborne had to grow into the roll so does Frost.

This a learning stage for not only the team, but Frost and the staff as well. Difference is Osborne inherited Devaney's coaching staff that had a plethora of experience as opposed to Frost's staff with very little experience. Let that little reality set in as Frost's total rebuild job that agreed take is way harder than what Devaney, Osborne and Solich had to undertake as when Devaney got here the cupboard was full of talent as Jennings could recruit his ass off but couldn't coach worth shit and down the line Osborne inherited talent from Devaney to get him started same with Solich, now look at what Frost stepped into. Patience is needed by everyone.
Exactly this. If Frost goes, we roll the dice again on who we get. No guarantee anything will be better. Let Frost stay and work through the growing pains and get the new facilities built. We need to recognize who we are not who we think we should be. Keep expectations in check as this could be a 7-10 year process...
 
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Chuck003

Redshirt Freshman
Nov 6, 2016
994
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And you are qualified to say that huh?

Another never expert that thinks they know more than a P5 HC! 🤣
OK. One of those rah rah homer types. Yeah man, he has looked great so far. Kudos to Frost. Looks like he's slowly building a disciplined powerhouse. He's everything I thought he would be and more. I'm no expert. So what do I know? I guess I have two eyeballs. That's a good thing, right?
 

dinglefritz

Nebraska Legend
Jan 14, 2011
25,648
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these declarations always amuse me

no one here is claiming to know more than our coaching staff

we are merely claiming that the dudes standing on the opposite sidelines, more often than not, know a heck of a lot more
Please refrain from using "our" when referring to the Huskers. You are not a Husker fan so quit the posing.
 
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Aug 1, 2002
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Stats good enough? Of course not. Wrong question. Question is what has to change? Players? Scheme? Coaching? All of the above? I think Chins gets 2-3 years to show consistent improvement and right the ship. If no substantial changes—next! If I’m Chins, I’ve got Charlie McBride on speed dial. Why reinvent the wheel?
 

huskerfan66

Head Coach
Dec 8, 2004
11,750
5,580
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I do not feel Frost is any better at OC than Chin at DC. Frost needs to turn over the play calling to someone else also. Chin does not put his defense in any better position to stop the other team as Frost does with his play calling.
I could be TOTALLY wrong, especially with masks, but it looked to me that upstairs was calling more plays than Coach Frost.
 

TruHusker

Offensive Coordinator
Sep 21, 2001
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Look at the statistics, the 3-4 produces a far higher turnover and sack ratio than the 4-3 for one, and because of it's scheme it can operate at a far higher tempo than the 4-3 as well.
Where are those stats please?

Delaney had Osborne who was probably one of the greatest minds in college FB. No matter how young he was, Bob recognized his abilities.

Few remember Tom directed a passing game, Humm, Ferragamo, Luck, etc. He couldn't beat OU and knew he had to change. He had both the ability to recognize he needed to change but the ability to do it. That is huge and way overlooked.

The young bucks keep talking about power FB like that is all we ever ran. It was not. Tom also changed the D from a 5-2 to a 4-3 and things really took off on that side of the ball.

Did anyone catch th comments made during the A&M game about Jimbo Fisher? They remarked that he didn't have to ask what the opposing players/team was doing, he could see it. Some coaches coach but don't see everything that is going on until they watch film. TOM could almost see things before they happened. I am.not.xonvimced this start has that ability right now.

You want to hold up getting back to the 90's as the standard because we have gone down since then..good luck with that. You are supposing in that statement that all the key pieces are in place to do that. Assume
 
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-LVhusker-

Walk On
Oct 11, 2018
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Alabama runs Saban’s systems. They may have evolved a bit on offense from a power run to more spread but they’ve done it with 5 star players that can do both. Kiffin and Sark are both decent O coordinators as well.
 
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dinglefritz

Nebraska Legend
Jan 14, 2011
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Where are those stats please?

Delaney had Osborne who was probably one of the greatest minds in college FB. No matter how young he was, Bob recognized his abilities.

Few remember Tom directed a passing game, Humm, Ferragamo, Luck, etc. He couldn't beat OU and knew he had to change. He had both the ability to recognize he needed to change but the ability to do it. That is huge and way overlooked.

The young bucks keep talking about power FB like that is all we ever ran. It was not. Tom also changed the D from a 5-2 to a 4-3 and things really took off on that side of the ball.

Did anyone catch th comments made during the A&M game about Jimbo Fisher? They remarked that he didn't have to ask what the opposing players/team was doing, he could see it. Some coaches coach but don't see everything that is going on until they watch film. TOM could almost see things before they happened. I am.not.xonvimced this start has that ability right now.

You want to hold up getting back to the 90's as the standard because we have gone down since then..good luck with that. You are supposing in that statement that all the key pieces are in place to do that. Assume
And you seem to forget that Tom ran option too with Ferragamo, Humm, Luck, Tagge etc.... Eek Ferragamo pitched very early... Your point is correct though. Tom was an NFL wide receiver influenced by the WCO. The WCO in many ways is just an option attack in the passing game. Tom realized he could do a similar thing taking advantages of numbers and putting pressure on weak defenders using that option strategy in the run game.
 

