Adrian Martinez

Discussion in 'Husker Board' started by Riled Up, May 18, 2020.

  1. John_J_Rambo

    John_J_Rambo Junior
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    then why cherry pick parts of posts that clearly explain W/L as a team stat, responding with 'and yet he didn't win 10. he won 5?'
     
  2. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    Everyone on here defending AM2 knows that he had regressed last year, despite those stats. I'm most certainly not throwing AM2 away. I hope he can clear out those cobwebs and get back to a winning mindset. Some QBs have it and some don't. You can see how they carry their team through adversity.
     
  3. John_J_Rambo

    John_J_Rambo Junior
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    Jacob deGrom is a bad pitcher because he's never won 20 games in a season.

    what outdated nonsense, go back to the 1970s if you don't want to spend the neurons it takes to understand statistics objectively.
     
  4. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    Because we didn't win 10 with those stats. They are misleading. It's like saying your shirt is a $75 shirt when you only paid $10.
     
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  5. hedonistimpulse

    hedonistimpulse Walk On
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    No, it's like saying this shirt is made of silk and should cost $75, but it's got a hole in it so it was only $10. The shirt isn't the problem. The hole is.

    You're asking why doesn't this shirt cost $75? I'm asking why does this shirt have a hole in it? In reality, though, you're saying Martinez is the hole and I'm saying he's not.
     
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  6. otismotis08

    otismotis08 Assistant Head Coach
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    Who pays $75 for a shirt???
     
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  7. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    You're not getting it. He's a 5-win QB until proven different. It's not all on him, but we should have won more than 5 games regardless of QB or head coach.
     
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  8. Cornicator

    Cornicator Nebraska Legend
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    I could write a 7 page dissertation about the personnel issues which completely hampered Nebraska's offense last season. But I won't due to time and indifference. But a lot of people who want to cast all the blame on Adrian Martinez are failing to forget a few things about the personnell last season:

    1. Kanawai Noa ran a 4.9 forty. He was brought in to be Andre Hunt's backup. Hunt turned into a rapist. Noa was left to start and didn't cause a single eye raise from opposing DCs.

    2. Mike Williams was playing on the boundary, in the Big Ten, despite being one of the smallest players in the Big Ten. When Spielman had to go out, was injured, or when Noa was out, Williams was really just a place filler. He was inneffective as a blocker for run support, and was constantly knocked off schedule by bigger DBs.

    3. Kade Warner missed the first half of the season, and it should've been real telling to all Husker fans that his return was treated as a pivotal positive moment for the team. I like Warner, but the fact we were all excited about a walk on with 12 career catches coming back should've been a giant red flag to the offense.

    4. Dedrick Mills is a good running back. he might be the best returning RB in the Big Ten West for 2020. But Mills didn't really get on track until about week 5. With the dismissal of Mo Washington, Mills was backed up by Wyatt Mazour.

    Nebraska basically had 3 weapons:

    Wandale, Spielman, and Mills. If one of them was injured, or they needed a break, Nebraska's offensive personnel moved into bottom of the Power 5 territory.

    Bottom line is opponents didn't have to defend Nebraska the way Frost's scheme needs to be defended. They were able to cheat and box in Martinez, spy him, or take away intermediate routes.

    I expect Nebraska football's offense to be a lot better in 2020 with Manning, Betts, Wandale, Mills, the Tight Ends and some legit back ups at RB, plus second year wideouts in the system.
     
  9. John_J_Rambo

    John_J_Rambo Junior
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    those stats are not misleading, they are what they are. there's no such thing as reach x stat and get x wins.

    it's all part of a bigger picture.

    saying every player is a 5-win player would be accurate.
     
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  10. schuele

    schuele Athletic Director
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    Also hoping for some significant improvement in the offensive line. I'm not sold on the idea of Farniok excelling at guard, but it has to be better than keeping him at Right Turnstile.
     
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  11. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    Yes those stats are misleading. There are plenty of stats QBs that were not winners.
     
  12. hedonistimpulse

    hedonistimpulse Walk On
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    Are they QBs on bad teams?
    Or are they bad teams because of their QB?

    It's probably a mix of both depending on a given game, but none of the guys I listed stats for were bad QBs or on bad teams, except for 2AM, of course. I don't think he was a bad QB last year either. I do think the team overall might be classified that way, however.
     
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  13. John_J_Rambo

    John_J_Rambo Junior
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    I don't understand what you mean by misleading.

    do statistics only get recorded in wins?

    again, they are what they are. there is no such thing as 'reaching x completion % equals wins' or whatever.

    there's no Wins Above Replacement stat for college quarterbacks, so don't confuse them.
     
  14. headcard

    headcard Nebraska Legend
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    It's one player, that you are giving all the credit or blame to. So by your logic Craig Krenzel and Jay Barker were great college QB's because they won National Championships and Patrick Mahomes, RGIII and Drew Brees were not, because they didn't play on good teams...
     
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  15. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    Stats can be very misleading. How many yards were thrown after the game was decided or when trying to play catch up. Wins/Losses are a stat. Sure they are a team stat, but if you put Lamar Jackson behind our crappy center and lack of weapons and we still win more than 5 games.

    I get what AM2 supporters are saying. He's got upside. I saw that his freshman year. But I believe that this team should have won more than 4 games in 2018 and 5 in 2019. It's the most important position on the field. Winners know how to win. So far, AM2 has not found a way to win. I am still in support of AM2. But he's got to get it done on the scoreboard. Regardless of the program's rebuild.
     
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  16. Pennsyhusker

    Pennsyhusker Head Coach
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    There is a lot to be confused about with this team. If draft numbers are any indication we lacked NFL caliber talent on Frost’s first two teams. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have been more competitive. We lost to teams with lesser talent than we had. The fact is, and I hate to be one of those “guys”, we looked out-coached in some of those games. We just were rarely playing “in sync” on offense and often seemed to be struggling to cobble together anything consistent. I don’t think that is just a lack of talent. The play calling was often a real head scratcher with even TV announcers wondering out loud why we kept calling those horizontal passes into the flat. They rarely worked. I get that we were trying to get the ball quickly to our speed guys in open space, but the damn thing is, it wasn’t open space. Our perimeter blocking sucked and that play got blown up time after time. But we kept going to it. That isn’t talent. That’s a coaching decision and it was stupid. One wonders if Frost lacked confidence in our vertical passing game. Seems so.

    Our tight ends were overrated by all of us going into the season. Frost’s offense needs them and they weren’t there with any consistency. And we had talent at the wide receiver position. We did. But damn it wasn’t developed at all. Walters leaving is addition by subtraction. But hey... Frost brought him here so if Walters sucked that is at least partially on Frost.

    And don’t get me started on our defense. Ugh. The one place on the team where we had NFL talent ... on the line... and we still couldn’t stop the run or generate a pass rush. Were our linebackers really that awful athletically? No. They took horrible angles, missed tackles, and routinely shot the wrong gaps. That is, once again, coaching. Chinander talked a good game when he came here about being an aggressive defense. But instead what we saw was a reactive defense constantly playing on its heels.

    So AMart regressed for sure, but he had little help from anyone not named JD or Wandale.
     
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  17. otismotis08

    otismotis08 Assistant Head Coach
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    Not many positives in there, for sure. Bottom line is Frost is running out of excuses and really needs to deliver the goods soon. I'm sure he knows that...we'll see if he is able to do enough about it.
    For the long-term stability of this program, I sure hope he turns the corner this year. Quicksand is tough to get out of...
     
    57 otismotis08, May 19, 2020
    Last edited: May 19, 2020
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  18. husker2612

    husker2612 Graduate Assistant
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    My opinion. I think the kid has tons and tons of raw talent. I think in18 Frost and co just let him ball out and play. They admitted they limited play calls and the play book year 1. Last year everything was in play. I don't think that AM has the smarts to be able to handle all the added plays and the extra reads and decisions that were needed. I do agree the poor snaps and no WR options probably played a factor. What have we heard from Verduzco when talking about Mccaffrey, how smart he is and how quick he learned the play book. What about Smothers? How smart he is and quick he makes decisions. I could be wrong but had he every comment on AM and how smart he is? Seems like he speaks more of what an athlete he is.
     
  19. Red I 73

    Red I 73 Senior
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    How many times does it need to be pointed out, NEBRASKA won five? If you go to any site, newspaper or sports magazine that follows football, in the standings it is reported as Nebraska five wins. It doesn't say AM2 five wins. Blackshirts five wins. It says NEBRASKA five wins. The only sport where an individuals gets credit for wins/loses is a baseball pitcher.
     
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  20. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    This is on everyone, no doubt. But this thread is about AM2, not the team. He a bigger variable than every other position. We should have won more than 5 last year. It's just more on AM2 and HCSF than anyone else.

    And no, I don't have to share your enthusiasm for AM2. He's a 5 win QB until he proves otherwise. I hope that he moves the needle the other direction this year and overachieves (i.e. winning) and wins 9+. Here's to Adrian living up to his potential!
     
  21. mgbreis

    mgbreis Senior
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    Unfortunately, I really sincerely don't think we did. Maybe we lost to teams with equal talent.
     
  22. phoenix4nu

    phoenix4nu First Team All-Big Ten
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    I would say that is true with respect to Purdue. Especially when they put in their third string quarterback.
     
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  23. bigboxes

    bigboxes College Football Hall of Fame
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    [​IMG]
     
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  24. NikkiSixx

    NikkiSixx Graduate Assistant
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    Disagree completely. I am confident that the qb’s personal confidence issues bled over to the rest of the team, bringing the team down. Good QBs make the players around them better, not worse. Martinez has never been a tough guy. He’s always been soft. A finesse player, who can only play well when there is no pressure. When ever there is pressure, most games, he doesn’t nut up, the rest of the team sees it, knows it, and many actually don’t want to play for a guy like that.
    But this isn’t about the QB anymore in my opinion, it’s about the coach who let this happen to the team in the first place. Someone who claims to love the program more than any fan could, can’t seem to see what he has turned this program into in 2 short years.
     