Wyldcard

Graduate Assistant
Gold Member
Feb 12, 2018
5,642
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Where are those stats please?

Delaney had Osborne who was probably one of the greatest minds in college FB. No matter how young he was, Bob recognized his abilities.

Few remember Tom directed a passing game, Humm, Ferragamo, Luck, etc. He couldn't beat OU and knew he had to change. He had both the ability to recognize he needed to change but the ability to do it. That is huge and way overlooked.

The young bucks keep talking about power FB like that is all we ever ran. It was not. Tom also changed the D from a 5-2 to a 4-3 and things really took off on that side of the ball.

Did anyone catch th comments made during the A&M game about Jimbo Fisher? They remarked that he didn't have to ask what the opposing players/team was doing, he could see it. Some coaches coach but don't see everything that is going on until they watch film. TOM could almost see things before they happened. I am.not.xonvimced this start has that ability right now.

You want to hold up getting back to the 90's as the standard because we have gone down since then..good luck with that. You are supposing in that statement that all the key pieces are in place to do that. Assume
Tom and Charlie changed it up mostly due to a suggestion made to Tom by his good buddy Bobby B and went as far as Bobby sending some of his Defensive staff to Lincoln to teach us the 4-3 scheme. Bet ya didn't know that did ya?
 

newAD

Head Coach
Oct 14, 2007
11,227
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Omaha
That is true, but the defense is ultimately responsible for how long they stay on the field. I have seen Frost manage and build an explosive offense. I haven't seen Chins head a stout defense. It doesn't seem like he trusts his back seven in 3rd and long situations. The passive coverage isn't working. The zone coverage doesn't work. The bend and break defense doesn't work. Get off the field.
I agree, it is the job of the defense to get themselves off the field. However, the offense can certainly help the D by scoring points, and winning the time of possession battle. The one game this year that Nebraska won the TOP stat, NW. Nebraska put gained them too, and scored a whole 13 points. zero in the 2nd half, two interceptions in the end zone. I suppose that is Chins fault too?

There is a distinct correlation between Time of Possession and Scoring Defense. It’s the responsibility on BOTH sides of the ball to win TOP.

We lost the TOP against PSU and the defense made 2 huge stops on the last 2 possessions while the offense in the 2nd half scored 3 points on a 10 play drive. Their other 4 drives were 4, 3, 4, and 3 plays ending in 3 punts and 1 INT.

Iowa, lost the TOP. Scored a TD on the opening drive of the 2nd half then 3 punts and a fumble. The D after a TD on Iowa’s first drive held them to field goal attempts (including after a fumbled punt). The offense had a chance to win the game .
Illinois? Neither side played well, but I don’t care who you are it is hard to win let alone look good defensively when your offense turns the ball over 5 times.

Nebraska’s O has scored 3, 0, 3, 13, and 7 points in 2nd half’s this season. An average of 5 points. You want victories that MUST improve.
 

Chuck003

Redshirt Freshman
Nov 6, 2016
994
953
93
Maybe we should have established the high powered offense before we implemented our "bend but don't break" defense. We can gripe about the crappy defense and most of it is justified. But let's address the real elephant in the room. 65-70% of the problem isn't the sub-par defense and never has been, with a few exceptions.
 

oldjar07

All-American
Oct 25, 2009
4,855
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Exactly this. If Frost goes, we roll the dice again on who we get. No guarantee anything will be better. Let Frost stay and work through the growing pains and get the new facilities built. We need to recognize who we are not who we think we should be. Keep expectations in check as this could be a 7-10 year process...
Oh wow... We've become Purdue with this kind of loser's mentality.
 
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oldjar07

All-American
Oct 25, 2009
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Stats good enough? Of course not. Wrong question. Question is what has to change? Players? Scheme? Coaching? All of the above? I think Chins gets 2-3 years to show consistent improvement and right the ship. If no substantial changes—next! If I’m Chins, I’ve got Charlie McBride on speed dial. Why reinvent the wheel?
He's already gotten 2-3 years and nothing is any better. You want to give him another 2-3 years? What's going to improve in that time? Is he going to have an epiphany and somehow not be the crappy coach that he is?
 

newAD

Head Coach
Oct 14, 2007
11,227
6,087
113
Omaha
Oh wow... We've become Purdue with this kind of loser's mentality.
You are talking down to a program that won the last 2 meetings and we hold a whopping 4-3 edge against since joining this conference. Oh and one of those wins was on a last second TD pass.

We have not become them, we arguably dropped below them awhile ago.
 
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oldjar07

All-American
Oct 25, 2009
4,855
3,070
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Maybe we should have established the high powered offense before we implemented our "bend but don't break" defense. We can gripe about the crappy defense and most of it is justified. But let's address the real elephant in the room. 65-70% of the problem isn't the sub-par defense and never has been, with a few exceptions.
I don't agree at all. Most of the problem was thinking we could get away with a UCF or Oregon style defense in the first place. Nebraska's success has always been predicated on great, smothering defensive play. We went completely off the tracks thinking we could play Oregon brand football here and have any kind of success.
 

kidofSN

Sophomore
Gold Member
Jul 4, 2007
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Against Iowa a couple years ago with less than a minute left and a tie score it is 4th and 6. Chin lines his defense up with his safeties both lined up 15 yards off the line of scrimmage. Iowa had three tight ends in the game at the time. Iowa was planning on punting until they saw the Husker alignment and instead converted on 4th down. Seconds later they kicked the winning field goal in regulation. Iowa was not in punt formation.
 
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red scowl

Senior
May 19, 2018
2,534
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I agree, it is the job of the defense to get themselves off the field. However, the offense can certainly help the D by scoring points, and winning the time of possession battle. The one game this year that Nebraska won the TOP stat, NW. Nebraska put gained them too, and scored a whole 13 points. zero in the 2nd half, two interceptions in the end zone. I suppose that is Chins fault too?

There is a distinct correlation between Time of Possession and Scoring Defense. It’s the responsibility on BOTH sides of the ball to win TOP.

We lost the TOP against PSU and the defense made 2 huge stops on the last 2 possessions while the offense in the 2nd half scored 3 points on a 10 play drive. Their other 4 drives were 4, 3, 4, and 3 plays ending in 3 punts and 1 INT.

Iowa, lost the TOP. Scored a TD on the opening drive of the 2nd half then 3 punts and a fumble. The D after a TD on Iowa’s first drive held them to field goal attempts (including after a fumbled punt). The offense had a chance to win the game .
Illinois? Neither side played well, but I don’t care who you are it is hard to win let alone look good defensively when your offense turns the ball over 5 times.

Nebraska’s O has scored 3, 0, 3, 13, and 7 points in 2nd half’s this season. An average of 5 points. You want victories that MUST improve.
I am not defending the offense. It is garbage. The offense is scrambling, a quarterback draw, an inside zone, a jet sweep to Betts and play action to a tight end.

I have a problem with the platitude of "No fear of failure". Even if we're in a two high safety, we rarely press the los. We have guys 10 yards off the receiver. We have Nelson in conflict on a Quarterback waggle. And yes the coaches also seem scared on offense. Play the young guys.

The defense isn't good. Reimer, Domann and Honas have played much better, but if I was Purdue I would run crossing routes all day at tempo and keep all of our linebackers on the field. Chins seems reluctant, and playing it safe. Won't do.
 

red scowl

Senior
May 19, 2018
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You are talking down to a program that won the last 2 meetings and we hold a whopping 4-3 edge against since joining this conference. Oh and one of those wins was on a last second TD pass.

We have not become them, we arguably dropped below them awhile ago.
So...
 

TruHusker

Offensive Coordinator
Sep 21, 2001
8,939
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Tom and Charlie changed it up mostly due to a suggestion made to Tom by his good buddy Bobby B and went as far as Bobby sending some of his Defensive staff to Lincoln to teach us the 4-3 scheme. Bet ya didn't know that did ya?
That is pretty well documented. Sheesh
 
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gghulsebus

Newbie
Feb 4, 2003
20
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Then why are we paying a premium salary if they have to 'grow' into the position(s)?

Some coaches come in and turn things around immediately.

Now you are saying it could be 7-10 years?

I gotta be honest with you.. a 7-10 year turnaround and 'delusional poster' seem like they go hand in hand.
You are so going to regret this post 7-10 years from now!
 

oldjar07

All-American
Oct 25, 2009
4,855
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I am not defending the offense. It is garbage. The offense is scrambling, a quarterback draw, an inside zone, a jet sweep to Betts and play action to a tight end.

I have a problem with the platitude of "No fear of failure". Even if we're in a two high safety, we rarely press the los. We have guys 10 yards off the receiver. We have Nelson in conflict on a Quarterback waggle. And yes the coaches also seem scared on offense. Play the young guys.

The defense isn't good. Reimer, Domann and Honas have played much better, but if I was Purdue I would run crossing routes all day at tempo and keep all of our linebackers on the field. Chins seems reluctant, and playing it safe. Won't do.
That's another thing I can't stand about this defense. Too many guys are in conflict on their assignments. It's not like our guys are all that great but we're not setting them up to succeed either. When you ask guys to be at two places at once because they are in conflict, it makes it almost impossible to attack downhill and they think too much and play slower. When the OLB has responsibility for the running back, who has responsibility for the qb rollout? The ILB? Well if he has responsibility for the rollout, that makes it impossible for him to attack the inside gap on his run assignment. Combine that with the DL not maintaining leverage and it's very easy for the opposing OL to get to the second level and screen our linebackers out as well.
 
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