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  25. Red I 73

    Red I 73 Senior
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    Who said I had enthusiasm for AM2? Everything I've said has been that the losses were more the result of the TEAM than one individual. I would say that if you wanted to pin the responsibility for the loss on any other member of the team.
     
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  26. PeliniTheCrutch

    PeliniTheCrutch First Team All-Big Ten
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    AMart is no good...needs a sack.
     
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  27. John_J_Rambo

    John_J_Rambo Junior
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    yea, we know.
     
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  28. timnsun

    timnsun Offensive Coordinator
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    This is some first class trolling! Well done!
     
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  29. skull N crossbones

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    I'm not saying he was responsible for all our losses and I'm certainly not an Amart hater but everyone seems to be overlooking the terrible decision making and horrible throws. I expect more out of a qb who has been a 2 year starter and started the majority of the games the last 2 years. He clearly has the physical tools. I'm not sold he has decision making. As for the comment below about a ton of film on him- it's 2020, everyone has a ton of film on them.
     
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  30. huskerfan66

    huskerfan66 Assistant Head Coach
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    Very true. Any good coach should pick up on that. That said, a good coach would know that as well plus know if an undisclosed injury. Our backups must have really been bad.
     
  31. timnsun

    timnsun Offensive Coordinator
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    If he’s the same guy he was last year, then I think you may be right about his decision making.
     
  32. headcard

    headcard Nebraska Legend
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    They also played and got injured.
     
  33. phoenix4nu

    phoenix4nu First Team All-Big Ten
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    Well at least you are concise.
     
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  34. skull N crossbones

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    You specifically brought up Colorado. I was begging for him to make a play and stop the bleeding. Didn't happen. Obviously our D didn't either but I was hoping the Heisman watchlist qb would step up.
     
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  35. salsa red

    salsa red Newbie
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    I think Martinez bought into the hype about him and that made him lazy and fat last year. The year before he was in a battle with Gebbia and I think that brought out his best. What we've heard about McCaffrey is that his family works hard and knows what it takes to be a great athlete. I think Luke brings out the best in Martinez and we see a huge improvement in QB play this year, regardless of who the QB is.
    Also having some weapons in Manning and Betts will help along with a more experienced O line.
    I'm hoping for once we exceed expecations and ball out this fall. Some payback is due to many teams we've played lately.
     
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  36. SkerInCo

    SkerInCo Blackshirt
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    Or 2 minutes left in the Iowa game. 2 or 3 first downs, FG, ballgame.
     
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  37. bshirt73

    bshirt73 Senior
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    Exactly! I just don't get why that's such a viciously difficult factor to grasp.
     
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  38. spinner4

    spinner4 All-American
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    AM played two years with a terrible WR core. JD was good but I think fans give him more credit then he deserves. Too many times he didn’t come up with a big play late in the game like excellent WRs due. Maybe he had too much weight to carry. But really really good ones can carry it. Again, I think he’s good but not excellent.

    With addition of Manning and Betts that puts much needed size and Skill on the field, combined with Robinson will create mismatches and will make life much easier on AM. And the depth behind those 3 is much better then any year AM has been here. We got faster and bigger at WR.

    Mills is someone we don’t really need to worry about. The only thing we have to worry about is can he be a workhorse or does he need a buddy? If he can only carry the rock at a max 18 times a game and there are times he can’t play on critical positions because he’s wore out, then we may have a problem. But that’s when we need a young back to come in and aid him for 8 to 10 carries a game. We haven’t had that in a while and I’m not sure we have that now. We may. That rooms slowly building.

    and TE isn’t going to be an issue either. Hickman is going to bring a different kind of player to that spot. Most of you will just say he’s a WR. But keep in mind he’s actually a solid blocker and though he’s lean, he can play the TE roll that many run today.

    Stoll is also still there. His year last year wasn’t awful as many people act. There were times where you thought last year he could take over a game and would just disappear. A lot of the time he couldn’t get off of the line, in to help block and also just not strong enough. If he made strides in the weight room he could be a potential threat.

    and lastly and may be the most important thing AM has is 5 starting lineman returning. All may not start this year. 1 or 2 may not. But 3 will and those other 2 will help depth. Which is another area are depth has been bad. There’s a lot of togetherness and accountability on that line.

    AM has a lot to be happy about in 2020. He’s got no excuses and if he didn’t succeed, I’m sure we have someone who will. We have two solid backups. Luke’s game proven. Logan isn’t.

    how our offense is coming together isn’t what I’m worried about at all
     
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  39. bshirt73

    bshirt73 Senior
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    Damn fine post sir. You can bet the ranch that an improved OLine so desperately needed should be a big, BIG asset for AMart or anyone else.
     
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  40. Jhollenbeck41

    Jhollenbeck41 Sophomore
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    We winning more than 5 games with you at head coach and Ben Afleck at QB?
     
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